Jays get Josh Donaldson for Lawrie, Graveman, Nolin and Barreto

[GD]

Miller for Montero would be sweet.

 

Padres, anyone?

[LTR]

Reyes for a case of FYSMC tees. Done deal.

[LTR]

Would settle for a case of dildos if that means we don't have to eat any salary.

 

Dildos it is then.

[RealAccountant]

I used to think like jays homer fans but the more posts I read from the board vets here the more I understand. Bts Hurl North and others. They are right. The worst thing that can happen to this franchise is a 83 win season that ensures more Years for this incompetent management

 

The best thing that can happen is for the jays to collapse so we can start over with a better GM. Its the only way.

[GD]

yes RA, join the dark side

[flafson]

I used to think like jays homer fans but the more posts I read from the board vets here the more I understand. Bts Hurl North and others. They are right. The worst thing that can happen to this franchise is a 83 win season that ensures more Years for this incompetent management

 

The best thing that can happen is for the jays to collapse so we can start over with a better GM. Its the only way.

 

No.... The best thing for us is to win the World Series.

[JFD]

I used to think like jays homer fans but the more posts I read from the board vets here the more I understand. Bts Hurl North and others. They are right. The worst thing that can happen to this franchise is a 83 win season that ensures more Years for this incompetent management

 

The best thing that can happen is for the jays to collapse so we can start over with a better GM. Its the only way.

 

correct, the loop must be broken.

[Angrioter]

No.... The best thing for us is to win the World Series.

 

And we are going in the right direction.

Pillar CF, Colabello RF, Navarro DH, Loup 8th guy, 22M SS who can't play D or be healthy for 100 games, s*** 40 year old Knuckleballer who we traded for a young stud CY caliber starter and above average catcher,.........

[burlingtonbandit]

I used to think like jays homer fans but the more posts I read from the board vets here the more I understand. Bts Hurl North and others. They are right. The worst thing that can happen to this franchise is a 83 win season that ensures more Years for this incompetent management

 

The best thing that can happen is for the jays to collapse so we can start over with a better GM. Its the only way.

 

Elephant in the room.. Rogers hires some moron GM and sets the franchise back another 10 years. The guy doing the hiring wanted Kenny Williams the guy everyone laughed at in Chicago. I'll take AA as the GM knowing he isn't the best out there instead of a 10% chance Rogers hires someone better.

[glory]

And we are going in the right direction.

Pillar CF, Colabello RF, Navarro DH, Loup 8th guy, 22M SS who can't play D or be healthy for 100 games, s*** 40 year old Knuckleballer who we traded for a young stud CY caliber starter and above average catcher,.........

 

Yep. The Jays winning a s*** division and prolonging the employment of AA and Gibbons would be brutal. I'm so conflicted. I want the Jays to make the playoffs but want those two nimrods replaced. Ugh.

[Boxcar]

Elephant in the room.. Rogers hires some moron GM and sets the franchise back another 10 years. The guy doing the hiring wanted Kenny Williams the guy everyone laughed at in Chicago. I'll take AA as the GM knowing he isn't the best out there instead of a 10% chance Rogers hires someone better.

 

Options are:

 

a) do nothing and never make the playoffs

 

do something in the hopes someone good gets hired, possible chance of making the playoffs

 

I've been convinced for years now that we will never compete while AA is in charge. Rather roll the dice than be ok with status quo just because "it could be worse."

[burlingtonbandit]

Options are:

 

a) do nothing and never make the playoffs

 

do something in the hopes someone good gets hired, possible chance of making the playoffs

 

I've been convinced for years now that we will never compete while AA is in charge. Rather roll the dice than be ok with status quo just because "it could be worse."

 

You make it sound like AA is the worst GM in the league. He isn't close.

 

He made great trades in the offseason and his drafting and developing seems to be really good. If he could learn to round out a roster with decent depth he would be a much better GM. Jays can certainly make the playoffs with him in charge though. Its the awful Ownership what will kill the Jays.

[glory]

Elephant in the room.. Rogers hires some moron GM and sets the franchise back another 10 years. The guy doing the hiring wanted Kenny Williams the guy everyone laughed at in Chicago. I'll take AA as the GM knowing he isn't the best out there instead of a 10% chance Rogers hires someone better.

 

They also spent months trying to get Dan Duquette, who by all measures is a much better executive/GM than AA.

 

I'd say it's 50/50 they hire someone worse.

[Angrioter]

Options are:

 

a) do nothing and never make the playoffs

 

do something in the hopes someone good gets hired, possible chance of making the playoffs

 

I've been convinced for years now that we will never compete while AA is in charge. Rather roll the dice than be ok with status quo just because "it could be worse."

 

It's time to think like the others moron GM (Dayton Moore); spend big money in relievers and big contracts to vetrin players.

I'm sick of lose year by year. Something must change.

[LTR]

And we are going in the right direction.

Pillar CF, Colabello RF, Navarro DH, Loup 8th guy, 22M SS who can't play D or be healthy for 100 games, s*** 40 year old Knuckleballer who we traded for a young stud CY caliber starter and above average catcher,.........

 

Great... it's 8 am and I need a drink already, way to go!

[Smokey]

You make it sound like AA is the worst GM in the league. He isn't close.

 

He made great trades in the offseason and his drafting and developing seems to be really good. If he could learn to round out a roster with decent depth he would be a much better GM. Jays can certainly make the playoffs with him in charge though. Its the awful Ownership what will kill the Jays.

 

Thanks Captain Obvious! The problem is that he's on his 6th year on the job and has shown no inclination to learn from his past mistakes.

 

But I guess he deserves another 6 years though because he's not the worst!

[Boxcar]

You make it sound like AA is the worst GM in the league. He isn't close.

 

He made great trades in the offseason and his drafting and developing seems to be really good. If he could learn to round out a roster with decent depth he would be a much better GM. Jays can certainly make the playoffs with him in charge though. Its the awful Ownership what will kill the Jays.

 

He's not the worst, and there's no way I could have made it sound that way since I specifically said it could be worse. Yeah, awful ownership that gave him a top 10 payroll. They are the real problem.

 

You say "if AA did this or that" but I think we're past the point of hoping he'll change. No team since he's taken over has had any kind of reasonable depth. Every single year we piss away at bats on guys like Pillar, Navarro, Vizquel, DeRosa, Thames, Goins, Tolleson, etc.

 

So because we have injury prone guys and no depth, this team isn't going anywhere IMO.

Edited May 29, 2015 by Boxcar

[KingKat]

He's not the worst, and there's no way I could have made it sound that way since I specifically said it could be worse. Yeah, awful ownership that gave him a top 10 payroll. They are the real problem.

 

You say "if AA did this or that" but I think we're past the point of hoping he'll change. No team since he's taken over has had any kind of reasonable depth. Every single year we piss away at bats on guys like Pillar, Navarro, Vizquel, DeRosa, Thames, Coins, Tolleson, etc.

 

So because we have injury prone guys and no depth, this team isn't going anywhere IMO.

 

The depth issues remain but the core has gotten stronger with Martin and Donaldson. No AA hasn't learned from his mistakes but he may have finally put himself in a position to get away with them (weaker A.L. East doesn't hurt).

[RealAccountant]

The depth issues remain but the core has gotten stronger with Martin and Donaldson. No AA hasn't learned from his mistakes but he may have finally put himself in a position to get away with them (weaker A.L. East doesn't hurt).

 

5 games under says otherwise

[Governator]

5 games under says otherwise

 

 

God, I hope you're not my accountant.

[KingKat]

5 games under says otherwise

 

Sigh... I suppose you could argue that the overall team is lesser (and find other arguments to support that view than just the win-loss record) but the core is stronger. The team went from two lineup cornerstones to four. That's a pretty significant upgrade. The stronger your core, the easier (in theory) it should be to build around it. And yeah it's a bit late for that now but it's not necessarily too late. The team is hardly out of the race and some mid-season moves could really go a long way.

[glory]

The depth issues remain but the core has gotten stronger with Martin and Donaldson. No AA hasn't learned from his mistakes but he may have finally put himself in a position to get away with them (weaker A.L. East doesn't hurt).

 

His "I don't give a s*** about depth" philosophy already killed him the moment Stroman went down. He won't be getting away with it this season.

[KingKat]

His "I don't give a s*** about depth" philosophy already killed him the moment Stroman went down. He won't be getting away with it this season.

 

Well if everything's settled than maybe it's time to call it a day. Have fun! See you next year!

[glory]

Well if everything's settled than maybe it's time to call it a day. Have fun! See you next year!

 

If the Jays win this division with a rotation of Dickey, Hutchison, Buehrle, Estrada, and Sanchez, coupled with a bullpen that can't be trusted beyond 2 relievers, then the division winner will be ~.500. That's really the only way. This isn't the late-90's Texas Rangers.

[Boxcar]

Well if everything's settled than maybe it's time to call it a day. Have fun! See you next year!

 

I think a pessimistic approach is kind of warranted. We've been here before.

[KingKat]

I think a pessimistic approach is kind of warranted. We've been here before.

 

Well heck I'm pessimistic too except that he was being categorical and that's dumb.

[ScientificReason]

The depth issues remain but the core has gotten stronger with Martin and Donaldson. No AA hasn't learned from his mistakes but he may have finally put himself in a position to get away with them (weaker A.L. East doesn't hurt).

 

Get away with them how? By continuing the longest playoff drought in sports? This team is not making the playoffs with this starting staff and bullpen. The core got better while the pitching got worse and is atrocious. He won;t be getting away with the lack of depth or pitching this season.

 

Sucks as we have all-star players at numerous positions, what a waste.

[KingKat]

Get away with them how? By continuing the longest playoff drought in sports? This team is not making the playoffs with this starting staff and bullpen. The core got better while the pitching got worse and is atrocious. He won;t be getting away with the lack of depth or pitching this season.

 

Sucks as we have all-star players at numerous positions, what a waste.

 

FFS, all I said was "may have". I'm just saying there's a chance. I'm not saying it's the likeliest outcome or that I even like AA. No need to wingman with glory over this.

[Boxcar]

FFS, all I said was "may have". I'm just saying there's a chance. I'm not saying it's the likeliest outcome or that I even like AA. No need to wingman with glory over this.

 

For the record, I wasn't trying to be a wingman.

[KingKat]

For the record, I wasn't trying to be a wingman.

 

My original comment was addressed at you so you couldn't possibly be considered a wingman in this situation.

 

The main point that I was trying to make is that's it's not necessarily black and white with AA. We've seen some improvement. He seems to have a better handle on player values in general and values related to run prevention in particular. He's not making ALL of the same mistakes though he's definitely making MANY of them. I'm not willing to say that it can't work out this year. Teams win with less than optimal approaches all the time. Just because it hasn't benn happening to the Jays doesn't mean it can never happen ever. It's not a lost cause although it's definitely frustrating to see that some of the things that could have been fairly easily addressed are making things unnecesarily harder. Even some of the under the radar depth moves like picking up West and Guilmet have been ruined by pointless roster churning. There's a lot of reason for frustration but at the same the current W-L record makes the overall situation seem worse than it is. It doesn't reflect the run differential and probably isn't a good measure of this team's chances. If this was the late nineties when you had to be perfect just to have a chance, maybe you'd write off the season but this is one of those rare times where there's an opportunity to half-ass your way to success in the division and if it happens it will make AA seem smarter than he actually is but ultimately as a Jays fan, I don't really give a s*** about that. I'll give him credit for the good moves, blame for the bad ones and I'll take winning over anything.