We are in year 4 of the Shatkins era. How much time do you give them?

[CrackerJack]

I wish Edwin was still a Jay. Wouldn't have added many Wins, but still would be nice to have a very likeable slugger who is just 108 dingers away from 500 (and thus the Hall of Fame ) ... tho time ain't on his side.

[Spanky99]

Nice contributions to the board.

 

lol... the irony.

[FrozenRopes]

I wish Edwin was still a Jay. Wouldn't have added many Wins, but still would be nice to have a very likeable slugger who is just 108 dingers away from 500 (and thus the Hall of Fame ) ... tho time ain't on his side.

 

He can get there. Move to a more hitting friendly park in the AL. He takes great care of himself.

[TheHurl]

The handling of JD, got nothing for him knowing we were entering a rebuilding process.

 

Atkins has answered that one. They would have loved to started the rebuilding process earlier but you don't rebuild coming off a playoff season in which the team led the league in attendance. Again...they held steady through that process and Donaldson got hurt so the value dissipated

 

 

Question.. Do you think Atkins is capable of making a trade similar to the one for Donaldson? Or unloading the contract of Wells? I'm not comparing him to AA, just saying i don't think he has the clout to pull off something of that magnitude.

 

Lars Anderson, Shin-soo Choo and Tony Sipp for Albers, Shaw, Stubbs and Bauer was pretty damn good. Pestano for Clevenger (in August in a year where they were contending). I don't think there are many GMs that could get the Donaldson trade it was the perfect combo of persistence and a stubborn GM who was annoyed with a player. Remember this always...the Angels came to the Jays with the Wells trade. All AA had to say was yes and he actually tried to negotiate that a different player be thrown in and only accepted when he had a deal in place for Napoli.

[tazsub3]

I was very very vocal at the time especially on both this and the other jays board., and i even took a decision to cancel my season tickets.

And as luck has it, i decided to share a raptors season tickets with a friend.

So while i cant stand the shatkins, i am somehow thankful to them, as i will be enjoying a game 7 instead of watching this crap of a team they assembled.

But as I real jays fans, still dont understand how we removed a Canadian who took the team to their best result to replace with this crap. And for people who say he traded the farm on that deadline, , please name me one other player that became something from the prospects he let go

[Jimcanuck]

I was very very vocal at the time especially on both this and the other jays board., and i even took a decision to cancel my season tickets.

And as luck has it, i decided to share a raptors season tickets with a friend.

So while i cant stand the shatkins, i am somehow thankful to them, as i will be enjoying a game 7 instead of watching this crap of a team they assembled.

But as I real jays fans, still dont understand how we removed a Canadian who took the team to their best result to replace with this crap. And for people who say he traded the farm on that deadline, , please name me one other player that became something from the prospects he let go

 

There are several. Matt Boyd, one of the top pitchers in baseball so far this year, is one.

[BTS]

I was very very vocal at the time especially on both this and the other jays board., and i even took a decision to cancel my season tickets.

And as luck has it, i decided to share a raptors season tickets with a friend.

So while i cant stand the shatkins, i am somehow thankful to them, as i will be enjoying a game 7 instead of watching this crap of a team they assembled.

But as I real jays fans, still dont understand how we removed a Canadian who took the team to their best result to replace with this crap. And for people who say he traded the farm on that deadline, , please name me one other player that became something from the prospects he let go

 

It’s more that he used prospect capital to buy old guys on FA deals. The rebuild was always coming.

[tazsub3]

It’s more that he used prospect capital to buy old guys on FA deals. The rebuild was always coming.

 

That is a valid point, the flip side , we had a guy who bled the city and the franchise, these two bozo's are disconnected.

[TheHurl]

There are several. Matt Boyd, one of the top pitchers in baseball so far this year, is one.

 

That Noah Syndergaard is s*** too. Aaron Sanchez career fWAR 5.2 in 500 innings. Norris is considered "nothing" by most Jays fans is 3.7 in 300 IP...and still isn't in his arb years. Disco 6.7 fWAR. Marisnick continues to thrive in a part-time role and is up to 5.7 career WAR for a guy that has been paid $4M total in his career. Yunel put up 8.1 fWAR after his trade. Derek Dietrich was traded for Escobar right after the Marlins trade, he's put up 7.5 WAR.

 

Only Thor has gone on to be a star, but I still think it's a total of $400m in excess value traded by the Jays from 2013 to 2016

[TheHurl]

That is a valid point, the flip side , we had a guy who ate the city and the franchise, these two bozo's are disconnected.

 

ftfy. Also remember he was offered to keep his job. He left the job that he bled for

[Jimcanuck]

That Noah Syndergaard is s*** too. Aaron Sanchez career fWAR 5.2 in 500 innings. Norris is considered "nothing" by most Jays fans is 3.7 in 300 IP...and still isn't in his arb years. Disco 6.7 fWAR. Marisnick continues to thrive in a part-time role and is up to 5.7 career WAR for a guy that has been paid $4M total in his career. Yunel put up 8.1 fWAR after his trade. Derek Dietrich was traded for Escobar right after the Marlins trade, he's put up 7.5 WAR.

 

Only Thor has gone on to be a star, but I still think it's a total of $400m in excess value traded by the Jays from 2013 to 2016

 

I figured Thor was who he was referring to "one other player"

[BTS]

That is a valid point, the flip side , we had a guy who bled the city and the franchise, these two bozo's are disconnected.

 

The core of the 2015 team was Price, Buehrle, Stro, Edwin, JD Tulo, Martin and Bautista. Between retirements, massive declines in ability, and in the case of Price, huge free agent deals, the core was gutted organically because it was only built to be temporary.

 

As Hurk said, the best thing Shatkins has done is avoided the temptation to keep that ageing group together.

[5ToolPhenom]

Interesting that the poll results (right now) are evenly split at the 2 additional seasons mark, with half giving Shatkins more rope. What for you is "contending?" Battling for the division? Meaningful games in Sept? In the wildcard hunt till the last weekend of the season? Playing above .500?

 

I think anything less than 500 in 2020 would be a deal breaker. Sure, it might not be contending exactly, but it would at least show that the team is on it's way to becoming competitive.

[5ToolPhenom]

Incredible how two people can see things completely differently. I see it as the glass as being 93.4% empty. As in $33 million spent on Morales instead of $500 million spent on Bautista, Encarnacion and Donaldson.

 

In all fairness, I don't think anyone was seriously considering shelling out that kind of money for them. Bautista's 150 million suggestion was seen as a joke around the baseball world that no person in their right mind would consider. And with JD, there was always the concern of where Vladdy would play, so it wasn't like it would be an ideal situation. EE still being on the team would've been cool. This lineup can't hit, it'd be nice to have a little pop still on the roster.

[tazsub3]

That Noah Syndergaard is s*** too. Aaron Sanchez career fWAR 5.2 in 500 innings. Norris is considered "nothing" by most Jays fans is 3.7 in 300 IP...and still isn't in his arb years. Disco 6.7 fWAR. Marisnick continues to thrive in a part-time role and is up to 5.7 career WAR for a guy that has been paid $4M total in his career. Yunel put up 8.1 fWAR after his trade. Derek Dietrich was traded for Escobar right after the Marlins trade, he's put up 7.5 WAR.

 

Only Thor has gone on to be a star, but I still think it's a total of $400m in excess value traded by the Jays from 2013 to 2016

 

Thor was earlier, i was discussing that famous deadline. also we dont know how alex would have handled the excess dollars. but as i fan, i want a winning team and could not care less about the teams finances.

As for me, to tell me now the jays are profitable means nothing. i want wins, and these are guys are doing s***. Also the trades for prospects have been horrible, at least alex found many diamonds in the rough

[5ToolPhenom]

That is a valid point, the flip side , we had a guy who bled the city and the franchise, these two bozo's are disconnected.

 

AA does seem to have a niche at acquiring players that he knows the fanbase will like. A signing like Martin was sure to be a huge hit in Canada, Braves fans were thrilled to have Brian McCann back on the team, Drafting Vladdy the son of one of the most beloved Expo's ETC.

 

Oh and there was a s*** ton of Canadians on the Jays for awhile which excited a lot of casuals.

[Jimcanuck]

Thor was earlier, i was discussing that famous deadline. also we dont know how alex would have handled the excess dollars. but as i fan, i want a winning team and could not care less about the teams finances.

As for me, to tell me now the jays are profitable means nothing. i want wins, and these are guys are doing s***. Also the trades for prospects have been horrible, at least alex found many diamonds in the rough

 

The only AA prospect trade that returned value, that I can remember, is Gose for Travis

[tazsub3]

The only AA prospect trade that returned value, that I can remember, is Gose for Travis

 

What about the donaldson trade?? we mainly gave away fringe prospects for an MVP.

Now we are trading and getting crap

[tazsub3]

AA does seem to have a niche at acquiring players that he knows the fanbase will like. A signing like Martin was sure to be a huge hit in Canada, Braves fans were thrilled to have Brian McCann back on the team, Drafting Vladdy the son of one of the most beloved Expo's ETC.

 

Oh and there was a s*** ton of Canadians on the Jays for awhile which excited a lot of casuals.

 

At least we had a team with a soul, look what we have now..

Now we start the year with both marcus and aaron pitching well, they leak into the media they are trade target, check their performances since then.

Even a rebulding team needs an identity. they removed all of that.

Edited May 12, 2019 by tazsub3

[Jimcanuck]

Also the trades for prospects have been horrible, at least alex found many diamonds in the rough

 

The only AA prospect trade that returned value, that I can remember, is Gose for Travis

 

What about the donaldson trade?? we mainly gave away fringe prospects for an MVP.

Now we are trading and getting crap

 

Forgive me, I thought you were referring to trades for prospects

 

Also, if AA was GM, the current Jays squad would still suck. Its the nature of the competitive cycle

[saskjayfan]

That Noah Syndergaard is s*** too. Aaron Sanchez career fWAR 5.2 in 500 innings. Norris is considered "nothing" by most Jays fans is 3.7 in 300 IP...and still isn't in his arb years. Disco 6.7 fWAR. Marisnick continues to thrive in a part-time role and is up to 5.7 career WAR for a guy that has been paid $4M total in his career. Yunel put up 8.1 fWAR after his trade. Derek Dietrich was traded for Escobar right after the Marlins trade, he's put up 7.5 WAR.

 

Only Thor has gone on to be a star, but I still think it's a total of $400m in excess value traded by the Jays from 2013 to 2016

 

Why are people still talking about AA. He's been gone for 3 years now. All this talk about AA and no mention of Donaldson?

[P2F]

Why are people still talking about AA. He's been gone for 3 years now. All this talk about AA and no mention of Donaldson?

 

Donaldson has been mentioned in at least 10 posts or so in this thread.

[Dick_Pole]

There are positive elements to each of the last three regimes:

 

Current FO's ability to stock and develop the farm

JPR's ability to manage the 25 man roster efficiently

AA's non-stop hustle to make the big deals to bring in top end talent

 

If we combined those three elements into one GM that would be pretty damn good because they all cover off each other's glaring weaknesses.

[Krylian]

There are positive elements to each of the last three regimes:

 

Current FO's ability to stock and develop the farm

JPR's ability to manage the 25 man roster efficiently

AA's non-stop hustle to make the big deals to bring in top end talent

 

If we combined those three elements into one GM that would be pretty damn good because they all cover off each other's glaring weaknesses.

 

You'd have Pat Gillick in his prime

[Spanky99]

You'd have Pat Gillick in his prime

 

Bingo!

[DigitalRock]

At least we had a team with a soul, look what we have now..

Now we start the year with both marcus and aaron pitching well, they leak into the media they are trade target, check their performances since then.

Even a rebulding team needs an identity. they removed all of that.

 

WTF does this even mean?

[Deadpool]

Is the SportsNet comment section leaking or something?

[Pendleton]

At least we had a team with a soul, look what we have now..

Now we start the year with both marcus and aaron pitching well, they leak into the media they are trade target, check their performances since then.

Even a rebulding team needs an identity. they removed all of that.

 

60 or 70 grade soul can make up for a lot of talent deficiencies. We could have Stevie Wonder platoon with McKinney in LF.

[Rusty_Savage]

WTF does this even mean?

 

He wants us to sign the ghost of Aretha Franklin

[TheHurl]

WTF does this even mean?

 

I think he wants Angels in the Outfield or for the team to get blacker. Not sure