Official MiLB/Prospects Thread

[P2F]

DL Hall pitched an absolute gem today at AAA:

 

6 IP, 3 H, 1 R, 2 BB, 14 K

 

98 pitches, 68 were for strikes. He struck out the final 6 batters he faced, and 8 of the last 9.

[Olerud363]

Oh man, I was really hoping for Veen.

 

I recall everyone being excited about Austin Martin, but this is why anybody who is not Grant should acknowledge the Red Sox are a great, great organization.

 

Red Sox turned one tank year and their fourth pick into Marcelo Mayer, we turned our 5th into Jose Berrios on a 130 million dollar deal.

 

It could have been Veen. That's likely the pick a real good organization makes even if it's not the concensus (kind of like Raptors and Scottie Barnes).

 

Red Sox - Tank, get Mayer, beat Blue Jays out of Playoff spot next near, while setting themselves up to beat Blue Jays out of play-off spot during the Mayer years, 2023-2029.

[Krylian]

Oh man, I was really hoping for Veen.

 

Same. Then I got seduced by Martin sliding and thought it was a gift from heaven. I guess it wasn't.

[John_Havok]

DL Hall pitched an absolute gem today at AAA:

 

6 IP, 3 H, 1 R, 2 BB, 14 K

 

98 pitches, 68 were for strikes. He struck out the final 6 batters he faced, and 8 of the last 9.

 

I love a pitcher with the name of DL.

[Krylian]

I love a pitcher with the name of DL.

 

Dirty Lefty

[Brownie19]

I recall everyone being excited about Austin Martin, but this is why anybody who is not Grant should acknowledge the Red Sox are a great, great organization.

 

Red Sox turned one tank year and their fourth pick into Marcelo Mayer, we turned our 5th into Jose Berrios on a 130 million dollar deal.

 

It could have been Veen. That's likely the pick a real good organization makes even if it's not the concensus (kind of like Raptors and Scottie Barnes).

 

Red Sox - Tank, get Mayer, beat Blue Jays out of Playoff spot next near, while setting themselves up to beat Blue Jays out of play-off spot during the Mayer years, 2023-2029.

 

To be fair...Mayer was a lot like Martin. He was projected to go 1st overall and then fell to 4th, right into the Red Sox lap. The Red Sox didn't go 'off the board' to get him like the Jays would have done if they took Veen over Martin.

 

That said - turning the 5th overall pick into a $130M pitcher (who's been awful so far) certainly looks like terrible value. I guess it becomes a necessity when we have issues attracting FA's (or if you consider top players often don't make it to free agency).

[Benito]

To be fair...Mayer was a lot like Martin. He was projected to go 1st overall and then fell to 4th, right into the Red Sox lap. The Red Sox didn't go 'off the board' to get him like the Jays would have done if they took Veen over Martin.

 

That said - turning the 5th overall pick into a $130M pitcher (who's been awful so far) certainly looks like terrible value. I guess it becomes a necessity when we have issues attracting FA's (or if you consider top players often don't make it to free agency).

 

Berrios contract is fine. Starting pitching is expensive, and he's been consistently a 3-4 war pitcher with clean health history and in his prime years. This year is a mystery and an outlier based on his track record. There's a chance it does end up returning poor value over the length of the contract, but too early to make that statement.

[Brownie19]

Berrios contract is fine. Starting pitching is expensive, and he's been consistently a 3-4 war pitcher with clean health history and in his prime years. This year is a mystery and an outlier based on his track record. There's a chance it does end up returning poor value over the length of the contract, but too early to make that statement.

 

I'm just saying the preferred route is to simply sign him as a FA to the deal and keep the 5th overall pick. Having to give up the 5th overall pick AND give a SPer a massive contract just blows goats really.

[Benito]

I see your point. For sure it's always preferable to sign FAs than trade prospect capital, but Berrios did help us come close to a playoff spot last year. And having a roster capable of making the playoffs, helps to attract FAs. Maybe Gausman doesn't sign with the Jays if Berrios wasn't on the team for example.

 

As it turns out, it might be one of those cases where Atkins sold high as I think both SWR and Martin have dropped out of the top 100 lists.

[Dagagad]

Gabriel Martinez is back from injury and homered and doubled first game back today.

 

Dasan Brown.. probably striking out too much but hitting pretty well. Is also apparently a no doubt CF.

[Blazeit420]

Orelvis with 2 HR's tonight. Up to 19 on the year in 248 AB's. Took him 283 AB's to reach 19 in Dunedin last year.

[John_Havok]

Orelvis with 2 HR's tonight. Up to 19 on the year in 248 AB's. Took him 283 AB's to reach 19 in Dunedin last year.

 

Gotta reign in those strikeouts though. Power is legit, swing-happy with very few walks….not so good

[Daniel Labude]

Gotta reign in those strikeouts though. Power is legit, swing-happy with very few walks….not so good

 

If he continues walking at his pace for the last two months, but did it the whole season of AA he would have essentially the same amount of walks as Bo in AA

[Daniel Labude]

 

[Solaxys]

Anyone excited about Horwitz? Think the Jays will see if he can play another position 'cause he is blocked by Vladdy (maybe 1B/DH rotation).

I know they are testing him at 2B and LF but he doesn't really bring defense or speed.

LHB, raking through minors, just promoted to AAA and has 2 doubles already in 2 games.

Scorched through A/A+/AA in 2 yrs; posted a 0.930 OPS with a 18% walk rate, 22% K rate in AA

 

Really hope we don't trade him if he continues this offense - need them good contact/approach LHBs.

[Olerud363]

I see your point. For sure it's always preferable to sign FAs than trade prospect capital, but Berrios did help us come close to a playoff spot last year. And having a roster capable of making the playoffs, helps to attract FAs. Maybe Gausman doesn't sign with the Jays if Berrios wasn't on the team for example.

 

As it turns out, it might be one of those cases where Atkins sold high as I think both SWR and Martin have dropped out of the top 100 lists.

 

Totally agree he traded Martin high. However my point was that the Red Sox got much better value with their top 5 pick then the Jays did. Could be some luck as the draft is a crap shoot. It would have been nice to see the Jays get a true top 10 prospect with the top 5 pick and have developed a different top 50 prospect for trading. Would be nice but so would lots of things. Like I said it could be luck, or it could be something lacking in the draft process, and they weren't prepared when Martin dropped and hadn't done enough research into him, to see things that other teams may have that made him drop.

 

As a 30 year Jays fan it seems like history is repeating. Last time the Jays had a 60 something win season and top 5 pick they chose Ricky Romero over Tulu.

[gruber92]

Anyone excited about Horwitz? Think the Jays will see if he can play another position 'cause he is blocked by Vladdy (maybe 1B/DH rotation).

I know they are testing him at 2B and LF but he doesn't really bring defense or speed.

LHB, raking through minors, just promoted to AAA and has 2 doubles already in 2 games.

Scorched through A/A+/AA in 2 yrs; posted a 0.930 OPS with a 18% walk rate, 22% K rate in AA

 

Really hope we don't trade him if he continues this offense - need them good contact/approach LHBs.

 

He'll be traded for a RP bounce back candidate who will be hovering in AAA mediocrity while Horowitz will be an .800+ OPS platoon player for someone else. Outside of acquiring Teo and Berrios, what other trades has Ross made where we got surplus or even equal value in his seventh year? Although the Berrios trade is looking half decent, the book isn't out on that one yet.

[Olerud363]

Anyone excited about Horwitz? Think the Jays will see if he can play another position 'cause he is blocked by Vladdy (maybe 1B/DH rotation).

I know they are testing him at 2B and LF but he doesn't really bring defense or speed.

LHB, raking through minors, just promoted to AAA and has 2 doubles already in 2 games.

Scorched through A/A+/AA in 2 yrs; posted a 0.930 OPS with a 18% walk rate, 22% K rate in AA

 

Really hope we don't trade him if he continues this offense - need them good contact/approach LHBs.

 

 

I like this guy. Seems like a Lyle Overbay, Frank Cat type, if he can play a little second and outfield could easily get 120 platoon games and would be an improvement over Tapia, and you could keep Biggio and the DH rotations.

 

Maybe have Biggio play a little center to make room when Springer has an off day. It's not perfect but Horwitz in there somewhere and Biggio in center is better than Tapia in center? Isn't it?

[Olerud363]

He'll be traded for a RP bounce back candidate who will be hovering in AAA mediocrity while Horowitz will be an .800+ OPS platoon player for someone else. Outside of acquiring Teo and Berrios, what other trades has Ross made where we got surplus or even equal value in his seventh year? Although the Berrios trade is looking half decent, the book isn't out on that one yet.

 

Hope not. He's older than Kirk obviously but minor league numbers are similar. Also have to consider the missing season delayed him a year... thus partly why he is doing this at 24 instead of 23.

 

Compare him to Biggio at the same age. He hasn't tasted the majors yet (which Biggio did at 24) but much more consistent and lower strike out rate, higher average. Interested to see how it translates to the majors. Maybe he will be the next Matt Carpenter. (as a hitter) Yankees get old Matt Carpenter, Jays get a young one. That would be nice.

[Olerud363]

Hope not. He's older than Kirk obviously but minor league numbers are similar. Also have to consider the missing season delayed him a year... thus partly why he is doing this at 24 instead of 23.

 

Compare him to Biggio at the same age. He hasn't tasted the majors yet (which Biggio did at 24) but much more consistent and lower strike out rate, higher average. Interested to see how it translates to the majors. Maybe he will be the next Matt Carpenter. (as a hitter) Yankees get old Matt Carpenter, Jays get a young one. That would be nice.

 

After checking his minor league numbers are very comparable to Carpenter and Lyle Overbay (with the assumption Overbay's stats were boosted by high elevation Western milb parks).

 

All guys who got late starts on their minor league careers for some reason.

 

Of course I don't remember the other guys who were comparable in the minors but never did anything in the majors.

 

#statsscouting

[The Cats Ass]

He'll be traded for a RP bounce back candidate who will be hovering in AAA mediocrity while Horowitz will be an .800+ OPS platoon player for someone else. Outside of acquiring Teo and Berrios, what other trades has Ross made where we got surplus or even equal value in his seventh year? Although the Berrios trade is looking half decent, the book isn't out on that one yet.

 

Is the book ever really out on any deal?

 

Ones that come to mind over the past couple years.

 

Robbie Ray trade

Tapia + Prospect for Grichuk

Taijuan Walker deal

Adam Cimber deal

Santiago Espinal

[Dagagad]

Anyone excited about Horwitz? Think the Jays will see if he can play another position 'cause he is blocked by Vladdy (maybe 1B/DH rotation).

I know they are testing him at 2B and LF but he doesn't really bring defense or speed.

LHB, raking through minors, just promoted to AAA and has 2 doubles already in 2 games.

Scorched through A/A+/AA in 2 yrs; posted a 0.930 OPS with a 18% walk rate, 22% K rate in AA

 

Really hope we don't trade him if he continues this offense - need them good contact/approach LHBs.

 

If he can play corner outfield, I wouldn’t trade him if I think he can contribute. That would be handy to have with teo only having one year left.

[RustyTrombone]

Zulu and Tiedemann gonna rep the Jays at the futures game. Definitely gonna be a must watch if those two pitch.

[Orgfiller]

Is the book ever really out on any deal?

 

Ones that come to mind over the past couple years.

 

Robbie Ray trade

Tapia + Prospect for Grichuk

Taijuan Walker deal

Adam Cimber deal

Santiago Espinal

 

The Stripling for Kendall Williams + Ryan Noda deal is looking pretty good. Strip has been a godsend eating up valuable innings effectively and Williams hasn't exactly been tearing it up in the low minors.

[John_Havok]

Anyone excited about Horwitz? Think the Jays will see if he can play another position 'cause he is blocked by Vladdy (maybe 1B/DH rotation).

I know they are testing him at 2B and LF but he doesn't really bring defense or speed.

LHB, raking through minors, just promoted to AAA and has 2 doubles already in 2 games.

Scorched through A/A+/AA in 2 yrs; posted a 0.930 OPS with a 18% walk rate, 22% K rate in AA

 

Really hope we don't trade him if he continues this offense - need them good contact/approach LHBs.

 

 

How did you arrive at the conclusion they've been testing him at 2b? Was it the 2 games he played there in 2019, or the 1 game he played there last year? or the 0 games he's played there this year? He's had exactly 6 balls hit to him at 2b in his minor league carrer and made an error on one of them. He's not being tested at 2b.

 

LF. Ok. they've been giving him some looks out there but its like 80% 1B, and the rest split between LF and DH, with 16 games at DH and only 10 in LF. That doesnt give me much confidence in his defensive ability to play the OF - moreso like a "we'll stick him out there if we really get in a jam and pray nobody hits the ball there" kind of scenario.

 

Dude can hit minor league pitching well, no doubt. I hope he keeps hitting. I hope he makes it hard to keep him down... but the only way he sees time on this roster with all the bodies already here needing DH time is do to a lot of injuries or trades opening a spot at DH.

[Olerud363]

How did you arrive at the conclusion they've been testing him at 2b? Was it the 2 games he played there in 2019, or the 1 game he played there last year? or the 0 games he's played there this year? He's had exactly 6 balls hit to him at 2b in his minor league carrer and made an error on one of them. He's not being tested at 2b.

 

LF. Ok. they've been giving him some looks out there but its like 80% 1B, and the rest split between LF and DH, with 16 games at DH and only 10 in LF. That doesnt give me much confidence in his defensive ability to play the OF - moreso like a "we'll stick him out there if we really get in a jam and pray nobody hits the ball there" kind of scenario.

 

Dude can hit minor league pitching well, no doubt. I hope he keeps hitting. I hope he makes it hard to keep him down... but the only way he sees time on this roster with all the bodies already here needing DH time is do to a lot of injuries or trades opening a spot at DH.

 

Get rid of Tapia add Horwitz, play him first 40% (Vladdy rest day), dh 40%, and lf 20% of his time (which presumably is mostly against righties). Rest guys instead of DHing them, which may give them a deeper rest and improve their other performance

 

Assuming Horwitz hit a bit, maybe .280 .350 .440 is the team better than with Tapia getting that playing time?

 

Looks like Zips has him at .257 .338 .420, not sure if that includes this years performance, but lets be optimistic and say he hits even a tad better than that... could improve the team.

 

Of course could improve the team by getting a different perhaps better lefty and doing the same thing (replacing Tapia).

[gruber92]

How did you arrive at the conclusion they've been testing him at 2b? Was it the 2 games he played there in 2019, or the 1 game he played there last year? or the 0 games he's played there this year? He's had exactly 6 balls hit to him at 2b in his minor league carrer and made an error on one of them. He's not being tested at 2b.

 

LF. Ok. they've been giving him some looks out there but its like 80% 1B, and the rest split between LF and DH, with 16 games at DH and only 10 in LF. That doesnt give me much confidence in his defensive ability to play the OF - moreso like a "we'll stick him out there if we really get in a jam and pray nobody hits the ball there" kind of scenario.

 

Dude can hit minor league pitching well, no doubt. I hope he keeps hitting. I hope he makes it hard to keep him down... but the only way he sees time on this roster with all the bodies already here needing DH time is do to a lot of injuries or trades opening a spot at DH.

 

He'll probably be traded just because there really isn't any room for his defensive set. I think we're hoping it's not another Tellez for Richards type deal.

[Brownie19]

The Stripling for Kendall Williams + Ryan Noda deal is looking pretty good. Strip has been a godsend eating up valuable innings effectively and Williams hasn't exactly been tearing it up in the low minors.

 

Good call. I do recall we were pretty concerned that LA would turn Kendall Williams into a stud. Hasn't materialized yet and probably never will.

[Solaxys]

How did you arrive at the conclusion they've been testing him at 2b? Was it the 2 games he played there in 2019, or the 1 game he played there last year? or the 0 games he's played there this year? He's had exactly 6 balls hit to him at 2b in his minor league carrer and made an error on one of them. He's not being tested at 2b.

 

Wasn't a conclusion I made - its in his prospect bio that there is a chance he'll see more action at 2B this year, along side continuing to develop LF.

The only reason I concerned myself with that statement is because, as you said, he's completely blocked at the MLB level.

As for the rest, you just don't know what'll happen and where we'll need the depth.

 

If he's a trade piece, well hopefully we get something good in return, but he looks to be a good lefty contact hitter in a market that is very thin of those.

[The Cats Ass]

He'll probably be traded just because there really isn't any room for his defensive set. I think we're hoping it's not another Tellez for Richards type deal.

 

We should be losing 0 sleep over dealing Rowdy. He's a 1 WAR 1b/DH (maybe 1.5 WAR). He wouldn't crack our current top 9. These guys a worth a dime a dozen.