Can anyone say they're proud to be a fan of a team that would have Gibbons as manager

[gruber92]

Well then its all on the players. Early in the year I listened to a lengthy segment on the Fan with Chad Mottola who preached using the whole field...working counts etc. If the players aren't taking good advice, which what Mottola was saying was good. Then its on the players who are all adults to

adhere to coaching instruction.

 

I think you can put partial blame on AA for keeping Murphy around.

[Boxcar]

The nucleus of this whole horror story is AA's love with JPA. The Dickey trade never happens if not for that reason. Now AA will fast track Jiminez to the MLB because he was too late in realizing JPA is not a MLB starting catcher. What a sorry assed goof.

 

I have never seen a team put so much marketing focus on a literally worthless player.

[Boxcar]

put it this way...we have, bar none, the worst coaching staff in MLB. and it starts with the manager. the ONLY f***ing thing gibbons is not good, but great at is how he handles the bullpen.

 

if gibbons is the manager next year, i won't be watching. i stopped watching after they laid a huge egg after the all-star break. i had watched/listened to every game until then.

 

gibbons is a piece of s*** puppet. face it. he didn't do a damn thing the first go-around, and he sure as hell isn't doing a damn thing this time.

 

He didn't do a damn thing? He managed the closest thing this franchise has had to a playoff team in a long time. Man, these casuals are so derpy.

 

I'm not adverse to Gibbons getting fired, but only if Rogers treats the root of the disease as well. Beeston, AA, Sartori, Minasian etc. all need to go or this team will remain perpetually mediocre.

[oakville69]

The way I see it, the only way AA cuts him loose this offseason is if he's ordered to by the Board. Firing Gibbons opens up AA to a whooooooooole lot of criticism and second-guessing from the media-femme cockroaches, and puts a big fat target on his own back if '14 doesn't pan out, as he would be the next logical target for the Knee-Jerk Brigade at that point.

 

Honestly, my gut puts the chances of Gibbons being fired this offseason at around 20%.

 

Agreed. AA can't admit he's made 2 bad managerial choices in a row. It makes sense to give Gibby another year with a full spring training schedule. This year half the team was in the WBC. Lawrie got hurt etc. Next year the comeback begins & the team has a shot at above 500 baseball.

[oakville69]

The nucleus of this whole horror story is AA's love with JPA. The Dickey trade never happens if not for that reason. Now AA will fast track Jiminez to the MLB because he was too late in realizing JPA is not a MLB starting catcher. What a sorry assed goof.

 

Interesting point about JPA. If we didn't get Dicky, we would have John Buck & TDA waiting in the wings. We wouldn't need a knuckleball expert catcher like Thole or Blanco.

[jaysblue]

I think its unfair to blame John Gibbons for this. It wasn't his fault all these star players played bad or got injured. Wasn't his fault the Jays were without Jose Reyes, Brett Lawrie for an extended period of time; wasn't his fault the starting pitching sucked all year and new additions like RA and JJ never lived up to expectations. I haven't had a problem with Gibbons at all to be honest as his tactical in-game managing has always been good and that's what he's known for. What would the Jays record be with John Farrell still as manager? Likely the same as it is now.

 

I think Gibbons is still here next year unless AA gets canned this offseason. Next season however there will be more pressure felt on AA's side since if the Jays yet again miss the playoffs or don't play in any meaningful games next September, you'll likely see Rogers cleaning house.

[jaysblue]

Agreed. AA can't admit he's made 2 bad managerial choices in a row. It makes sense to give Gibby another year with a full spring training schedule. This year half the team was in the WBC. Lawrie got hurt etc. Next year the comeback begins & the team has a shot at above 500 baseball.

 

+1

 

That's extremely tough when half of the roster are from different organizations. Though still, with a WBC or without a WBC this year, this team was not fit to contend the way they played.

[jaysblue]

Like almost everything with this team...I think think the re-assessment happens middle of next season.

 

Re-assessment will happen next July. If this team is out of a playoff race by then, I expect major changes.

[jaysblue]

Unfortunately, this is not really true. Rasmus being solid all season, a productive season from Lind, good years from Bautista and EE, a very good bullpen for most of the year. A lot has gone wrong to be sure, but it could have been worse, sadly.

 

I still don't thing Gibbons should be fired though. It would be pretty sad if he lost his job but Beeston and AA got to keep theirs.

 

I think the lineup if healthy is very solid. Reyes, Melky, Bautista, Edwin, Lind, Rasmus, Lawrie - that's a solid core offensively right there if everyone is healthy and plays to expectations. This team needs a second baseman though that can field and hit, and they need a catcher (though that likely won't happen). I'd love to see Marco Scutaro brought back to play second base - he'd be a terrific fit I think.

 

The bullpen, well they have so many arms they don't know what to do with half of them. I think they are fine in that department, and have enough depth if someone like Janssen gets injured/disappoints or an arm or two takes a step back.

 

The starting rotation is what needs to be addressed, though not sure how they go about it? Can't rely on Morrow as a No. 1-2, RA has pitched more like a 3-4 when he was brought in here to be the ace, Buehrle has been what he is, and Happ is just a No. 5 starter. They should have enough depth next year with Hutch, Drabek, Nolin, Stroman, Redmond etc instead of having to start Ortiz or Wang if there's an injury.

 

Overall, the team needs better starting pitching, and they need to play better sound and fundamental baseball all around.

[flafson]

It's a little bit far fetched to say that an MLB manager has the same amount of responsibility as the US president.

[oakville69]

It's a little bit far fetched to say that an MLB manager has the same amount of responsibility as the US president.

 

Obama hasn't done a good job with the White Sox. They haven't made the playoffs since he was elected in 2008. Obama has put too much time into running the country. I think Hawk "Put it on the Board" Harrelson should demand a meeting with Obama to build the team the White Sox Way. )

[havok24]

I love how good the Rays are. What a magnificent organization.

[Ehh]

yeah that's the problem with us toronto fans. we reward people for being mediocre. did we make the playoffs? bottom line is, HE FAILED!!

 

2006-08, if we had a proven manager, we would have made the playoffs or would have been in the hunt through september. this was proven by gaston coming in and leading us to a 51-37 record(best record in the majors after gibbons got fired). and we basically had the same team from 2006-08.

 

btw, i have been a blue jays fan since 1988. don't be so quick to judge, boy.

 

You sound like a f***ing douche. Hopefully this guy is a troll.

 

And you've been watching since 1998? LOLOLOL

[GD]

Only way I'd like to see Gibby fired is, as others have said, in a cleaning of house. If AA and Beeston and everyone go, and the new regime wants to do things their own way, and Gibby's not part of that, I get it, I guess. I would miss him but who gives a flying f*** it's a manager. Just get a guy who's good with defensive shifts and bullpen management and be done with it.

 

Or bring back Butter

[Ehh]

what the f***? are you guys f***ing stupid or what? WHAT THE f*** HAS GIBBONS DONE TO DESERVE THE PRAISE AND NUT-HUGGING?!

 

read it again, you little s***. 1988. not 1998.

 

so far, all i see is a bunch of idiots that think they know it all. i'm trying to have a decent conversation here.

 

You should focus your attention on the players, their clearly the problem. The f*** did gibbons do to make our pitching staff crap? He's managed our bullpen great. The problem is we need front end starters and a upgrade at C/2B/LF

 

For a guy that's been watching since 1988 you haven't offered one solution to actually solving the problem other then firing the manager, something a monkey could suggest

 

And you sound very, very mad.

[havok24]

Always have to use the manager as a scapegoat for bigger problems. Gibbons is practically irrelevant in this whole f***ing abomination of a season. I really have no problem with him, it's the idiots at the top (Beeston/AA) that need to f***ing go. I mean I hate how hypocritical some can be towards the manager based on season results. I mean I guess we can try to hire a 10 WAR manager or what not, but the manager is "just there" handling defensive assignments with the other coaches, and managing the bullpen (which I've had no problem with for the most part).

 

I'd hope the people who dislike Gibbons would still dislike him even if the Jays were 72-57.

[Smokey]

...I haven't had a problem with Gibbons at all to be honest as his tactical in-game managing has always been good and that's what he's known for.

 

...they need to play better sound and fundamental baseball all around.

 

I don't see how playing terrible fundamental baseball isn't at least partially the manager's fault. What this season has clearly proven is that the FO has no idea how to run a baseball franchise and their choice of manager, although not their biggest mistake, is far from ideal.

 

Ultimately, I don't think a different manager would have made a whole lot of difference but it's foolish to dismiss Gibbons from doing anything wrong.

 

This season has been a complete embarrassment and the manager along with the GM and that clown of a president all need to be held accountable.

[Smokey]

The worst thing about all of this is that nothing will change. Beeston and AA will be back, they'll sign Morneau and a closer, maybe also Ervin Santana or something and call it an offseason.

 

Ya I'm not holding my breath that anything will be done but at this point not even the biggest retarded optimist like raysjays/digiblader can expect this inept FO to be able to turn this mess of a franchise into a contender. So something has to give, I hope...

[Boxcar]

yeah that's the problem with us toronto fans. we reward people for being mediocre. did we make the playoffs? bottom line is, HE FAILED!!

 

2006-08, if we had a proven manager, we would have made the playoffs or would have been in the hunt through september. this was proven by gaston coming in and leading us to a 51-37 record(best record in the majors after gibbons got fired). and we basically had the same team from 2006-08.

 

btw, i have been a blue jays fan since 1988. don't be so quick to judge, boy.

 

I've found that the older fans are generally dumber than the newer fans, and you are adding to that perception. Explain 2009, with Cito at the helm the entire year, which included a mutiny. That year doesn't count? Blaming the manager for everything just makes you look like a moron.

[EdelweissBouquet]

Remember the mutiny with Cito? If this veteran-laden team had enough of Gibbons we'd know.

 

 

How do you keep getting captain bligh and the bounty

mixed up with Cito and the bluejays ???

[Howard Roark]

Unfortunately, this is not really true. Rasmus being solid all season, a productive season from Lind, good years from Bautista and EE, a very good bullpen for most of the year. A lot has gone wrong to be sure, but it could have been worse, sadly.

 

I still don't thing Gibbons should be fired though. It would be pretty sad if he lost his job but Beeston and AA got to keep theirs.

 

True, I should have pointed out that I was thinking of the starting staff when I wrote that. The past 2 seasons have just been a shitshow of injury and under-performance from the starters, and it's been the source of our misery.

[Howard Roark]

what the f***? Are you guys f***ing stupid or what? What the f*** has gibbons done to deserve the praise and nut-hugging?!

 

fiyure teh manger!?!?1/!111?!?!?11!

[FireAlexAnthopoulos]

I'm all for a clean sweep of this organization, with Beeston, AA, Gibbons, and most of the players gone. I just will never understand the stick that some people have up their ass about holding Gibbons accountable at all. This season was a total franchise failure, and last I checked, Gibbons is part of the franchise just as much as the players and front office are.

[GD]

Gibbons is part of the franchise just as much as the players and front office are.

 

Maicer Izturis PA - 399

John Gibbons PA - N/A

 

Maicer Izturis fWAR - -2.2

John Gibbons fWAR - N/A

 

Trades completed by Alex Anthopoulos: Marlins deal, Mets deal, Gump deal, Yesco deal, Wells deal, Halladay deal, Morrow deal

Trades completed by John Gibbons: N/A

 

 

MANAGER. HE IS A MANAGER.

[ziggery]

Who is the manager that would have this group in the playoffs right now?

 

Tony Pena, because I think that he would not allow the ******** that goes on in the dugout even while his team is losing to the worst team in baseball. Someone needs to unite this team.

[ziggery]

Tony Pena

[EdelweissBouquet]

2008 under gibbons 35-39 in 74 games = roughly 76-86 in 162 games

2008 under gaston 51-37 in 88 games, which is approx 96-66 in 162 games

Seems that year, the manager did make a difference , but this is expected of a manager who won TWO world series, so no surprise here.

 

 

Now I did this from off the top of my head, no calculator, protractor or abacus used.

[torontofan]

Wow, this forum just went full derp.

[EdelweissBouquet]

2009 under Gaston: 75-87 and a clubhouse mutiny. Cito must have forgotten how to manage.

 

It's been said that a good manager can win

with a good team but a bad manager can turn

a good team into a mediocre one.

 

In 2009,a few players were whining that cito wasn't

communicating with them, not holding their hand

and spoon feeding them. Wow, whatever happened

to being real men ? Probably it was a small minority

that were disgruntled, but being the good union men

they were they stuck together.

Imagine a team of players that cried each time they

were not penciled in, or when they got relieved by

another pitcher? How successful would that team be?

2009 is when the me me culture was spawned in the

blue jays club house, and it still lingers on.

[GNick]

Gibbons clubs generally don't play well as a team. Same as when he was here before. Like the other day Lawrie sacrifice bunting with 2 hitters coming up who hitting around Mendoza line. Lawrie was red hot at time. Or Davis getting picked off 2b with Encarnacion at the plate. Been like that all year. Team is not mentally prepared. He's not the best of motivator