Shartkins concerned with Tulo & Martin

[gbill2004]

@JonHeyman: jays higherups are concerned about tulo (.167) and martin (.149, 32 K's in 67 AB), their 2 best-paid players

[ValiantJaysFan]

Tulo has a no trade clause right?

[Statman]

Tulo has a no trade clause right?

 

Yeah. It kicked in I believe once he got traded.

[nextyear]

@JonHeyman: jays higherups are concerned about tulo (.167) and martin (.149, 32 K's in 67 AB), their 2 best-paid players

 

Have there been examples of players going from productive hitters to unproductive hitters almost overnight who haven't rebounded?

 

This might seem farfetched but maybe once the weather warms up and more games are played outdoors then they will perform better. I am just grasping at straws here, but some fresh air games might help.

[Statman]

@JonHeyman: jays higherups are concerned about tulo (.167) and martin (.149, 32 K's in 67 AB), their 2 best-paid players

 

To me it seems IMO Tulo's problem is more that he too stubborn to make adjustments and there is some mental issues being on a new team. I don't think he has been used to ever struggling in his life and he has trouble handling it. Being traded and not being told by management seems to also have taken a toll on him mentally.

 

Martin IMO I think is a more physical thing that is attributed to his decline.

[Governator]

Have there been examples of players going from productive hitters to unproductive hitters almost overnight who haven't rebounded?

 

This might seem farfetched but maybe once the weather warms up and more games are played outdoors then they will perform better. I am just grasping at straws here, but some fresh air games might help.

 

Some don't rebound all year, though they have bounced back a year later. Guys like Chris Davis, Matt Kemp.

[nextyear]

Just out of curiousity, do teams arrange eye examinations for players? Maybe some of the Blue Jays need glasses. I see that Brett Lawrie wears glasses now that he is with the White Sox.

 

The reason I wonder is because it seems like Martin and Tulowitzki keep swinging and missing.

[BTS]

Have there been examples of players going from productive hitters to unproductive hitters almost overnight who haven't rebounded?

 

This might seem farfetched but maybe once the weather warms up and more games are played outdoors then they will perform better. I am just grasping at straws here, but some fresh air games might help.

 

Billy Butler, Hanley Ramirez, Pablo Sandoval, Chase Headley, Jacoby Ellsbury, Adam LaRoche, Allen Craig, Albert Pujols, Carlos Gomez, Jayson Werth etc...

[RealAccountant]

This sort of news unless made up should never leave management

[Brownie19]

Have there been examples of players going from productive hitters to unproductive hitters almost overnight who haven't rebounded?

 

This might seem farfetched but maybe once the weather warms up and more games are played outdoors then they will perform better. I am just grasping at straws here, but some fresh air games might help.

 

Skatkins is very familiar with 2 - Bourn & Swisher.

 

Speaking of which, Bourn and Swisher would be two candidates for players who were on PEDs - landed the big contract and then stopped taking them (risk was no longer worth the reward).

[Praxis]

The problem is, what really are our options with these two? Tulo may agree to a trade as he's never really looked comfortable since arriving here, but who would take Martin right now with his albatross of a contract? And good luck going to Rogers and suggesting a buy out; those f***ing *******s would probably charge you $300 an hour just for the privilege of having a meeting.

 

The truth is the best the organization can do for now is just try to let them work themselves out of the hole they're in, although I suppose in theory just about any contract is movable (e.g. Wells).

[BTS]

The problem is, what really are our options with these two? Tulo may agree to a trade as he's never really looked comfortable since arriving here, but who would take Martin right now with his albatross of a contract? And good luck going to Rogers and suggesting a buy out; those f***ing *******s would probably charge you $300 an hour for the privilege of having a meeting.

 

The truth is the best the organization can do for now is just try to let them work themselves out of a hole, although I suppose in theory just about any contract is movable (e.g. Wells).

 

If Tulo can come in around 2 wins, they might be able to move him in the offseason while eating a bit of cash. They're probably stuck with Martin through the end of his contract.

[AdamGreenwood]

Tulo has a no trade clause right?

 

Oh too bad. Lot of teams would like a .450 OPS shortstop for only $20 million a season.

[RealAccountant]

Skatkins is very familiar with 2 - Bourn & Swisher.

 

Speaking of which, Bourn and Swisher would be two candidates for players who were on PEDs - landed the big contract and then stopped taking them (risk was no longer worth the reward).

 

Bourn and Swisher are not in Tulo or Martin's category

[RealAccountant]

Tulo needs to go back to 6th in the order. He has been trying to pull everything.

[Governator]

Tulo needs to go back to 6th in the order. He has been trying to pull everything.

 

That should fix everything.

[HERPDERP]

Tulo needs to go back to 6th in the order. He has been trying to pull everything.

 

have you been watching Tulo at all this season? His problem isn't him being pull happy

 

He either doesn't swing at obvious strikes or he completely misses them. Lowest contact % of his career.

 

Obvious regression in his skillset + looking completely lost at the plate

[flafson]

Tulo needs to go back to 6th in the order. He has been trying to pull everything.

 

So you would have Pillar or Smoak hitting 5th?

[Brownie19]

Bourn and Swisher are not in Tulo or Martin's category

 

Incorrect. Bourn was coming off a 6.2 WAR season when he signed with the Indians. That's better than Tulo's ever put up. Swisher average 3.9 WAR/year in the 3 years prior to signing with the Indians. Martin averaged 3.7 WAR prior to signing with the Jays.

 

I love math.

[RealAccountant]

So you would have Pillar or Smoak hitting 5th?

 

Smoak hit well at no5 last year yes.

[Boxcar]

The Dogg still getting bites. 2016 might be his best trolling year yet.

[RealAccountant]

I've gone legit bud. You should unignore me. I don't do that trolling stuff anymore.

[Governator]

Incorrect. Bourn was coming off a 6.2 WAR season when he signed with the Indians. That's better than Tulo's ever put up. Swisher average 3.9 WAR/year in the 3 years prior to signing with the Indians. Martin averaged 3.7 WAR prior to signing with the Jays.

 

I love math.

 

 

Martin + Tulo = 22 years, 67.9 fwar

Bourn + SWisher = 22 years, 47.8 fwar

 

Regardless, Brownie's comparison is very relevant. The question was simply about hitters going from being productive to unproductive and there's a long list of players who have declined steeply.

[BTS]

I've gone legit bud. You should unignore me. I don't do that trolling stuff anymore.

 

And... banned.

[baseballsss]

And... banned.

 

Why did he get banned?

[Terminator]

Yeah what did he do? He doesn't appear to have trolled in a while to me.

[KingKat]

I don't think he did anything. Seems like the mod in question just got tired of him. Maybe there's some history there that I'm not aware of.

[burlingtonbandit]

To me it seems IMO Tulo's problem is more that he too stubborn to make adjustments and there is some mental issues being on a new team. I don't think he has been used to ever struggling in his life and he has trouble handling it. Being traded and not being told by management seems to also have taken a toll on him mentally.

 

Martin IMO I think is a more physical thing that is attributed to his decline.

 

I find this narrative BS. He's been great defensively since the trade so its not like a trade would cause him to struggle at only one part of his game. Loss of bat speed and/or loss of pitch recognition looks like the main reasons.

[glory]

You could probably find a taker for Tulo, but no one is going to take a catcher in his 30's making $20m a year until age 35. Jays are probably stuck with Martin.

[TheHurl]

Wasn't me but sometimes you just got to smack kids around in case they were thinking about doing something wrong. This might be the case here. Looks like it's just a 1 day. Maybe he'll find a new hobby...like gutting mods and wearing their skin. Oh wait that's the same as the old hobby.