John_Havok

I don't have much to say on Bo, simply because it's very obvious he's going to free agency and there's less than a 0% chance he signs an extension. My rationale: 1) history of negotiations with him. he turned down raises in pre-arb years because he thought they weren't high enough and chose to earn league minimum to make a point (Manoah did too after his big year). 2) recent free agent deals signed by mid to late 20's aged shortstops.

John Schneider on MLB network radio at 11 am EDT if anyone is interested and wants to post a synopsis

I was checking his swing decisions on savant...it's the same thing we saw with multiple players last year, doing f*** all woth pitches over the heart of the plate and is terrible on the edges. 0 swing runs and -5 take runs on heart of the plate pitches. But you're right in that his other major issue is Sweet Spot LA. From ml average in 2022 and 2023 to...bottom of the barrel in 2024

And yet....you still need to score runs to win games. Regardless of the notion that great pitching can shut down great hitting, nobody wins a baseball game scoring 0 runs. Very few games are won scoring 1 run or even 2. Hell even 3 runs you're still on the s*** end of the stick more often than not.

I disagree to a point. Making better swing decisions would likely result in better quality contact and thus...and increase in some numbers. That, and cleaning up the hand movement.

Horwitz at 1b... just doesn't play imo. At 2B he's acceptable, but it would not surprise me to find out that he's not really all that good defensively there. Right now he's holding his own at +1 OAA. Offensively, pitchers have started adjusting to him over the past month (93 wrc+ for July after his scorching 165 in June) so we'll see how he adjusts back. So far in the august SSS he's at 101.

I was arguing with a buddy that he would have to do something pretty special to win the MVP as a DH only player. Looks like he just might.

Another notch in his favour for an extension. There's nothing that execs love more than guys who play every day at a high level. Same with Soto.

I'm not sure I like Loperfido in the2 spot, I think that's much more suited to a guy like Horwitz, whi, despite the lack of power will still take a walk if doesn't get anything to hit and probably set up better for a big inning. Might bounce into afew more DPs though too. That said, Loperfido does have a skillest that makes you think there's possible impact there. Not like Vlad level bat impact, but maybe 3-5 fWAR if it all clicks.

I agree to a few of these points, but it's also part of that hitting coach's and his staff's job to identify the causes of, and solutions to players slipping into funks, especially whether it's a physical change, or a mental one; preferably before they go into season long slumps I get there's variances and sometimes stuff just doesn't fall in for a week or two at a time, but guys like Vlad, Bo, Varsho, Kirk...all these guys have gone through stuff that isn't just explained away by a few weeks of random noise. Injury probably also a factor for Bo, but a few calf issues don't sink you from a 5 WAR guy to replacement level.

I think anytime a sentence starts with "Shocked the Angels (insert idiocy here) ...." it's not overly shocking

Unhappy for the fan that took that HR ball in the face though...

Judge. He's leading in virtually every statistical category. FWAR is close enough to be a wash.

Blue Jays respond vs. Yanks after pregame meeting Guerrero Jr.'s hit streak hits 15 as Toronto gets back in the win column August 2nd, 2024 David Adler David Adler Share NEW YORK -- In the aftermath of the Trade Deadline, which saw the Blue Jays become sellers for the first time in recent seasons, manager John Schneider called a meeting with the team's remaining veterans to circle the wagons. George Springer was there. Vladimir Guerrero Jr. was there. Kevin Gausman was there. Alejandro Kirk, José Berríos, Chris Bassitt, Chad Green and Daulton Varsho were there. "The guys that have been here for a while, from the start," Schneider said. Schneider wanted them to know there's still a plan -- and that plan is to win in 2025. He wanted to answer any questions they had about the team's direction. He wanted to reinforce that the Blue Jays are still here to compete, every day, and the team leaders need to set the example for all the young players trying to showcase themselves as members of the club's future. "[it was] basically answering any questions they had about what we did, and why," Schneider said. "And then, how much we're gonna rely on them to continue to go out and be prepared and show the way." And when Toronto took the field at Yankee Stadium on Friday, the team responded by winning the series opener against the Yankees, 8-5, a much-needed bounceback after they dropped three of four games to the Orioles on the first leg of their seven-game American League East road trip. "I think everybody came out of that feeling better," Gausman said of the meeting with Schneider. "Because the last couple of days before that were pretty rough." Guerrero set the tone in a rain-delayed game in New York, extending his hitting streak to 15 games right out of the gate. His RBI single off former teammate Marcus Stroman in the top of the first inning opened the scoring and gave Toronto a lead it would hold wire-to-wire. Toronto's All-Star first baseman's streak is tied for the longest active in the Majors -- the Royals' Bobby Witt Jr. and the Orioles' Colton Cowser also currently have 15-game streaks. Gausman, meanwhile, gutted through 4 2/3 innings on a night where he didn't have his best stuff, but was able to keep the Blue Jays ahead. After the game, the veteran right-hander didn't want to divulge the details of the team meeting, but he said he came away with questions answered. "That's between me and Schneids and the guys that were in that room. But there is a plan," Gausman said. "The meeting was more: We realized that we lost some guys, and it's been tough. This season isn't what we expected. But we're still here, and we're still looking forward. All we can do is set the precedent from here, going into the offseason and into next year." That's the veterans holding up their end of the bargain. And when Schneider called them together, he wanted to make sure they left the room knowing the Blue Jays' coaching staff will hold up its end, too. "All those guys are at a point in their career where they want to win," Schneider said. "Watching Vladdy play, watching George play, Varsh with the energy and the intent, we just wanted to make sure that [they know], 'Hey, we're still going out and trying to win.' "We are not a totally rebuilding team right now," added Schneider. "Our intention next year is to be right back in the area of this division to win. I think having them hear that, having them hear, 'We're coming in as a staff, we're never gonna stop preparing to win, expecting to win' -- I think they deserve that." And as for the young players -- they showed up on Friday, too. Joey Loperfido, who was acquired from the Astros in Toronto's Yusei Kikuchi trade on Monday, was a spark against the Yankees. Loperfido tripled in his first at-bat -- he then scored on Guerrero's single -- and finished 2-for-5 with the triple and two runs scored. Spencer Horwitz -- not a trade acquisition, of course, but a homegrown prospect who'll get plenty of run down the stretch as he vies to be a key part of the 2025 squad -- also had a big game. The 26-year-old went 2-for-5 with two RBIs and two runs scored. "Our young guys have been really fun to watch. I watch them get better every day," Gausman said. "But they still are young. So they're gonna have growing pains, just like we did when we were young. We're here for that. But it's about going out and competing, and those guys want to win every day." David Adler is a reporter for MLB.com

I'm trying to start a grass roots campaign to have the Bulls change their name to the Swallows.

Spitz just re-upped their sponsorship on the Lethbridge stadium for another 5 years. Just thought you'd like to know.

And to a much greater extent, once all those eyeballs are on the team, all the advertising and sponsorships they sell as a result. All the attention on the Rogers name in order to make billions of dollars per year. Of course no 1 player is responsible for all of it, but it sure helps to have 1 very recognizable face to focus on

One thing you're missing out of all those names though, none of them were 26 heading into FA and had been on the team since they were 20 years old. I get your overall point, but Vlads situation, like it or not, is different. The landscape is different than it was even 5 years ago, let alone 10, 15 and 20 years ago

Also, i feel the need to point out im not advocating for this kind of deal to be signed. Just that IF an extension is done, the type that I outlined could possibly satisfy all parties involved.

Some decent comparisons there, but in most of those cases, the team is either a) not a Luxury tax team and had to trade them, or had another (or multiple) franchise cornerstone(s) to build around. These types of deals though are largely ownership driven, and that's probably especially true in the case of Rogers, given their publicly owned nature.

Probably, but Biggio ended up as a super utility. When he was coming up with Vlad and Bo, Biggio's upside was certainly tantalizing.

Yeah I know, because as much as he's clearly not worth that money for on-field value, he is worth a ton off-field. I think there's a distinct possibility that he gets extended to a number that will shock people, but because of the structure, it won't really be a hamstring around their payroll. I proposed a basic framework a while back... 10 year deal 300 million, but the first 4 years is heavily front loaded, largely deferred, and has an opt out after those first 4 years. The idea being he gets his high AAV on paper, the jays get him for his physical peak years ( i use the term loosely in his case) and then the latter years he either opts out if he's still swinging it and looking for another FA deal... or stays on at a much lower AAV when it won't really matter as much.

Well yes and no. Yes, on paper 10/300 is 10/300. But if the jays are only paying him 10 million of the 30 AAV for the first ...5 years (to just randomly pick a number), then it's far better for the Jays. Vlad still gets his AAV on paper, but that other 100m cash comes way later when he's retired from the game.

Atkins didnt say it, the writer did.

Sure, there's only so many elite developmental minds to go around. I disagree on the Padres though. recently it's really the Dodgers and Houston that have sustained the most home-grown development while also winning. Braves ... they were in the early part of the 2000's but they've also been more cyclic in nature in the past 10. I guess my overall point is, Atkins did exactly what everyone is talking about and succeeded wildly with the 2021 team. It was largely home grown, cost controlled, supplemented with FAs. Just didnt go their way on the last day of the season. The disconnect now seems to be the argument between blowing it up and sucking again for 3+ years, or not.