General 2020 Blue Jays Discussion Thread

[Olerud363]

Maybe spring training? Or we might have to wait and see where they are placed next season to start off. The coaching staff and org probably(should) have a good grasp on it though at the moment.

 

Probably they'll be put in double a, but if they do well they will be inline for a quick call-up after service time date has passed.

 

Given what they did with Kirk, they are evaluating based on age and year despite the missing minor league season.

 

So Manoah and SWR will be treated almost as if they did have minor league year last year.

[Orgfiller]

Ross Atkins on Tim and Sid just confirmed that our internal metrics have Lourdes Gurriel Jr. and Teoscar Hernandez as slightly above average defenders, but Grichuk was average in CF.

 

- when given the choice, his priority was starting pitching but didn't want to diminish the pitching depth that we have acquired and developed

- not worried about Vladdy, they're still impressed with his hitting given his age (obviously they know it's not the ideal hitting profile)

- in an ideal scenario Vladdy comes in next season and he gets reps at 3B

- raving about Biggio's versatility. Said he was average or above at all of his positions

- committed to Bo at SS, but did not rule out acquiring an elite defensive SS. Feels very good about Bo being our SS going forward

- thinks the team is in a very good position to get better (in the offseason)

- Mark Shapiro fellatio session

Edited October 2, 2020 by Orgfiller

[Spanky99]

Ross Atkins on Tim and Sid just confirmed that our internal metrics have Lourdes Gurriel Jr. and Teoscar Hernandez as slightly above average defenders, but Grichuk was average in CF.

And Vlad is coming in next year as a 3rd baseman, I caught the end of that, did I hear that right?

[dineke]

Ross wants Vlad to come back next year and play third base... Sure

[dineke]

nd Vlad is coming in next year as a 3rd baseman, I caught the end of that, did I hear that right?

 

Yeah he said that's the goal

[glory]

They should have had him just play 3B this year since he had no time to learn 1B, and make the transition in 2021. They should just pick a spot for him and then work on his hitting.

[Spanky99]

They should have had him just play 3B this year since he had no time to learn 1B, and make the transition in 2021. They should just pick a spot for him and then work on his hitting.

 

Meh, if he had stayed in shape it was his, that's on Vladito, the brass sent a message, and he admitted his fault.

[Spanky99]

I'm glad Atkins brought up payroll and "winning in this market now" several times and Shapiro's on board, lets go Rogers, open up that wallet!

[dineke]

I'm glad Atkins brought up payroll and "winning in this market now" several times and Shapiro's on board, lets go Rogers, open up that wallet!

 

Lindor incoming?

[Spanky99]

Lindor incoming?

 

Bauer?

[Spanky99]

Springer?

[Jays24]

These are good goals for Vlad. He will have lot of downtime to work on his defense so might as well make him aim high. It should help with the weight loss because he must have saw he is a below average player in he's fat. Worst case, he goes back to 1B.

 

But from what we saw, doubt he can stay at 3B. 1B will be his position.

[saskjayfan]

Bauer?

 

The offseason seems pretty straight forward. Sign Bauer. Trade for Lynn once you've signed Bauer. Sign Hendricks or Colome. It's probably not that easy though..lol.

[glory]

Bauer?

 

He would be the ideal fit for the Jays needs, but I can't see him signing with the Jays.

 

Lindor is more likely. His final year of arb is going to be very expensive, and teams like the Indians are going to feel the Covid losses more than bigger markets. Almost a certainty that they'll trade him. What it would take to get him, and whether the Jays would pay (in prospects) for a rental, or pay him what it would take to keep him long term, is the question. But he definitely seems like a realistic target, and a great fit for the roster itself (vetrin presents at age 27).

[Bturn2210]

Bauer, Lindor, or Arenado would be the dream this off season.

[saskjayfan]

He would be the ideal fit for the Jays needs, but I can't see him signing with the Jays.

 

Lindor is more likely. His final year of arb is going to be very expensive, and teams like the Indians are going to feel the Covid losses more than bigger markets. Almost a certainty that they'll trade him. What it would take to get him, and whether the Jays would pay (in prospects) for a rental, or pay him what it would take to keep him long term, is the question. But he definitely seems like a realistic target, and a great fit for the roster itself (vetrin presents at age 27).

 

I'm curious what people think Lindor's asking price would be. It's still going to be pretty high. Where are Bauer's potential landing spots?

[Laika]

I'm curious what people think Lindor's asking price would be. It's still going to be pretty high. Where are Bauer's potential landing spots?

 

The trade and contract markets for Lindor were basically set by the Machado situation

[connorp]

I’d take Springer over Lindor in a second. The former won’t cost major prospect(s) and will likely come with a contract you can swallow. Lindor will prob want some 8 year deal/extension or something easy

 

What are chances Houston let’s Springer walk anyway? Obviously if everyone else is healthy they could absorb the loss

[connorp]

The trade and contract markets for Lindor were basically set by the Machado situation

 

If that’s the case it prob helps Lindor’s cause that MM wasn’t meh again this year

[Laika]

If that’s the case it prob helps Lindor’s cause that MM wasn’t meh again this year

 

It probably does not hurt him that the Machado and Harper mega contracts did not turn into immediate nightmares, yeah.

 

The 2021 free agent class isn't amazing at the top (Realmuto, Springer, Bauer...) but the 2022 class COULD be insane. I think for shortstops alone Francisco Lindor, Javier Baez, Carlos Correa, Corey Seager, and Trevor Story could all be FA!?

[saskjayfan]

It probably does not hurt him that the Machado and Harper mega contracts did not turn into immediate nightmares, yeah.

 

The 2021 free agent class isn't amazing at the top (Realmuto, Springer, Bauer...) but the 2022 class COULD be insane. I think for shortstops alone Francisco Lindor, Javier Baez, Carlos Correa, Corey Seager, and Trevor Story could all be FA!?

 

2022 free agent pitchers Syndergaard, Zach Davies, McCullers, Jon Gray, Dylan Bundy.....but then the old guard. Pay me for short term, I'm still damn good. Kershaw, Scherzer, Greinke, Verlander, Lynn and Kluber if he somehow gets over his injury problems and has a good season next year could join the list.

 

2022 has a lot of intriguing starting pitchers. It's kind of why I think the Jays have a shot at Bauer this year. Given Covid, the impending free agents next year and the challenges that come with "the Bauer hour" personality, the Jays have a shot. We have to promise him 4 to 7 extra starts. How is that going to go over with your team? Pearson and Ryu are both guys who can use extra days. You add Bauer and you sign another vet or two who are on board.

 

I don't see a fit with the Yankees. I could see the Red Sox as being in on Bauer though. I don't think he fits with the Dodgers. The phillies, Angels, Twins and Mets could be in. I don't think Washington will be in.

 

Bauer's market is going to be interesting for sure.

[Spanky99]

The trade and contract markets for Lindor were basically set by the Machado situation

 

I'd expect more than what the Dodgers paid, as it would be a full season of Lindor, not a couple months.

[Laika]

I'd expect more than what the Dodgers paid, as it would be a full season of Lindor, not a couple months.

 

I dunno, it’s not like Mookie Betts cost a Kings ransom

[Spanky99]

I dunno, it’s not like Mookie Betts cost a Kings ransom

 

Oh, I wouldn't be upset if we took him on for a season or more, lol. If the price were a bit more than what the Dodgers gave up, I'd be down. Lindor would be dreamy on this club, move Bichette to 3rd and that solves the left side of the infield. Next sign Bauer and Springer! *Big Dreams*

[dineke]

I dunno, it’s not like Mookie Betts cost a Kings ransom

 

Didn't the price come down because the Red Sox wanted to get rid of the price contract too? And they still got Alex Verdugo who is a stud. Anyways, I wouldn't be sad if we gave up Cavan+ for Lindor if we could sign him to a long term contract.

[G-Snarls]

Didn't the price come down because the Red Sox wanted to get rid of the price contract too? And they still got Alex Verdugo who is a stud. Anyways, I wouldn't be sad if we gave up Cavan+ for Lindor if we could sign him to a long term contract.

 

Yes. Dodgers definitely gave up less by taking on Price with him.

 

Not sure if the Dodgers knew at the time that they could get him to sign a long term deal either.

 

Plus he was already going to make big $. These superstar arb-3 players get huge paydays now.

[Laika]

Didn't the price come down because the Red Sox wanted to get rid of the price contract too? And they still got Alex Verdugo who is a stud. Anyways, I wouldn't be sad if we gave up Cavan+ for Lindor if we could sign him to a long term contract.

 

Yeah the cost was less because of Price BUT there is a talent gap between Mookie and Lindor IMO. And Verdugo is good but I wouldn’t call him a stud. I don’t think Toronto would need to include Biggio, necessarily...

[Spanky99]

Yeah the cost was less because of Price BUT there is a talent gap between Mookie and Lindor IMO. And Verdugo is good but I wouldn’t call him a stud. I don’t think Toronto would need to include Biggio, necessarily...

 

Yeah, I don't see the return going back from the MLB roster, but people thinking Groshans or Martin aren't an ask are being foolish as a headliner, Toronto likely say no, or it's reconfigured and they come to something would remain to be seen. I see them passing.

[The Iceman]

I say NO to trading assets for Lindor.

I say YES to signing Semein, Didi, Simmons, Iglesias. Even Galvis was great for us.

 

Make due next season, and open the wallet 2021-22 when potentially Lindor, Baez, Seager, Story and Correa all hit the FA market

[Orgfiller]

What would people think of a Kris Bryant acquisition? Theo Epstein might be leaving the Cubs and Bryant/Boras are probably not on good terms with the organization with the whole service time manipulation thing. Also the Cubs are pretty mediocre and might want to do a retool so moving a guy like Bryant before he leaves in FA would make a lot of sense for them

 

Pros:

- Likely 3-5 WAR upgrade at 3B. Bryant was a 5 win player just last season

- Bo doesn't have to move off SS/doesn't have to learn a new position with a SS acquisition

- Get the upper hand on a contract extension. We saw how Mookie Betts moving to LA immediately gave them the opportunity to discuss and execute a contract extension prior to FA. Bryant is coming off a down year which we could use to leverage an early contract extension

- Ryu was a Boras client so we've already shown that he isn't the bogeyman and the Jays are willing to spend for a top client of his

- Bryant is a recognizable face of the MLB, fans will eat up an acquisition like that

- At least one year where you don't dumpster dive for a 3B ala Brandon Drury and Travis Shaw

- Vetrin presents. WINNER MENTALITY. Has been there before

- Since he's coming off a down year and only has a year left before FA the price shouldn't be astronomical

- Actually has defensive versatility if you'd like to use him for that, although given that 3B is easily our worst position I don't see why you would

- Can you really put that much stock into a bad 150 PAs in a year like this? Could just be more of a slump than anything

 

Cons:

- Has battled injuries, may result in his true talent level having declined

- Coming off a down year with red flags such as lowered power output, fewer walks, more Ks, lower % of barrels which was his calling card

- Has never been a high EV or hard hit % guy, if his physical tools are diminished from the injuries this could really expose him

- He's no defensive stalwart, although he never really has been and average defense at third is probably fine if he's hitting

- Has only one year left and being a Boras client the extension cost might be unreasonable

- What is the acquisition cost? Will likely require at least one of our top prospects, and if they want MLB position players back we might be s*** out of luck or don't want to part with some of our core players