Jays sign Johan Santana

[Angrioter]

[Boxcar]

 

I find how excited Stroman gets about things to be so refreshing.

[Brownie19]

Jays always had Santana's number though. I will admit, Opening Day 2006 was sweet though. Doc vs. Santana and BJ Ryan coming in the ninth to heavy metal blasting all over the RC and nailing the save!

 

I was there. Loved how the sold out crowd was yelling "we want BJ's"

[jays4life19]

He must have the same agent as Izturis. That guy is the best agent in the game.

 

I really don't think anyone had huge issues with the Izturis signing at the time. It was probably 1 year too long, but it was fair considering what we knew at the time. It just didin't work out.

[z3r0s]

I don't understand how anyone could really care about the Izturis signing. It was for peanuts regardless. We threw that money away, but its really inconsequential

[gbill2004]

@JonHeymanCBS: Beyond 2.5M base in majors, Johan has 2.05M in games started bonuses (maxing out at 25 GS), 2M in roster bonuses #jays

[Stangstag]

@JonHeymanCBS: Beyond 2.5M base in majors, Johan has 2.05M in games started bonuses (maxing out at 25 GS), 2M in roster bonuses #jays

 

Huh. That seems like a little bit much. Is this the first time AA has done a deal with incentives?

[bendera3]

Based on what Santana has done in his past I don't think his agent did magic. It's not like this is guaranteed or anything. If he regains his prime form we got him at a bargain basement price.

[burlingtonbandit]

So wait he can earn up to 6 million? Highly doubt he makes the team..Probably a way for the Jays to say they have no money left since its all tied up in Johan's incentives..

[ElNik2013]

I really don't think anyone had huge issues with the Izturis signing at the time. It was probably 1 year too long, but it was fair considering what we knew at the time. It just didin't work out.

 

 

 

It's also clear by now that the Jays have to overpay to sign FA. Yes, even the Navarros of the world.

[Deadpool]

@JonHeymanCBS: Beyond 2.5M base in majors, Johan has 2.05M in games started bonuses (maxing out at 25 GS), 2M in roster bonuses #jays

 

Holy s***, he could earn up to $6.55M? I mean, that would only happen if he started 25 games (and he'd only do that if he was good, or everyone else was terrible...) but that seems like a pretty goddamn hefty carrot for Santana right there...

 

START 25 GAMES FOR US, JOHAN... AND BE LIKE THE OLD YOU!

[gbill2004]

Yay incentives!

Incentives are SEXY!

[Deadpool]

Incentives are SEXY!

 

I'd work harder at my job if I got incentives. "Fewer people swear at you on the phone, you get a bonus!"... That sort of thing.

[BTS]

I love incentives. I've always hated AA's hard line stance against them. If Santana is good, he'll get paid. If he sucks he won't. Everybody wins. Except Santana if he sucks.

[JFD]

this move could really pay off. it's not like he's a geezer.

[glory]

Yeah, I never understood AA's stance against incentives. If the player doesn't perform, he doesn't get paid. If he performs, he gets what he's worth. It gives the player some motivation and basically costs the team no additional cost if the player fails. It's about time AA signed someone with incentives attached. As long as it's not vesting options and things like that, it's fine.

[ElNik2013]

Could this mean that AA tried to sign other pitchers coming off injury, but was rejected? I'm thinking Beachy et al.

[Chappy]

WS here we come!!

[gbill2004]

Get Johan some of that Canadian HGH and we can expect a Cy Young season!

[Key22]

AA is against certain incentives and he has reason to be because it can cause problems in the clubhouse and for the manager. The player may demand being played in order to reach his incentive when it may not be beneficial to the team - but there is no "hard" reason not to play him. Maybe a guy who is struggling you want to skip him a start but noooo he has to make X starts to get his incentive.

 

This incentive contract seems a bit different because it's basically about health and performance. If Johan is the old Johan and healthy then 25 starts will prove that and he would easily be worth more than $6million if he gave us 2010 Johan numbers. If he gives us 2010 Johan he'd probably be worth $15-$20million but we're paying $6million.

 

It's also good for Johan - if he comes in here and performs well - he did it in the AL East and in a non pitcher friendly park which means his contract next year would be rather huge. I'd love him to be the fifth starter and place Sanchez, Estrada and Norris in the pen. If Cecil can pull and Andrew Miller (or Casey Jansen) and be a good closer with Loup doing his usual goodness - and if Sanchez does what he did last year and Norris is Sanchex but from the left side then all of a sudden you have a 7th through ninth that is looking pretty excellent. Delaba goes back to the good Delabar and Jenkins (who is actually surprisingly good most of the time) and solid relief from Redmond and you get maybe 1-2 surprise good performances from a Castro or Lopez then the pen may go back to the year we all though it would stink to a strength. A good Johan strengthens the pen.

[Chappy]

I'll be surprised if he ever throws a pitch for the Toronto Blue Jays.

 

Big gambler.

[Deadpool]

AA is against certain incentives and he has reason to be because it can cause problems in the clubhouse and for the manager. The player may demand being played in order to reach his incentive when it may not be beneficial to the team - but there is no "hard" reason not to play him. Maybe a guy who is struggling you want to skip him a start but noooo he has to make X starts to get his incentive.

 

This incentive contract seems a bit different because it's basically about health and performance. If Johan is the old Johan and healthy then 25 starts will prove that and he would easily be worth more than $6million if he gave us 2010 Johan numbers. If he gives us 2010 Johan he'd probably be worth $15-$20million but we're paying $6million.

 

It's also good for Johan - if he comes in here and performs well - he did it in the AL East and in a non pitcher friendly park which means his contract next year would be rather huge. I'd love him to be the fifth starter and place Sanchez, Estrada and Norris in the pen. If Cecil can pull and Andrew Miller (or Casey Jansen) and be a good closer with Loup doing his usual goodness - and if Sanchez does what he did last year and Norris is Sanchex but from the left side then all of a sudden you have a 7th through ninth that is looking pretty excellent. Delaba goes back to the good Delabar and Jenkins (who is actually surprisingly good most of the time) and solid relief from Redmond and you get maybe 1-2 surprise good performances from a Castro or Lopez then the pen may go back to the year we all though it would stink to a strength. A good Johan strengthens the pen.

 

I'm all for surprise great performances, but I can't see a single scenario where Norris is in the pen at all... He's in the rotation in the MLB, or the rotation in AAA... Those are the only options w/ Norris.

[Key22]

I'm all for surprise great performances, but I can't see a single scenario where Norris is in the pen at all... He's in the rotation in the MLB, or the rotation in AAA... Those are the only options w/ Norris.

 

That makes sense to me as well - for his benefit but at the same time - if they're in win now mode they could do what they did with Jimmy Key and David Wells - their young starting pitchers in the minors and use them in the pen - at least in the second half IF the team is in a play-off run. All hands on deck if you're in it.

[Chappy]

Only with other people's money.

 

Doesn't maatter who's money if it isnt yours.

[Angrioter]

Johan maybe throw one or two games in the last month of the season.

[Angrioter]

I'm assuming that means will be out of the playoffs and he will simply fill a Brad Mills role.

 

Very likely.

[RealAccountant]

Johan maybe throw one or two games in the last month of the season.

 

How about you let Johan actually redevelop himself and let him pitch

[jays76]

Hopefully he makes the roster, if he does that will tell us the faith they have in his progress.

[ElNik2013]

Johan Santana is another guy who started off his MLB career in the BP.

[jays4life19]

I remember a lot of people did. Career backups and role players don't get multi-year deals. You can sign players to mininum contracts that give you the same value. He really has no stand out skills and didn't deserve the money he got.

 

 

 

Its the principle that you don't give replacement level players long term contracts. Apparently our budget is tight so we can't afford to throw money away. So no its not peanuts because maybe we could have signed a decent reliever. Izturis is the front runner at second base because of the money he is getting. Which is rediculous. He doesn't even belong on the roster. I would have Travis, Tolleson, and even Goins ahead of him on the depth chart. Atleast we know Goins will play defense.

 

The last 4 years before we signed Izzy:

2009: 3.2 fWAR

2010: 1.0 fWAR

2011: 2.0 fWAR

2012: 0.8 fWAR