General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2024)

[Brownie19]

I wouldn't be opposed to doing this except not trading Vlad, Kirk, Manoah low, or Davis Schneider high. Everyone else no problem. You could get fair value for them and start the rebuild.

 

Just can't sell Vlad, Kirk, Manoah this low.

 

I don't think the Jays will be able to fix Vlad. He's a f***ing loser. Biggest waste of talent in the MLB in the past 20 years (maybe ever?). I'm told the team can't force him to lose weight or train properly in the offseason. He isn't coachable - I'm told he won't listen to anything the FO or coach staff tells him and just wants his Uncle to coach him (and tell him what he wants to hear). It also appears he's too f***ing stupid to realize there's a major issue that he needs to address, so it seems doubtful he'll change his routine. He'll be f***ing around in the DR all winter with his buddies, playing home run derby on some s***** sandlot. He's either too stupid, doesn't care, or both. Trade him now before he repeats 2023 and the league knows he's a joke. Someone has to think right now that they can buy low and turn him into 2021 Vlad again - take advantage of that.

 

And what's hilarious is the Manoah situation may actually be worse than the Vlad situation! That fat f*** is clueless. You just know he was a f***ing loser in HS and College - he was probably a virgin going into College. The big, tall, awkward, overweight guy with no friends. Suddenly he grows into his body a bit, has some great results on the mound, gets drafted in the 1st round and now that he has some money, he decides to change his personality. He goes out and gets a massive arm tattoo and decides to be the guy with the big attitude and ego who's a mean, tough dude. Until he eats himself out of the majors and now is going through an identity crisis where he's a loser once again and everyone hates him.

 

Keep Kirk if you want. He seems to be the one you could fix. Had a kid right before seasons started and that probably f***ed with him sleeping habits and was stressful to be away from the family all year.

 

Firing coaches is a joke, but I get that will happen. Wish MLB was more like the NFL were players contracts aren't guaranteed and there are consequences for s***** results. Hold the players accountable.

 

No FO is going to be able to overcome the complete collapse of 3 young star players. Unfortunately, it's over, restart.

Edited September 15, 2023 by Brownie19

[jaysblue]

I wouldn't change a thing. Sign all the FA's to one year deals and lets try this again!

 

Sign Ohtani to a monster contract and he will fix everything

[wilko]

Sign Ohtani to a monster contract and he will fix everything

 

Yes. Also, I wouldn't let him be a two way player anymore.

[bigshot84]

then he wont come to blue jays, he wants to be two way player

[bigshot84]

plus John Scheneider needs to get fired too

[wilko]

then he wont come to blue jays, he wants to be two way player

 

You lock him in with a deal and the promise he can do whatever he wants. Once he signs the deal, you aggressively force him to pick pitching or hitting.

[bigshot84]

for long term plan is good

 

i prefer him as hitter DH what do you prefer

[wilko]

for long term plan is good

 

i prefer him as hitter DH what do you prefer

 

To maximize his potential, DH is the way.

[bigshot84]

do you think government needs to change plan of taxation for players? they dont come to blue jays due to tax sometimes

[Olerud363]

I wouldn't change a thing. Sign all the FA's to one year deals and lets try this again!

 

I have no clue at this point. I'd be open to this. The free agents have all been great. Maybe even Chapman takes a QO.

 

I'd also be open to a major rebuild, with the intention of a quick turn around. Jays all of a sudden have a good collection of major league ready young talent. Not saying the talent is going to be all that but supplement it with what you can get for Bo, Springer, Berrios, Gausman, Romano, Mayza, Kikuchi, etc.

 

Then go wild on the pitching and hitting labs, see what you have in everyone even Bowden Francis, even Mitch White.

 

I know others think it's hopeless but try rebuilding Vlad's value, let him have fun with young guys for a few months with no pressure.

[Brownie19]

do you think government needs to change plan of taxation for players? they dont come to blue jays due to tax sometimes

 

are you f***ing retarded?

[Olerud363]

are you f***ing retarded?

 

I've never figured out if this guy is just a English speaker giving a massive multi year troll job, or a English as a second language guy, who didn't grow up on baseball so his messages are a bit simple and unsophisticated.

 

I guess I lean towards the former, as there has been zero evolution or learning about the game for this person since they started the posting.

[BCZ]

I think Atkins, Schneider and the coaching staff have to go. I've been asking Shapiro to please resign, but I do not think that will realistically happen.

 

I think the entire organization needs to revamp their focus on player development including development at the major league level and game preparation. Every organization (except the Rockies) is supersmart, and you need people who will stay up all night, put everything they have into it, getting the resources the players need to be their best.

 

You also will maybe have to make unconventional decisions.

 

I don't even care what permutation of players they end up with. Payroll should remain high. They should try to win next year, but what will lead to winning is having every asset perform at their highest level possible.

 

Notably this year

 

1. 3 young players, all with weight issues have seen their careers crash, these three players should have been worth 10 wins combined, maybe 15 but were 0. There is some tough love needed here in terms of attitude, dedication to fitness, ability to receive instruction and maybe some load management. Maybe Vlad should not be playing 160 games. Maybe Manoah should not have pitched 190 innings last year.

 

2. Another young hitter Varsho, crashed with respect to previous MLB performance and minor league stats.

 

3. Team since 2020 has performed awful in late season important series. I'm considering here WildCard 2020, Yankees home series 2021, WildCard 2022, and Rangers Series 2023. Season has to end sometime. But all these series were essentially the first elimination series of the year, and Jays are 0/4. Something psychological?

 

4. Jays team power is way down and the problem is not the collection of players. Varsho, Chapman, Vlad, Kirk, Springer even Bo are at career low for ISO. Compare to Braves everyone at career high as a group.

 

5. With Pearson maybe healthy (or who knows), and Tiederman maybe healthy (who knows) you need a front office who can get the most out of guys like this, neither is in any way ready for a starters workload, but in 2024 get the most out of them and use them in creative ways to compliment the weaknesses of the current starters.

 

Whatever the case need a front office and on field management that is creative, unconventional, cares about the players, has great people skills, can communicate with the fans, and will stay up ALL f***ING NIGHT, knowing it's a game of war with the other front offices.

 

tldr

[BCZ]

I don't think the Jays will be able to fix Vlad. He's a f***ing loser. Biggest waste of talent in the MLB in the past 20 years (maybe ever?). I'm told the team can't force him to lose weight or train properly in the offseason. He isn't coachable - I'm told he won't listen to anything the FO or coach staff tells him and just wants his Uncle to coach him (and tell him what he wants to hear). It also appears he's too f***ing stupid to realize there's a major issue that he needs to address, so it seems doubtful he'll change his routine. He'll be f***ing around in the DR all winter with his buddies, playing home run derby on some s***** sandlot. He's either too stupid, doesn't care, or both. Trade him now before he repeats 2023 and the league knows he's a joke. Someone has to think right now that they can buy low and turn him into 2021 Vlad again - take advantage of that.

 

And what's hilarious is the Manoah situation may actually be worse than the Vlad situation! That fat f*** is clueless. You just know he was a f***ing loser in HS and College - he was probably a virgin going into College. The big, tall, awkward, overweight guy with no friends. Suddenly he grows into his body a bit, has some great results on the mound, gets drafted in the 1st round and now that he has some money, he decides to change his personality. He goes out and gets a massive arm tattoo and decides to be the guy with the big attitude and ego who's a mean, tough dude. Until he eats himself out of the majors and now is going through an identity crisis where he's a loser once again and everyone hates him.

 

Keep Kirk if you want. He seems to be the one you could fix. Had a kid right before seasons started and that probably f***ed with him sleeping habits and was stressful to be away from the family all year.

 

Firing coaches is a joke, but I get that will happen. Wish MLB was more like the NFL were players contracts aren't guaranteed and there are consequences for s***** results. Hold the players accountable.

 

No FO is going to be able to overcome the complete collapse of 3 young star players. Unfortunately, it's over, restart.

 

tldr

[Olerud363]

tldr

 

Yo Bro! Fire Shapiro.

[bigshot84]

fire Shapiro, atikins and John Scheneider

[BigCecil]

I have no clue at this point. I'd be open to this. The free agents have all been great. Maybe even Chapman takes a QO.

 

I'd also be open to a major rebuild, with the intention of a quick turn around. Jays all of a sudden have a good collection of major league ready young talent. Not saying the talent is going to be all that but supplement it with what you can get for Bo, Springer, Berrios, Gausman, Romano, Mayza, Kikuchi, etc.

 

Then go wild on the pitching and hitting labs, see what you have in everyone even Bowden Francis, even Mitch White.

 

I know others think it's hopeless but try rebuilding Vlad's value, let him have fun with young guys for a few months with no pressure.

 

I’d be ok with this I think as well. Need some dust to settle first to let this all sink in. I still think 2021 was probably our best shot and most dangerous team. Never know.

[bigshot84]

well i grew up with baseball and me and other guy at work thinks same , they need new good manager next year

[bigshot84]

just think about it , if 2 teams offer same contract would you pay more tax or less tax?

[Brownie19]

well i grew up with baseball and me and other guy at work thinks same , they need new good manager next year

 

You and your co-worker think the government needs to change their tax rules so the Jays can attract more free agents? I hope you work at Wendy's.

[bigshot84]

good luck!

[THANOS]

Stick a fork in these losers! Outscored 35-9 during the sweep. Here's some ideas for 2024:

 

-Dump Schneider. He sealed his fate after he gave the most Low T answer of all time yesterday when he said he wasn't concerned after we got blown out.

 

-Last offseason we broke up the barrio and added a bunch of guys with very vanilla personalities. Now we've got Varsho, Whit, Belt, etc. BORING. We need to get some ass kickers back on the team. Maybe bring back Donaldson to play some 3B. We should also add a crazy reliever. Someone with a penchant for starting brawls. Manoah was a good guy to have but no one takes him serious anymore after he ballooned up to 385 lbs.

 

-We also need a shakeup trade. The Springer, Bo, Vlad Jr., Kirk, Jansen core has all been here for 3 years now and it ain't working. No idea who you trade and for what though.

 

-Sign Joey Votto. I don't care just sign him.

 

-Atkins is a toss up to me. I liked all his offseason moves. I think the player development is pretty solid. But for some reason the analytics just aren't translating into on field success for the veterans. This lineup should be pretty good and it's not.

 

Your last paragraph seems to point pretty clearly at the coaching. I'm sure the FO knows what's wrong, but the coaching hasn't been able to explain it in an easy and simple way for the the players to digest and consistently implement.

 

This is the heart of the issue.

[Stangstag]

Chapman

Merrifield

Belt

Keirmaier

 

All these you have to let walk. Don't be stupid. I'm sure Atkins will let them depart.

 

Agreed

[Stangstag]

just think about it , if 2 teams offer same contract would you pay more tax or less tax?

 

Wow I don’t think i’ve EVER thought about that. NEVER.

[jaysblue]

You lock him in with a deal and the promise he can do whatever he wants. Once he signs the deal, you aggressively force him to pick pitching or hitting.

 

If he doesn't choose one, you lock Ohtani in a room with Nickelback tracks on full blast. He'll pick one in a heartbeat after!

[jaysblue]

do you think government needs to change plan of taxation for players? they dont come to blue jays due to tax sometimes

 

Some players prefer signing in certain states as well that don't have a state income tax. Texas for example.

 

In Canada, the USD goes further here but yeah the taxes are higher than in the States. Something some players consider for sure.

[jaysblue]

Have no problem with Chapman accepting the QO if he doesn't get a multi-year deal. He's still a valuable piece even if his bat isn't that great. Just don't rely on him as a No. 4, 5 or 6 bat in the lineup.

[jaysblue]

You and your co-worker think the government needs to change their tax rules so the Jays can attract more free agents? I hope you work at Wendy's.

 

Didn't Trudeau beg Taylor Swift on social media to include Canadian cities on her tour? I mean if the PM can do that, for sure he could lower taxes to attract MLB free agents to the Blue Jays. Its not out of the question haha.

[Ryu In My House]

fire Shapiro, atikins and John Scheneider

 

That will fix things.

[Ryu In My House]

Agreed

 

Keirmaier I would keep. He fits in well, and we have no one on the farm, do we? Wasn't our last good OF prospect Travis Snider? Pompey?