Blue Jays (Gausman) vs Red Sox (Suarez): 7/26/26, 1:35pm

[Jays24]

5 minutes ago, Brownie19 said:

Where do those things rank v. having the worst offense in baseball?

It could have helped if JS tried moving Springer and Vlad down in the order temporarily or anything to get a different result.  

Having the worst offense in baseball would be an Atkins problem for not doing enough to improve on that end but we all know you wont blame him either.  This offense has been abysmal for 3.5 out of the past 4 years...

[Mr. Lahey]

14 minutes ago, Jays24 said:

It could have helped if JS tried moving Springer and Vlad down in the order temporarily or anything to get a different result.  

Having the worst offense in baseball would be an Atkins problem for not doing enough to improve on that end but we all know you wont blame him either.  This offense has been abysmal for 3.5 out of the past 4 years...

This. We can talk all day about pitching but if they keep hitting like this, they won’t win squat.

[hanton]

I don't quite understand what this means, maybe it would help if we knew the question?

why didn't they try and extend him then? unless he just wants to play this out and retire - but that's not good for us

[decosabute]

37 minutes ago, Jays24 said:

It could have helped if JS tried moving Springer and Vlad down in the order temporarily or anything to get a different result.  

Having the worst offense in baseball would be an Atkins problem for not doing enough to improve on that end but we all know you wont blame him either.  This offense has been abysmal for 3.5 out of the past 4 years...

We definitely needed another bat this past offseason and it's not hindsight - Atkins and co. were signalling as much in the winter when they went big to try to get Kyle Tucker. They knew it already then, so it's fair to say that we probably went in a little short in that department. But at some point, no front office or manager can legislate for the kind of insane black hole so many of our players have gone into. It's fair to say that six of our most dangerous hitters have either been at their career worst, or injured, or in Kirk's case, both. To have that many heavy hitters (Springer, Vlad, Kirk, Varsho, Barger, Santander) simultaneously go into the toilet, and/or the IL, is absolutely INSANE. There is no planning for it and not a whole hell of a lot you can do with it. 

I think it's also a little bit disingenuous to say that our offense was only good for a half season out of the last four. In 2022 the offense was high up in runs scored in all of MLB. In 2023 it was more average, but not terrible. 2024 sucked, granted, but 2025 we won the division, and were 4th in runs scored in the regular season, followed by absolutely exploding when it really counted in October. So I'd say it's really only two of the last five seasons (if we then include this one) where the offense has truly been "abysmal".

Also, I think that accusing Schneider of not moving Springer or Vlad is really picking at borderline irrelevant stuff. Those two have flat out sucked, but firstly, that's not the manager's fault. And secondly, almost everyone else has sucked too, so it's not like he was drowning in great options for leadoff or no. 3 hitters. Vlad and George were not suddenly going to have 1.000 OPSs just because you moved them down the order. I honestly don't think it would've made much or any difference. 

[DownSouthBlueJay]

We prolly dodged a bullet with Kyle Tucker.Almost had another overpaid bum lol

[Stangstag]

3 minutes ago, DownSouthBlueJay said:

We prolly dodged a bullet with Kyle Tucker

Likely, yeah lol. Always thought him getting anything close to 300mil was crazy talk. 

[G-Snarls]

16 minutes ago, Stangstag said:

Likely, yeah lol. Always thought him getting anything close to 300mil was crazy talk. 

101 wRC+ and 0.9 fWAR so far this year 

I mean he'll have better seasons than that but they're paying him like the perennial 4-5 WAR player he used to be and he might never be that again. 

[decosabute]

6 minutes ago, DownSouthBlueJay said:

We prolly dodged a bullet with Kyle Tucker.Almost had another overpaid bum lol

True.

But the point was more that it's valid to say (not hindsight) that we could've done with one more big bat, and that the Front Office seemed to at least partly feel that way too.

[Stangstag]

1 minute ago, G-Snarls said:

101 wRC+ and 0.9 fWAR so far this year 

I mean he'll have better seaaons than that but they're paying like the perennial 4-5 WAR player he used to be and he might never be that again. 

 

2 minutes ago, G-Snarls said:

101 wRC+ and 0.9 fWAR so far this year 

I mean he'll have better seaaons than that but they're paying like the perennial 4-5 WAR player he used to be and he might never be that again. 

Imagine having both him and Vlad locked up, and not even knowing if you can rely on either of them anymore in year 1 of 10 loll

we were very close to paying 70mil per year for Vlad+Tucker for the next 10 years

[metafour]

50 minutes ago, Jays24 said:

This offense has been abysmal for 3.5 out of the past 4 years...

Sorry bud, but this is categorically false.

From January 1st. 2022 to today (ie: 2022 to 2026); the Jays are:

6th in team wRC+ (107)

12th in runs scored (3405)

2nd in team BA (.255)

3rd in team OBP (.323)

8th in team SLG (.411)

And those stats obviously include this year's comically bad offense.

Clearly Atkins should have foresaw that Guerrero was going to follow up his elite 2025 postseason performance by putting up his worst season ever (by a long margin), and the remainder of the core position players would all either get hurt, or regress comically.

The only way for Atkins to prevent what you have seen so far would have been for him to replace ~80% of the hitters from last year's WS team. Wow, I can't believe he didn't have to foresight to plan for this happening!

Its just a lost s*** season, genius. It happens. In fact, the post World Series slump in baseball is absurd. From 1999 to 2024, 12 of the 25 teams that WON the World Series failed to make the playoffs the very next season. This type of poor season isn't even an outlier. In 2023 the Rangers won the WS, and in 2024 they didn't even make the playoffs. The same thing happened to the 2020 Nationals.

In 2025 the team got hot and everything clicked. This year, nothing has gone right. Both from an injury perspective, or from the perspective of players playing up to their ability. And no, Vladimir Guerrero hitting for a sub 100 wRC+ for most of the season was not a reasonable expectation for anyone.

[Brownie19]

29 minutes ago, metafour said:

Sorry bud, but this is categorically false.

From January 1st. 2022 to today (ie: 2022 to 2026); the Jays are:

6th in team wRC+ (107)

12th in runs scored (3405)

2nd in team BA (.255)

3rd in team OBP (.323)

8th in team SLG (.411)

And those stats obviously include this year's comically bad offense.

Clearly Atkins should have foresaw that Guerrero was going to follow up his elite 2025 postseason performance by putting up his worst season ever (by a long margin), and the remainder of the core position players would all either get hurt, or regress comically.

The only way for Atkins to prevent what you have seen so far would have been for him to replace ~80% of the hitters from last year's WS team. Wow, I can't believe he didn't have to foresight to plan for this happening!

Its just a lost s*** season, genius. It happens. In fact, the post World Series slump in baseball is absurd. From 1999 to 2024, 12 of the 25 teams that WON the World Series failed to make the playoffs the very next season. This type of poor season isn't even an outlier. In 2023 the Rangers won the WS, and in 2024 they didn't even make the playoffs. The same thing happened to the 2020 Nationals.

In 2025 the team got hot and everything clicked. This year, nothing has gone right. Both from an injury perspective, or from the perspective of players playing up to their ability. And no, Vladimir Guerrero hitting for a sub 100 wRC+ for most of the season was not a reasonable expectation for anyone.

[Jays24]

41 minutes ago, metafour said:

Sorry bud, but this is categorically false.

From January 1st. 2022 to today (ie: 2022 to 2026); the Jays are:

6th in team wRC+ (107)

12th in runs scored (3405)

2nd in team BA (.255)

3rd in team OBP (.323)

8th in team SLG (.411)

And those stats obviously include this year's comically bad offense.

Clearly Atkins should have foresaw that Guerrero was going to follow up his elite 2025 postseason performance by putting up his worst season ever (by a long margin), and the remainder of the core position players would all either get hurt, or regress comically.

The only way for Atkins to prevent what you have seen so far would have been for him to replace ~80% of the hitters from last year's WS team. Wow, I can't believe he didn't have to foresight to plan for this happening!

Its just a lost s*** season, genius. It happens. In fact, the post World Series slump in baseball is absurd. From 1999 to 2024, 12 of the 25 teams that WON the World Series failed to make the playoffs the very next season. This type of poor season isn't even an outlier. In 2023 the Rangers won the WS, and in 2024 they didn't even make the playoffs. The same thing happened to the 2020 Nationals.

In 2025 the team got hot and everything clicked. This year, nothing has gone right. Both from an injury perspective, or from the perspective of players playing up to their ability. And no, Vladimir Guerrero hitting for a sub 100 wRC+ for most of the season was not a reasonable expectation for anyone.

3.5 years means 2023 until now.  Im not counting 2022 when we were obviously good.  Not sure how you and the other person both stated 2022 in your responses lol.  

Feel free to tell me that we were a good offensive team in 2023/2024, around half of 2025 and then all of this season.