Your 1 to 5 batting order

[Ehjays]

I don't hink anyone has said they are "fine" with the LF and 2b positions as they are, more so they realize that aside from further gutting of the farm, there not a lot of options out there via trade, and free agency is never a guarantee you get who you target, and you can't just target a guy and just blindly throw money at them until they sign.

 

Lowrie would likely be a better option at 2b than anyone on house, but where's the guarantee that he even want to to play here? Sure trading for Upton for LF would be wonderful, but are you gonna give up 2 top end prospects for 1 year of the guy when he's all but guaranteed yo go to FA for 2016?

 

It's highly unlikely you are able to put star calibre talent at every spot on the diamond. You also didn't mention Devon Travis as part of the 2b puzzle.

 

Hey Havok

 

Can you see the Jays taking someone in the rule V draft for the bullpen???

[John_Havok]

I haven't checked the list of who specifically might be available, but there's always a possibility for that to happen.

[Jimcanuck]

Aquilino Lopez was the last Rule 5 RP they Jays drafted and kept on the roster for the year?

 

That was in 2003.

[burlingtonbandit]

No, I agree go after the 2B depth as you can. But the difference is now instead of:

 

"AA GET A QUALITY MIF NOW YOU FAT PIECE OF s*** OR I WILL BURN YOU IN A CONCENTRATION CAMP"

 

It's more like:

 

"AA, please get a quality MIF. It would be nice to have but I won't burn your house down if you fail"

 

Thats only because of the moves he has made. The 2B situation is almost worse than last year. Izturis is probably a negative player at this point and Goins hits like a pitcher. Travis seems good but huge risk playing a guy who has never been past AA and some scouts aren't even sure if he's a prospect.

[burlingtonbandit]

Worse than last year? This is last year plus Travis, who projects to be an above average 2B right now.

 

If its Goins/Izturis it is for sure worse than last year. Izturis was terrible in 2013 and is coming off a major knee surgery while getting scary old. Goins can't hit and will not hit. I am a Travis fan but if he comes to spring training and isn't ready the alternative is garbage. Even with him going into the season as the starting 2B there is a ton of risk there. Projections for rookies aren't the most accurate.

[Captain Adama]

Worse than last year? This is last year plus Travis, who projects to be an above average 2B right now.

 

Right, with that said, I'm hearing a lot of Maicer is starting 2B for the Jays next year, do people forget that in worst case scenario and the Jays get no 2B this winter, that Travis should be a capable 2B? I'd much rather wheel out Travis than Mouser, I don't care that he's making 2.6 M more.

 

Also, since I'm late to the party: f*** yeah the Jays got Donaldson!

[Mikeleelop]

Right, with that said, I'm hearing a lot of Maicer is starting 2B for the Jays next year, do people forget that in worst case scenario and the Jays get no 2B this winter, that Travis should be a capable 2B? I'd much rather wheel out Travis than Mouser, I don't care that he's making 2.6 M more.

 

Also, since I'm late to the party: f*** yeah the Jays got Donaldson!

 

Izturis is a dfa candidate

[burlingtonbandit]

I don't hink anyone has said they are "fine" with the LF and 2b positions as they are, more so they realize that aside from further gutting of the farm, there not a lot of options out there via trade, and free agency is never a guarantee you get who you target, and you can't just target a guy and just blindly throw money at them until they sign.

 

Lowrie would likely be a better option at 2b than anyone on house, but where's the guarantee that he even want to to play here? Sure trading for Upton for LF would be wonderful, but are you gonna give up 2 top end prospects for 1 year of the guy when he's all but guaranteed yo go to FA for 2016?

 

It's highly unlikely you are able to put star calibre talent at every spot on the diamond. You also didn't mention Devon Travis as part of the 2b puzzle.

 

Im not advocating trading away tons of prospects for these holes but rather saying its pretty dangerous going into the season with the current options at LF and 2B. The offseason is just beginning and AA is on record saying LF and 2B are priorities so I think something happens so we don't have to have this conversation in April.

[Dick_Pole]

Thats only because of the moves he has made. The 2B situation is almost worse than last year. Izturis is probably a negative player at this point and Goins hits like a pitcher. Travis seems good but huge risk playing a guy who has never been past AA and some scouts aren't even sure if he's a prospect.

 

Sorry dude, but your first sentence cracks me up. It's like something Homer Simpson would say to start off a debate. It's such an obvious observation if this were a face to face conversation it would catch me off-guard and cause me to hesitate to think how I'm going to respond to it.

 

Yes...I admit it...I am less upset at AA and the 2B situation because of the competent moves he has made. The GM of the Toronto Blue Jays got off his ass and did a good job so I am less angry at him.

 

"Almost worse" means not worse means it's better. You're really not putting out a very confident argument. I think you're just trying to be a Devil's Advocate or bring attention to 2B which I agree is a weakness, but not such an urgent one as it was a month ago.

[Spoonovic]

Vince McMahon was recently told the names of the Jays top 5 batters.

 

http://i.imgur.com/8sGebWo.gif

[43211234]

Vince McMahon was recently told the names of the Jays top 5 batters.

 

http://i.imgur.com/8sGebWo.gif

 

Did you see that on Reddit? I actually made it lol

[LongTimeReader]

Did you see that on Reddit? I actually made it lol

 

So good dude

[Spoonovic]

Did you see that on Reddit? I actually made it lol

 

Yes I did. Amazing job!

[G-Snarls]

Did you see that on Reddit? I actually made it lol

 

F 'n brilliant

[43211234]

I can't take too much credit. I simply edited what was already the potential GOAT gif.

 

http://i.imgur.com/GZUKvFD.gif

[ScientificReason]

Vince McMahon was recently told the names of the Jays top 5 batters.

 

http://i.imgur.com/8sGebWo.gif

 

HAHA best post in the thread.

[jaysguy44]

Vince McMahon was recently told the names of the Jays top 5 batters.

 

http://i.imgur.com/8sGebWo.gif

 

Hahaha unreal

[ineedsheet]

So four platoons? Pompey will not platoon w pillar.

 

And no Navarro?

What about the knuckleball lineup?.

 

AA specifically said otherwise on Prime Time Sports.

 

This is the lineup that i would use with the players we have today. clearly we need help in the pen, OF and sp.

[z3r0s]

omfg, we really need to get over this 'knuckleball catcher' narrative. Its some weird perceived need that doesn't actually exist. Its not like we have JPA behind the plate anymore. its not like even JP wouldn't have gotten better at catching it with some practice. Just stick Martin back there and dump Thole immediately.

[CHRIS]

omfg, we really need to get over this 'knuckleball catcher' narrative. Its some weird perceived need that doesn't actually exist. Its not like we have JPA behind the plate anymore. its not like even JP wouldn't have gotten better at catching it with some practice. Just stick Martin back there and dump Thole immediately.

 

I agree. Personally, I'm happy having Dickey and his contributions on this roster, but not at the expense of an additional roster spot. If Thole is the best backup guy based on his merit, so be it, but him getting a roster spot by default seems silly.

[JugglingPitches]

Maybe I'm nuts, but...

 

1. Reyes

2. Melky/Fowler/Markakis

3. Donaldson

4. Edwin

5. Pompey/Pillar

6. Tolleson/Izturis

7. Goins/Izturis

8. Navarro (currently, but he won't be around)

9. Martin

 

Rather see the offence spread around a bit, doesn't give the opposing pitcher an inning "off", Martin essentially becomes a second leadoff hitter as the game wears on.

 

Tough to do this without a final roster. This probably wouldn't be a permanent lineup either, but I'd experiment with it.

[z3r0s]

Maybe I'm nuts, but...

 

1. Reyes

2. Melky/Fowler/Markakis

3. Donaldson

4. Edwin

5. Pompey/Pillar

6. Tolleson/Izturis

7. Goins/Izturis

8. Navarro (currently, but he won't be around)

9. Martin

 

Rather see the offence spread around a bit, doesn't give the opposing pitcher an inning "off", Martin essentially becomes a second leadoff hitter as the game wears on.

 

Tough to do this without a final roster. This probably wouldn't be a permanent lineup either, but I'd experiment with it.

 

who are we trading Bautista for?

[Candy Maldonado]

Maybe I'm nuts, but...

 

1. Reyes

2. Melky/Fowler/Markakis

3. Donaldson

4. Edwin

5. Pompey/Pillar

6. Tolleson/Izturis

7. Goins/Izturis

8. Navarro (currently, but he won't be around)

9. Martin

 

Rather see the offence spread around a bit, doesn't give the opposing pitcher an inning "off", Martin essentially becomes a second leadoff hitter as the game wears on.

 

Tough to do this without a final roster. This probably wouldn't be a permanent lineup either, but I'd experiment with it.

 

No Bautista, ya you're nuts

[JugglingPitches]

You're nuts. Tolleson/Izturis manning RF?

 

As the roster sits now I have no idea. I pulled that lineup out of my ass, I was more concerned with the top 5/Martin at 9.

[LGBJ29]

Maybe I'm nuts, but...

 

1. Reyes

2. Melky/Fowler/Markakis

3. Donaldson

4. Edwin

5. Pompey/Pillar

6. Tolleson/Izturis

7. Goins/Izturis

8. Navarro (currently, but he won't be around)

9. Martin

 

Rather see the offence spread around a bit, doesn't give the opposing pitcher an inning "off", Martin essentially becomes a second leadoff hitter as the game wears on.

 

Tough to do this without a final roster. This probably wouldn't be a permanent lineup either, but I'd experiment with it.

 

Pompey/Pillar hitting 5th? LOL

 

And a 5678 of Pillar Tolleson Goins Navarro would certainly be an inning off.

This is idiotic

[JugglingPitches]

Pompey/Pillar hitting 5th? LOL

 

And a 5678 of Pillar Tolleson Goins Navarro would certainly be an inning off.

This is idiotic

 

Like I said, I doubt 5 6 7 8 is going to look like that by Spring Training. Point is one of the big 5 in the 9 spot.

[Deadpool]

Like I said, I doubt 5 6 7 8 is going to look like that by Spring Training. Point is one of the big 5 in the 9 spot.

 

While I get the "second leadoff hitter when turning the line-up over" thing, I just don't want Martin to be getting fewer at-bats than Pillar/Tolleson/Goins/Izturis, which is the end result of batting him 9th. Also, no Bautista as others have mentioned.

[JugglingPitches]

That's ridiculously dumb. The 9 spot gets the least plate appearances by far. That's where your worst hitter goes. Sometimes if your worst hitter is very very bad than you put them 8th and the next worst 9th. This should only be done with hitters like Bartolo Colon.

If you want a "second leadoff hitter" put them 1 and 2.

 

That defeats the purpose of spreading the offense around the lineup. 1-5 looks great, 6 7 8 9 is crap right now. By moving one of them down the lineup, the players hitting in front of him see better pitches, maybe they put up better numbers.

[JugglingPitches]

Putting a good hitter 9 does nothing of the sort. You know the number 9 hitter will always have the number 1 hitter following him right? Moving the 9 hitter up to 8 and a top hitter to 9 doesn't change anything except reduces the plate appearances for that good hitter.

 

That's true, guess you're right.

[burlingtonbandit]

PA/game*LeverageIndex/PA suggests the optimal lineup is as follows.

 

In order of placing your best hitter:

1

4/2 (more SLG of the second and third best goes 4th or more OBP goes 2nd)

3/5 (more SLG of the 4th and 5th best goes 5th or more OBP goes 3rd, if they are similar in both ways than the better baserunner goes 5th)

6

7

8

9

 

Say you rank your hitters as follows:

Bautista

Encarnacion

Donaldson

Martin

Reyes

Navarro

Travis

Pillar

Pompey

 

Optimal lineup would look something like:

 

Bautista

Donaldson (EE has more power)

Martin (more OBP than Reyes, Reyes better baserunner)

Encarnacion

Reyes

Navarro

Travis

Pillar

Pompey

 

Donaldson is much worse against RHP (compared to LHP) so I think you would have to change it depending on LHP/RHP. Just wondering, If you had a guy like Lind would you move Donaldson right behind him in the lineup and move someone like Pompey behind him vs RHP to try to get him more PA vs LHP later in the game?