Blue Jays trade for... Steven Matz?

[connorp]

I mean, I'm hopeful they view Matz as a pen guy and they wanted another lefty which would make sense. If they have him slotted in as a rotation guy, I'm baffled.

 

Same was said of Chatwood. Doubt they signed/acquired both thinking they were RP depth

[BTS]

This trade with the mets is very bad. Giving up way to much for a pitcher with a losing record.

ERA over 4.40. And two or the three pitchers are in the jays top 30. With last years trades for the jays at

the dead line giving up more top prospects. Never have agreed with giving up prospects for players

for two or three months. VERY STUPID.

 

Diaz and SRF were candidates to be removed from the 40-man. They don't have any value. Winckowski is the only piece you'd actually call a prospect, and he's organizational filler.

 

This is basically a FA signing. The criticism of the trade is that you don't want to pay Matz 5M, not that you think they gave up too much.

[Captain Adama]

Great trade for the Mets. Let's them free up 5m that will go to Bauer. I thought Shatkins would be looking to get a #2 not a #5 that the team has like plenty of.

 

Lol if you think 5M is the difference between signing Bauer or not.

[Ray]

Definition of a meh trade. Mets get very little. We get very little. Nothing worth losing sleep over.

 

Still hoping we get another mid-rotation starter.

[TwistedLogic]

 

Andy Martino

@martinonyc

 

The Blue Jays are taking on almost al of Steven Matz’s $5.2 million salary, per source.

 

Yeah, I'd rather they not have done this. Should have just cut the guys to open roster space and saved the 5M until they knew they were done spending. A guy like Matz isn't going anywhere and you can get that type of arm at any point.

 

Of course, that's assuming they don't have some magic key to fix Matz and they specifically wanted him for that reason.

[Laika]

Definition of a meh trade. Mets get very little. We get very little. Nothing worth losing sleep over.

 

Still hoping we get another mid-rotation starter.

 

This is a projected upgrade on the 2021 roster though. SRF and Diaz are about replacement level, Matz is about a 1 WAR guy.

 

The realistic upside of both SRF and Diaz is 0.5 WAR reliever, Matz' upside is 3 win SP

[itaos]

Lol if you think 5M is the difference between signing Bauer or not.

 

Of course Cohen can spend whatever he wants. But if they're both theoretically competing for the same free agent player, why would you help the other team out

[Captain Adama]

Of course Cohen can spend whatever he wants. But if they're both theoretically competing for the same free agent player, why would you help the other team out

 

I'm willing to bet the Jays are out of the running for Bauer.

[max silver]

Hard to get excited about this trade either way, the main accomplishment seems to be clearing out a few spots on the 40 man roster. Sent out are two expendable relievers and a prospect who might profile as a back of the rotation arm if things break right. Coming back is a back of the rotation candidate, maybe Matz can be moved to the bullpen and have his stuff play up as a power lefty some day. With the Jays needing innings out of the rotation and Matz only having one year of control remaining this doesn't look like the year for that to happen though.

[Norman]

Diaz and Winckowski are going to players to watch. Diaz is recovering from tjs still.

But Winckowski has been improving ever year. And will be a number 1 or 2 pitcher,

Just like Noah when the jays traded for RA Dickey.

[Jimcanuck]

Of course Cohen can spend whatever he wants. But if they're both theoretically competing for the same free agent player, why would you help the other team out

 

Again, 1 year of Matz @ $5M doesn't make a shred of difference on whether the Jays spend $160M over 6 years or whatever it is on Bauer.

[Jimcanuck]

Diaz and Winckowski are going to players to watch. Diaz is recovering from tjs still.

But Winckowski has been improving ever year. And will be a number 1 or 2 pitcher,

Just like Noah when the jays traded for RA Dickey.

 

Hottest of hot takes.

[Ray]

This is a projected upgrade on the 2021 roster though. SRF and Diaz are about replacement level, Matz is about a 1 WAR guy.

 

The realistic upside of both SRF and Diaz is 0.5 WAR reliever, Matz' upside is 3 win SP

 

Right, there's some legitimate upside to Matz which makes him interesting. Also had a velo bump in 2020 and it's seems like his movement profile hasn't changed. Just got hammered for whatever reason.

 

I trust the front office's valuations here completely. Just need to let it play out.

[Grant77]

This is one of those trades where you just have to wait and see. SRF and Diaz had to go one way or another, so it's not like we gave up a ton.

 

If Matz pitches well then the trade is a big success. If he doesn't then it's not. Clearly they like his arm and have a plan for him, so we just have to trust that it will work out.

[King]

We just going to discount Big Winc as a non prospect?

[wilko]

[max silver]

Right, there's some legitimate upside to Matz which makes him interesting. Also had a velo bump in 2020 and it's seems like his movement profile hasn't changed. Just got hammered for whatever reason.

 

I trust the front office's valuations here completely. Just need to let it play out.

 

From looking at the heat maps pitch location appears to be an issue for Matz in 2020. His primary pitch is a sinker, and the majority of them looked to be placed from the belt and up. And with his slider the majority were up in the zone as well.

[Jayzfan79]

This move is offseason filler and doesn't impact any additional moves....people treating this as if it is a game changer.

[BTS]

We just going to discount Big Winc as a non prospect?

 

 

Meh. His results in 2019 were just OK and Longenhagen didn't even have him in the Jays top-39 a few weeks ago. I think he might have been a bit overrated here because he took the time to chat with some of the forum guys and came off as likeable while doing it.

[THANOS]

This trade with the mets is very bad. Giving up way to much for a pitcher with a losing record.

ERA over 4.40. And two or the three pitchers are in the jays top 30. With last years trades for the jays at

the dead line giving up more top prospects. Never have agreed with giving up prospects for players

for two or three months. VERY STUPID.

 

There's still time to delete this post. Hurry, before too many notice.

[L54]

Looks like an accumulation of guys who they can utilize in 2-3 inning roles and mitigate against injury

 

Matz

Chatwood

Ray

Stripling

Pearson

 

Building depth. They’ll probably sign one guy who will be considered a more traditional starter but this is what we’re working with in my opinion

[THANOS]

Diaz and Winckowski are going to players to watch. Diaz is recovering from tjs still.

But Winckowski has been improving ever year. And will be a number 1 or 2 pitcher,

Just like Noah when the jays traded for RA Dickey.

 

Ok this tops the last post. Bravo

[Grant77]

Looks like an accumulation of guys who they can utilize in 2-3 inning roles and mitigate against injury

 

Matz

Chatwood

Ray

Stripling

Pearson

 

Building depth. They’ll probably sign one guy who will be considered a more traditional starter but this is what we’re working with in my opinion

 

It sure looks like last year's SP usage will be the normal for us going forward and not just a one-off strategy for the shortened season.

[Orgfiller]

Meh. His results in 2019 were just OK and Longenhagen didn't even have him in the Jays top-39 a few weeks ago. I think he might have been a bit overrated here because he took the time to chat with some of the forum guys and came off as likeable while doing it.

 

This. If Winckowski doesn't appear on Radio Scouts no one on this board cares that he's included here. He's even rule 5 eligible, so would need to be added to the 40-man soon anyway.

[Jays24]

Looks like an accumulation of guys who they can utilize in 2-3 inning roles and mitigate against injury

 

Matz

Chatwood

Ray

Stripling

Pearson

 

Building depth. They’ll probably sign one guy who will be considered a more traditional starter but this is what we’re working with in my opinion

 

A very unentertaining method. I was hoping baseball went away from this crap tbh. Looks like well be using the opener method for a lot of our starts.

[L54]

It sure looks like last year's SP usage will be the normal for us going forward and not just a one-off strategy for the shortened season.

 

I don’t think it necessarily will always be rotation by committee. The Jays just don’t have the guys who you are confident rolling out every five days for 5+ innings.

[BTS]

A very unentertaining method. I was hoping baseball went away from this crap tbh. Looks like well be using the opener method for a lot of our starts.

 

I don't think they're married to it. They just don't have the horses. They'll always try to get Ryu into the 6th or 7th. Pearson is going to chew up innings if he pans out. The rest of the guys just aren't good enough to push to 180 or 200 innings. If they land Bauer and Robbie Ray starts to look like pre-2020 Robbie Ray then they'll get lots of mileage from the rotation. If those things don't happen, they have do make to with what they have, and given the current personnel that's probably a lot of <5 inning starts.

[GeorgiaPeach]

Fastball was up to 95 last year. That's 1-2 mph more than his career norm. Best K-BB of his career as well.

 

He gave up a ton of loud contact though. He could have been tipping or something. He could also probably drop his fastball usage as well.

 

Based on his pitch usage and his numbers getting worse as his career has worn on. He's slowly got away from throwing his FB as often and slowly increased the use of his CH, 25+% of the time.

 

Not sure if there's a correlation there?

[L54]

A very unentertaining method. I was hoping baseball went away from this crap tbh. Looks like well be using the opener method for a lot of our starts.

 

Want to know what’s entertaining? Winning baseball games.

 

Look, I’m probably one of the more traditional fans of the game here and I’d love to watch guys log 200 innings year in and year out. But I’d rather watch the Jays compete via any means necessary than complain about the way the game is evolving.

[Jays24]

I don't think they're married to it. They just don't have the horses. They'll always try to get Ryu into the 6th or 7th. Pearson is going to chew up innings if he pans out. The rest of the guys just aren't good enough to push to 180 or 200 innings. If they land Bauer and Robbie Ray starts to look like pre-2020 Robbie Ray then they'll get lots of mileage from the rotation. If those things don't happen, they have do make to with what they have, and given the current personnel that's probably a lot of <5 inning starts.

 

Ya I agree with you. I'm just not a fan of watching that sort of baseball. We got Ryu and maybe Pearson depending on how he looks but the rest are a bunch of guys who might get to go through the order once lol.