Can Ryan Goins stick?

[Caper]

Anyone? He's looked pretty comfortable out there. A late bloomer? Maybe a Marco Scutaro type of player? I'm desperate here... give me some hope he has a decent chance to surprise.

[theblujay]

Anyone? He's looked pretty comfortable out there. A late bloomer? Maybe a Marco Scutaro type of player? I'm desperate here... give me some hope he has a decent chance to surprise.

 

He can't be worse than -2 WAR Izturis

[flafson]

He looks just fine to me, let him play.

[flafson]

We need to build the team going from defense out, that has been our weakness all year. If he's a good defender then let him play and maybe he will prove he can also hit enough to justify his spot.

[GD]

I'll hedge it and say probably not, but there's a small chance imo.

[Angrioter]

Anyone? He's looked pretty comfortable out there. A late bloomer? Maybe a Marco Scutaro type of player? I'm desperate here... give me some hope he has a decent chance to surprise.

 

No tools = no skills

[Ehh]

I'd give him about a 2% chance

[havok24]

Nope.

[Nox]

lol

[KingKat]

Anyone? He's looked pretty comfortable out there. A late bloomer? Maybe a Marco Scutaro type of player? I'm desperate here... give me some hope he has a decent chance to surprise.

 

He still has options, he has a good glove. He has value if you keep him in the minors for emergencies. You basically kill his value if you start making part of your Major League plans.

[dineke]

I thought this dude was asking 'bout his penis size when I saw the title.

[gruber92]

Maybe on an offensively stacked team, since his defense plays in the majors. You never know though, he may defy all the statistical projections and actually hold his own offensively. You have to let a player actually play enough to know whether or not he can stick. The player has to be worth the time though, as projections can be wrong and have not always been accurate. From what I've seen so far, I'd say he has a 10% chance to stick as a starter and a 75% chance to be on a 25 man

[KingKat]

Maybe on an offensively stacked team, since his defense plays in the majors. You never know though, he may defy all the statistical projections and actually hold his own offensively. You have to let a player actually play enough to know whether or not he can stick. The player has to be worth the time though, as projections can be wrong and have not always been accurate. From what I've seen so far, I'd say he has a 10% chance to stick as a starter and a 75% chance to be on a 25 man

 

Why would you give him an opportunity to stick when you control him and he has options? This isn't the Houston Astros. It's not open tryouts. Just because the team blows now, doesn't change the fact that the Jays are in win now mode and eyeing contention in 2014. The opportunity to play should not extend beyond 2013. Guys like Goins and Pillar look like they could provide good insurance in the minors and that's great news but the Jays can't afford to get carried away and have anymore Eric Thames experiments. I'm not saying these guys couldn't work out better than Thames. They very well might but it would be foolish to bank on that no matter how well they play in 2013. One of the things the Jays have lacked in recent years is minor leaguers who can support the Major League team. If they finally have a few guys like that, the worst thing they can do is bump them to the majors.

[gruber92]

That's why I said he has about a 10% chance to stick as a starter. f*** the options already, if he is your best option then take it. Its not like he's a 21 year old with tons of time left. I think he's also a better service by being on the 25 man. Unless AA picks up n better options this winter, Goins over Kawasaki looks to be a no brainer.

[KingKat]

f*** the options already, if he is your best option then take it. Its not like he's a 21 year old with tons of time left.

 

But it's not like you should care about his development. He is a fringy/depth guy anyways. If he's your best option then you really haven't planned very well and you're starting 2014 behind the eight ball.

[Laika]

f*** the options already, if he is your best option then take it.

 

I shudder to think of the terrible offseason that would lead to Ryan f***ing Goins being "the best option" at any position.

[CHRIS]

I shudder to think of the terrible offseason that would lead to Ryan f***ing Goins being "the best option" at any position.

 

That was pretty much last offseason.

#LoViste

[Laika]

That was pretty much last offseason.

#LoViste

 

True. And it still hurts.

[Caper]

Why would you give him an opportunity to stick when you control him and he has options? This isn't the Houston Astros. It's not open tryouts. Just because the team blows now, doesn't change the fact that the Jays are in win now mode and eyeing contention in 2014. The opportunity to play should not extend beyond 2013. Guys like Goins and Pillar look like they could provide good insurance in the minors and that's great news but the Jays can't afford to get carried away and have anymore Eric Thames experiments. I'm not saying these guys couldn't work out better than Thames. They very well might but it would be foolish to bank on that no matter how well they play in 2013. One of the things the Jays have lacked in recent years is minor leaguers who can support the Major League team. If they finally have a few guys like that, the worst thing they can do is bump them to the majors.

 

 

 

Contending or not contending.... almost every team is going through a "Eric Thames" experiment somewhere on the field.

[gruber92]

Defensively, he's just as good if not better than any free agent option out there, and not much worse offensively ( except for Cano of course). Unless we trade for Kendrick or maybe Altuve, why spend on this position? Address the SP, LF, DH and C before anything else. Let's not make another lateral move that costs more money, commitment and an older player to boot. AA may have his hands tied on this one, as i think there isn't enough money to address all the other innefinciancies this team has.

[KingKat]

Defensively, he's just as good if not better than any free agent option out there, and not much worse offensively ( except for Cano of course). Unless we trade for Kendrick or maybe Altuve, why spend on this position? Address the SP, LF, DH and C before anything else. Let's not make another lateral move that costs more money, commitment and an older player to boot. AA may have his hands tied on this one, as i think there isn't enough money to address all the other innefinciancies this team has.

 

It's a sticky situation for sure. You don't want to block guys just to block guys like this year where a Kawasaki/Derosa platoon would have provided better production then the two guys who got the bulk of the starts. That being said you do ideally want bench players and relievers with options to expand your roster. Goins could be what Kawasaki was this year, a good utility man to call up when you need him but that only works if you're not fielding shittier players on your 25 man roster.

[Laika]

Defensively, he's just as good if not better than any free agent option out there, and not much worse offensively ( except for Cano of course). Unless we trade for Kendrick or maybe Altuve, why spend on this position? Address the SP, LF, DH and C before anything else. Let's not make another lateral move that costs more money, commitment and an older player to boot. AA may have his hands tied on this one, as i think there isn't enough money to address all the other innefinciancies this team has.

 

Excuse me sir, but I think you may have been dropped on your head as a young child.

 

Ryan Goins is 25 years old and he had an 89 wRC+ in AAA this year. Digest that information for a minute, and then tell me you honestly think he's a major league starter.

 

Truthfully, Melky and Lind would both very probably be much better options at their respective positions than Goins would be at 2B. 2B is as glaring a hole as C and SP.

 

C - top priority due to weakness of current player and position trickle down effect on starting rotation. A one year vet stop gap would be fine.

SP - co-top priority due to glaring overall weakness and lack of depth.

2B - near top priority due to weakness of current penciled in starter (Mouser). Goins and Kawasaki provide decent depth, but neither are major league starters. Izturis should probably be let go in the offseason, since both Kawasaki and Goins would be better bench players (they can actually play SS).

DH/LF - upgrades highly recommended if there are enough funds. Worst case scenario, Lind and Melky should be below average but positive contributors in 2014 (assuming some leg health bounce back from Melky).

 

Also, great job with " innefinciancies"

[Angrioter]

Excuse me sir, but I think you may have been dropped on your head as a young child.

 

Ryan Goins is 25 years old and he had an 89 wRC+ in AAA this year. Digest that information for a minute, and then tell me you honestly think he's a major league starter.

 

Truthfully, Melky and Lind would both very probably be much better options at their respective positions than Goins would be at 2B. 2B is as glaring a hole as C and SP.

 

C - top priority due to weakness of current player and position trickle down effect on starting rotation. A one year vet stop gap would be fine.

SP - co-top priority due to glaring overall weakness and lack of depth.

2B - near top priority due to weakness of current penciled in starter (Mouser). Goins and Kawasaki provide decent depth, but neither are major league starters. Izturis should probably be let go in the offseason, since both Kawasaki and Goins would be better bench players (they can actually play SS).

DH/LF - upgrades highly recommended if there are enough funds. Worst case scenario, Lind and Melky should be below average but positive contributors in 2014 (assuming some leg health bounce back from Melky).

 

Also, great job with " innefinciancies"

 

...........Eres un hombre inteligente. Goins lives a good time but He don't have the tools to be starter in the majors.

"Nadie aprende a batear de la noche a la manana" or "Nobody learns to hit of the night to the morning"

[gruber92]

Excuse me sir, but I think you may have been dropped on your head as a young child.

 

Ryan Goins is 25 years old and he had an 89 wRC+ in AAA this year. Digest that information for a minute, and then tell me you honestly think he's a major league starter.

 

Truthfully, Melky and Lind would both very probably be much better options at their respective positions than Goins would be at 2B. 2B is as glaring a hole as C and SP.

 

C - top priority due to weakness of current player and position trickle down effect on starting rotation. A one year vet stop gap would be fine.

SP - co-top priority due to glaring overall weakness and lack of depth.

2B - near top priority due to weakness of current penciled in starter (Mouser). Goins and Kawasaki provide decent depth, but neither are major league starters. Izturis should probably be let go in the offseason, since both Kawasaki and Goins would be better bench players (they can actually play SS).

DH/LF - upgrades highly recommended if there are enough funds. Worst case scenario, Lind and Melky should be below average but positive contributors in 2014 (assuming some leg health bounce back from Melky).

 

Also, great job with " innefinciancies"

 

First of all, i want to apologize for any spelling errors that occurred while using my cell.

 

Where the f*** did i say Goins should be our starting second baseman? If you read the previous posts, i stated he has about a 10% chance as sticking as a starter,and thats just my opinion. How does that constitute me believing he can be a starter? So he has a 89 wRC+ in AAA. So what you are saying is there is no way in hell he can make adjustments in his approach and/or swing that can improve his offense enough in order for him to stick, or maybe something may of clicked mentally that will allow him to improve. God knows something like this has never happened before. The way he turned those DP's was f***ing refreshing. What was Bautista's projected wRC when he was 25? We let EE go just a few years ago FFS. Maybe Mottolla can work with him and figure something out,who knows.

 

Lastly, if you want to make personal insults towards me because your opinion is different than mine, i'll gladly meet you somewhere where you can tell me to my face instead of being a punk cyber tough guy. Grow up.

[gruber92]

...........Eres un hombre inteligente. Goins lives a good time but He don't have the tools to be starter in the majors.

"Nadie aprende a batear de la noche a la manana" or "Nobody learns to hit of the night to the morning"

 

Go ask Ryan Roberts. Even though it didn't last very long, he played in a ton of meaningful games.

[Laika]

First of all, i want to apologize for any spelling errors that occurred while using my cell.

 

Where the f*** did i say Goins should be our starting second baseman? If you read the previous posts, i stated he has about a 10% chance as sticking as a starter,and thats just my opinion. How does that constitute me believing he can be a starter? So he has a 89 wRC+ in AAA. So what you are saying is there is no way in hell he can make adjustments in his approach and/or swing that can improve his offense enough in order for him to stick, or maybe something may of clicked mentally that will allow him to improve. God knows something like this has never happened before. The way he turned those DP's was f***ing refreshing. What was Bautista's projected wRC when he was 25? We let EE go just a few years ago FFS. Maybe Mottolla can work with him and figure something out,who knows.

 

Lastly, if you want to make personal insults towards me because your opinion is different than mine, i'll gladly meet you somewhere where you can tell me to my face instead of being a punk cyber tough guy. Grow up.

 

I seem to have rustled your jimmies.

 

Since the traumatic brain injury that you suffered at such a young age might be affecting your memory, I'll paraphrase what you've brought to the table already:

 

- Ryan Goins has a 10% chance to be a major league starter.

- Ryan Goins defensively is as good as or better than any free agent options out there.

- Ryan Goins offensively is not much worse than any free agent options out there.

- Anything less than a trade for an Altuve/Kendrick type would be nothing but a lateral move, and a waste of money.

 

Point by point rebuttal:

 

- That percentage is ludicrously high.

- Making any conclusions about his defensive prowess after 5 games is ridiculous.

- Age vs. level and major league equivalencies would disagree with you by a large degree with respect to Goins' offensive abilities. He would probably project to hit even worse than... I dunno... guys like Yuni Betancourt and Hechavarria.

- No. Lateral moves to giving Ryan Goins the nominal role would be somewhere in the neighbourhood of "giving Mike McCoy the reins".

 

Since we're on the subject, my creative 2B solution would be exploring the possibility of giving Jhonny Peralta a Melky style PED buy-low.

[GD]

I seem to have rustled your jimmies.

 

Best meme out there.

 

- Making any conclusions about his defensive prowess after 5 games is ridiculous.

 

Fwiw, reports on his defense have always been pretty positive.

 

Since we're on the subject, my creative 2B solution would be exploring the possibility of giving Jhonny Peralta a Melky style PED buy-low.

 

On a one year deal, this would be really nice.

[Nox]

Lastly, if you want to make personal insults towards me because your opinion is different than mine, i'll gladly meet you somewhere where you can tell me to my face instead of being a punk cyber tough guy. Grow up.

 

I see the e-callout/rl-meetup request seems to be growing in popularity. I'm sure NJH can borrow his neighbor's moose and ride down to the designated throwdown area (Yonge/Bloor).

[Caper]

He doesn't have any shot at starting. You need a certain amount of hitting talent to cut it as a Major League regular, and Goins doesn't have it. If you're saying he has upside, then you're also saying that hundreds of other players have upside. Every organization has four or five 24-26 year-olds who are best suited for AA with the bat.

 

Just like Yan Gomes was supposed to be awful? Just like Yan Gomes had a zero percent chance of starting?

[Nox]

Just like Yan Gomes was supposed to be awful? Just like Yan Gomes had a zero percent chance of starting?

 

I have to admit the Yan Gomes thing is pretty funny. Just adds to the spectacular failure that is the JPA era.