Luhnow and Hinch Suspensions

[Carlos Danger]

Is a linebacker knowing what play an offense is calling cheating?

 

Depends how... If they studied the offense and picked up tells or a pattern in the QBs, or knew that if a half back sets up in a certain way it is play X... Same as guy on 2nd IMO.. The the use of the tech is the issue at hand IMO..

[Spanky99]

Relevant and interesting fun read...

 

STOLEN AWAY: BROOKLYN PITCHER RECALLS '51 SIGN-STEALING SCAM

 

Jan 16, 2020 , By BEN WALKER

NEW YORK (AP) Stealing signals. Banging on a trash can. Beating the Dodgers in October.

 

Sounds very familiar to Carl Erskine.

 

"If they're going to go back to 2017 with penalties for the Astros," he said Wednesday, "then I want them to go all the way back to 1951 to help us."

 

The old Brooklyn pitcher was laughing. Sort of.

 

Now 93, Erskine vividly recalled what - until this week - had been the biggest sign-stealing scandal in baseball history.

 

Up by 13 1/2 games in mid-August, Jackie Robinson and the Dodgers seemed destined. That was until rookie Willie Mays and the New York Giants came flying back, fueled by an incredible, late run in home games at the Polo Grounds, and forced a best-of-three playoff for the National League pennant.

 

Erskine was warming up in the Brooklyn bullpen in Game 3 when Bobby Thomson connected for the famed "Shot Heard 'Round the World," a three-run homer in the bottom of the ninth off Ralph Branca that rallied the Giants to a 5-4 win.

 

A half-century later, a giant secret was revealed: The Giants had rigged a spyglass-and-buzzer system in late July to steal catchers' signals and tip off their hitters.

 

"We thought something was going on, we were suspicious, but we couldn't prove anything," Erskine said from his home in Anderson, Indiana. "I remember Ralph said to me, 'I bet those dirty birds are cheating."'

 

Herman Franks, a former Dodger who had become a Giants coach, was stationed in the home clubhouse, above the 483-foot mark in center field. From a darkened window, he spied on catchers with a telescope, then relayed the signs.

 

When a buzzer rang in the New York bullpen - conveniently located in play back then, in deep right-center field - a Giants player who might waggle a white towel would signal to the hitter what kind of pitch was coming.

 

"A batter wouldn't even have to move his head," Erskine said. "It was right over the pitcher's left shoulder. Just shift your eyes to about 2 o'clock and you'd see it."

 

Several years after the scheme came to light, Erskine saw an obituary for Franks.

 

"I emailed Ralph and said to him: 'Old Giants never die, they just steal away,"' Erskine said.

 

Popularly known as "Oisk" by Brooklyn fans of "The Boys of Summer," Erskine made his big league debut in 1948 and spent all 12 years of his career with the Dodgers, finishing with Los Angeles. The right-hander was 16-12 in 1951 and went 122-78 overall with two no-hitters. He went to the World Series five times.

 

Erskine said he's read some about the Astros' scam, how they swiped signs from a video feed in center field and clanged a trash can to alert hitters to what pitch was coming. Houston closed out 2017 by beating the Dodgers in the World Series.

 

"You mean in this high-tech world they had to revert to that?" he said, chuckling. "In the commissioner's mind, it's probably a lot of garbage he wished had never happened."

 

Not that Erskine and the Dodgers didn't try things in their day.

 

"TV was still new in my era, in the early 1950s. We had a television in our clubhouse at Ebbets Field and when the opposing catcher or coach or manager would go to the mound, we'd try to read lips, to see what he was saying to the pitcher," Erskine said.

 

"Just fishing for anything. Pretty spotty results," he said. "But I guess it was a preliminary for what was to come later."

[AdamGreenwood]

What if you keep your best RP out of games you didn't bet on so he's 'fresh' for games you are betting on? What if you sit your star in games you aren't betting on so he's 'fresh' for the game you are betting on?

 

What if you use tomorrow's starter to close out a meaningless game, because you have a lot of money on it.

[G-Snarls]

There could be a few teams scrambling for a manager on short notice. Maybe Gibby gets a shot at one of the jobs. Baseball really could use more John Gibbons quotes.

 

Gibby is being interviewed for the job

[Brownie19]

Are we going to see another spike in strikeouts this year if all the teams who are stealing signs no longer do this season?

[Dr. Dinger]

Beltran out of a job now too.

[Carlos Danger]

Beltran out of a job now too.

 

Wow, this will go down in baseball history as Black January or the New Years Massacre or something... Three major teams searching for a NEW manager on Jan 16th..

[onwego]

Beltran must have had third and fourth thoughts about taking on this Mets job anyways.

[Carlos Danger]

Beltran must have had third and fourth thoughts about taking on this Mets job anyways.

 

Why? The Mets are trying to compete now, you are a MLB manager in New York City... Doubt he had any doubts...

[onwego]

Why? The Mets are trying to compete now, you are a MLB manager in New York City... Doubt he had any doubts...

 

 

You are in danger of maybe coming across something ironic? This is a Canadian board... :/

 

 

 

The Mets are trying to compete now. That's a new and bright attitude for the team.

[Carlos Danger]

You are in danger of maybe coming across something ironic? This is a Canadian board... :/

 

 

 

The Mets are trying to compete now. That's a new and bright attitude for the team.

 

You lost me? I don't get it...?

[Terminator]

 

So the latest rumor is that Altuve and others were wearing devices under the jerseys and near their shoulders which would alert them to what pitches were being thrown. Rosenthal asked him about what was up with him and his jersey and Altuve's answer didn't make much sense.

[max silver]

 

So the latest rumor is that Altuve and others were wearing devices under the jerseys and near their shoulders which would alert them to what pitches were being thrown. Rosenthal asked him about what was up with him and his jersey and Altuve's answer didn't make much sense.

 

In this video it actually appears as though there is something moving around under the patch on his left shoulder...

[Brownie19]

In this video it actually appears as though there is something moving around under the patch on his left shoulder...

 

Looks to me like his arm band is up against the patch, which is stiff.

[Bobthe4th]

Haha this should be amazing:

 

[Bobthe4th]

Beltran out of a job now too.

 

 

"Doing things the right way" "pride in being a leader" "integrity" "not who I am"

 

f*** off Carlos, the report implicated you more than any other player:

 

"Approximately two months into the 2017 season, a group of players, including Carlos Beltrán, discussed that the team could improve on decoding opposing teams’ signs and communicating the signs to the batter. Cora arranged for a video room technician to install a monitor displaying the center field camera feed immediately outside of the Astros’ dugout."

[Bobthe4th]

[Dr. Dinger]

Lol man of faith

 

Probably couldn’t catch up to a heater anymore, no wonder he was driving the scheme.

[Beans]

Spygate has come to MLB, and the Houston Astros are officially the New England Patriots of baseball.

[TheHurl]

and MLB's full report. Sorry if this is already posted.

 

https://img.mlbstatic.com/mlb-images/image/upload/mlb/cglrhmlrwwbkacty27l7.pdf?fbclid=IwAR3jUGf611LZpzjDaZ4w49N8DkxnNn6H0hQq4H6zXSrtElZNJvsIW6I1OzY

[Beans]

and MLB's full report. Sorry if this is already posted.

 

https://img.mlbstatic.com/mlb-images/image/upload/mlb/cglrhmlrwwbkacty27l7.pdf?fbclid=IwAR3jUGf611LZpzjDaZ4w49N8DkxnNn6H0hQq4H6zXSrtElZNJvsIW6I1OzY

Did the Astros not think this would eventually get out when players left the team…? Did they just not even care? So confused.

[DigitalRock]

Altuve is lying through his teeth....He is yelling for teammates to not rip off his jersey in one of the biggest moments of his life, because he is too shy, and his wife got mad? Two different things. That makes zero sense. Baseball may not have found enough evidence but something is wrong here. He then runs off the field , and changes. gets interviews and his answer why he changed his shirt is bizarre, including a nervous laugh.....sure Ok Altuve. Clearly hiding something... Baseball is incompetent if they are just saying "There is no evidence".

 

Altuve's instagram is full of shirtless pics lol.

Edited January 17, 2020 by DigitalRock

[Brownie19]

Altuve is lying through his teeth....He is yelling for teammates to not rip off his jersey in one of the biggest moments of his life, because he is too shy, and his wife got mad? Two different things. That makes zero sense. Baseball may not have found enough evidence but something is wrong here. He then runs off the field , and changes. gets interviews and his answer why he changed his shirt is bizarre, including a nervous laugh.....sure Ok Altuve. Clearly hiding something... Baseball is incompetent if they are just saying "There is no evidence".

 

Altuve's instagram is full of shirtless pics lol.

 

f*** man, you can't even keep the facts straight, but you know exactly what happened right? He didn't answer why he went and put on the division champions t-shirt (that all his other teammates had already changed into).

[Spanky99]

f*** man, you can't even keep the facts straight, but you know exactly what happened right? He didn't answer why he went and put on the division champions t-shirt (that all his other teammates had already changed into).

 

I was going to say something, decided not to, far too many assumptions as well.

[Brownie19]

Altuve is lying through his teeth....He is yelling for teammates to not rip off his jersey in one of the biggest moments of his life, because he is too shy, and his wife got mad? Two different things. That makes zero sense. Baseball may not have found enough evidence but something is wrong here. He then runs off the field , and changes. gets interviews and his answer why he changed his shirt is bizarre, including a nervous laugh.....sure Ok Altuve. Clearly hiding something... Baseball is incompetent if they are just saying "There is no evidence".

 

Altuve's instagram is full of shirtless pics lol.

 

I find it fascinating how much people choose to read into stuff. I mean for me - Altuve's simply doing something playful at home plate with his teammates after one of the biggest moments of his life. It reminds me of how Adrian Beltre didn't want teammates to touch his helmet. I mean these guys see and are involved with the walk off celebrations throughout their careers and it's not unreasonable to think Altuve may have thought about how he'd react in that moment the next time he hit a walkoff (I believe these guys do visualization stuff regularly). Similar to how football players have planned TD celebrations. In one of the biggest moments of his life - it is reasonable to think he'd remember something he'd planned? or would the mind go blank in excitement? I don't know the answer to that and suggest only a fool would think they do.

 

Also - in this scenario (where he has to warn his teammates not to rip off his jersey), you'd have to assume that either his teammates didn't know about it, or that he didn't wear it all the time (perhaps only in certain situations). If they wore it all year long, then surely the team would be well aware and know not to rip his jersey off. I guess either of those could be true. Personally, I have no idea if he did, or didn't and won't generate a firm opinion or view without more evidence (has their been any evidence? or right, there isn't).

[Spanky99]

I find it fascinating how much people choose to read into stuff. I mean for me - Altuve's simply doing something playful at home plate with his teammates after one of the biggest moments of his life. It reminds me of how Adrian Beltre didn't want teammates to touch his helmet. I mean these guys see and are involved with the walk off celebrations throughout their careers and it's not unreasonable to think Altuve may have thought about how he'd react in that moment the next time he hit a walkoff (I believe these guys do visualization stuff regularly). Similar to how football players have planned TD celebrations. In one of the biggest moments of his life - it is reasonable to think he'd remember something he'd planned? or would the mind go blank in excitement? I don't know the answer to that and suggest only a fool would think they do.

 

Also - in this scenario (where he has to warn his teammates not to rip off his jersey), you'd have to assume that either his teammates didn't know about it, or that he didn't wear it all the time (perhaps only in certain situations). If they wore it all year long, then surely the team would be well aware and know not to rip his jersey off. I guess either of those could be true. Personally, I have no idea if he did, or didn't and won't generate a firm opinion or view without more evidence (has their been any evidence? or right, there isn't).

 

PIST!!! cf

[Brownie19]

PIST!!! cf

 

???

[Captain Adama]

Did the Astros not think this would eventually get out when players left the team…? Did they just not even care? So confused.

 

Probably felt more like, win now. No one will say anything, given MLB's track record of slap-on-the-wrist punishments. Even if there was a whistle blower, they were probably prepared to deal with consequences.

[Brownie19]

Probably felt more like, win now. No one will say anything, given MLB's track record of slap-on-the-wrist punishments. Even if there was a whistle blower, they were probably prepared to deal with consequences.

 

The decision may also have been influenced by their knowledge or suspicion that other teams were also doing this. I mean if you're the only team doing this, that's one thing, but if you know 7 or 8 other teams are already, then you're probably more likely to make the conscience decision to do it.

[Beans]

I find it fascinating how much people choose to read into stuff. I mean for me - Altuve's simply doing something playful at home plate with his teammates after one of the biggest moments of his life. It reminds me of how Adrian Beltre didn't want teammates to touch his helmet. I mean these guys see and are involved with the walk off celebrations throughout their careers and it's not unreasonable to think Altuve may have thought about how he'd react in that moment the next time he hit a walkoff (I believe these guys do visualization stuff regularly). Similar to how football players have planned TD celebrations. In one of the biggest moments of his life - it is reasonable to think he'd remember something he'd planned? or would the mind go blank in excitement? I don't know the answer to that and suggest only a fool would think they do.

 

Also - in this scenario (where he has to warn his teammates not to rip off his jersey), you'd have to assume that either his teammates didn't know about it, or that he didn't wear it all the time (perhaps only in certain situations). If they wore it all year long, then surely the team would be well aware and know not to rip his jersey off. I guess either of those could be true. Personally, I have no idea if he did, or didn't and won't generate a firm opinion or view without more evidence (has their been any evidence? or right, there isn't).

100%

 

This is turning an already wild controversy into a full-blown conspiracy theory.

 

And all because Twitter did what Twitter does best, finding photo and video evidence that could suggest the presence of those buzzers, generating enough noise that MLB felt compelled to respond, saying it "found no evidence" of wearable devices during its investigation.

 

These buzzer rumours aren't supported by actual evidence, so don't mislead yourselves into thinking they're anything more than internet rumblings.