Sanchez changeup

[mellowgold]

Sorry if it's been talked about somewhere else, but this thing is nasty. Where the hell did it come from? I know he's always sorta had one, but he didn't exactly use it much and it sure never looked this good. The movement is ridiculous. He was pretty clearly holding back on the fastball tonight but with that sinker and curve he's got, this could potentially get really interesting.

[John_Havok]

Sorry if it's been talked about somewhere else, but this thing is nasty. Where the hell did it come from? I know he's always sorta had one, but he didn't exactly use it much and it sure never looked this good. The movement is ridiculous. He was pretty clearly holding back on the fastball tonight but with that sinker and curve he's got, this could potentially get really interesting.

 

He's always had it, but could never command it with any semblance of success. So far this season it's much more consistent

[Jonn]

He finally has a feel for it. He seemed to have got the velocity down to as low as 86. But he was over throwing it and the only reason the Orioles were so baffled was because he use to throw pretty much just Sinkers. If he can combine that with the velocity he will be extremely successful. Apparently he was throwing 91-94 by design last night. I don't buy it he needs his fastball at 94-97 that's what made him dominant in 2016. That along with his curve.

[Maico450]

He finally has a feel for it. He seemed to have got the velocity down to as low as 86. But he was over throwing it and the only reason the Orioles were so baffled was because he use to throw pretty much just Sinkers. If he can combine that with the velocity he will be extremely successful. Apparently he was throwing 91-94 by design last night. I don't buy it he needs his fastball at 94-97 that's what made him dominant in 2016. That along with his curve.

 

You would kind of think he was dominant last night, No?

Having 3 major league pitches has to be better than 2.

But Yes, I was looking for that 96 mph heater myself, I am sure he could mix in a few of them also? Would that make 4?

[Spanky99]

During the post game presser with Gibby... a reporter mentioned that he threw 42 CU, that's far too many. He needs to mix up more CB and high heat in his game with the softer 2 seamer for more swing and miss. A good result last night, but he was far from dominant.

[Jonn]

You would kind of think he was dominant last night, No?

Having 3 major league pitches has to be better than 2.

But Yes, I was looking for that 96 mph heater myself, I am sure he could mix in a few of them also? Would that make 4?

 

Hard for me to say a pitcher was dominant when he walked 5 and only struck out 4.

[z3r0s]

Watching the game I felt he was painting a lot more than the walk total shows. Got f***ed on quite a few call (especially 2-seamer on inside to lefties).

All in all, not dominate in the true sense, but a great game and bodes well for the future.

 

Sanchez probably won't be an ace as he can't miss bats as often as needed. But he should be a really valuable rotation piece.

[AledmysDiaz]

Change up is only effective if he throws md 90s.

[Bobthe4th]

Watching the game I felt he was painting a lot more than the walk total shows. Got f***ed on quite a few call (especially 2-seamer on inside to lefties).

All in all, not dominate in the true sense, but a great game and bodes well for the future.

 

Sanchez probably won't be an ace as he can't miss bats as often as needed. But he should be a really valuable rotation piece.

 

Depends how you define ace. I mean he's already won an ERA title in his one full season as a starter with only 3.8 WAR. I don't think it's unrealistic to think he could continue to improve to where he's putting up regular around 5 WAR seasons, which would almost certainly mean he'd be at the top of the rotation.

[Spanky99]

The velocity drop on the fastball may be to avoid blister problems? Anyone know if there is a cause effect here

 

Well, if that's the case he's finished, this will be his ceiling as team's adjust.

[Brownie19]

During the post game presser with Gibby... a reporter mentioned that he threw 42 CU, that's far too many. He needs to mix up more CB and high heat in his game with the softer 2 seamer for more swing and miss. A good result last night, but he was far from dominant.

 

SSS, but his SwStr% is at 10.7% so far this year - best of his career (8.2% in 2016)

 

It's not going to matter how hard he's throwing, or what pitch sequence he's using if he can't get the BB% down. With HBP included, he's at 6.86 BB/9 right now (vs. 5.95 K/9). That isn't sustainable.

[Jimcanuck]

Well, if that's the case he's finished, this will be his ceiling as team's adjust.

 

I deleted the post, doesnt make sense on reflection that a 96 to 92 MPH drop on the fastball will avoid blisters. Probably just an attempt to find better command

[Brownie19]

Well, if that's the case he's finished, this will be his ceiling as team's adjust.

 

May also be why the CB% is down and the CU% is up...

 

Personally, I think he could be very effective working at 92-94 on his sinker with a good curve and that new quality change up. BUT - if that's the new Sanchez - he needs to throw way more strikes and keep the BB% down.

[Spanky99]

SSS, but his SwStr% is at 10.7% so far this year - best of his career (8.2% in 2016)

 

It's not going to matter how hard he's throwing, or what pitch sequence he's using if he can't get the BB% down. With HBP included, he's at 6.86 BB/9 right now (vs. 5.95 K/9). That isn't sustainable.

 

Yeah, that change gets a lot of swing and miss, I'm just saying moving forward he needs to utilize that change with more 4SF and CB usage, it could open a door for him going forward. Pitching like he did last night, won't bode well.

[Maico450]

Well, if that's the case he's finished, this will be his ceiling as team's adjust.

 

If this is his ceiling, I will take it. 8 innings of 3 hit, 1 run, take that every game. Sanchez has the kind of stuff, that even if the batter knows what is coming, they still cant hit it.

[Spanky99]

May also be why the CB% is down and the CU% is up...

 

Personally, I think he could be very effective working at 92-94 on his sinker with a good curve and that new quality change up. BUT - if that's the new Sanchez - he needs to throw way more strikes and keep the BB% down.

 

Agreed, I agree with z3r0s that he was squeezed a bit by that umpire last night(f***ing awful). All in all the walks do need to come down.

[Spanky99]

If this is his ceiling, I will take it. 8 innings of 3 hit, 1 run, take that every game. Sanchez has the kind of stuff, that even if the batter knows what is coming, they still cant hit it.

 

Welp...

[Spanky99]

I deleted the post, doesnt make sense on reflection that a 96 to 92 MPH drop on the fastball will avoid blisters. Probably just an attempt to find better command

 

You could say that about his CB usage and confidence in the pitch, we'll see going forward.

[King]

I deleted the post, doesnt make sense on reflection that a 96 to 92 MPH drop on the fastball will avoid blisters. Probably just an attempt to find better command

This is a myth and he's probably just making himself less effective as a result.

[Grant77]

This is a myth and he's probably just making himself less effective as a result.

 

Have you ever even played baseball before?

[Spanky99]

lol

[Orgfiller]

If this is his ceiling, I will take it. 8 innings of 3 hit, 1 run, take that every game. Sanchez has the kind of stuff, that even if the batter knows what is coming, they still cant hit it.

 

It's very unlikely that if he has peripherals like he did last night going forward that he'll be able to get anywhere near 8 innings of 3 hit, 1 run. In fact he'll probably be quite terrible if he keeps that up.

[Maico450]

It's very unlikely that if he has peripherals like he did last night going forward that he'll be able to get anywhere near 8 innings of 3 hit, 1 run. In fact he'll probably be quite terrible if he keeps that up.

 

Question for you. If his 5 walks had been hits, would that have been better, or worse for his peripherals?

Having trouble relating to the "Terrible" description. Please educate me.

[Spanky99]

lol

[closetjaysfan]

Change up is only effective if he throws md 90s.

 

That isn't entirely true. Generally you want your change up to look like your fastball until it is too late for the batter to adjust. Spin rate and delivery can have a bigger impact in some cases. Look at Estrada as an example he has one of the best change-ups in the game and his fastball average is less than 90 mph.

 

https://www.fangraphs.com/pitchfxo.aspx?playerid=1118&position=P&pitch=FA&data=pi

[Spanky99]

I'm surprised he had all this time off and couldn't turn the curve into a slider. Tunnels better with the 2-seam and less stress on his finger probably.

 

I think the curve is obvious to the batter coming out of his hand with the hump. Only gas cans like Chris Davis swing through that thing regularly. It's still a decent pitch but he would be lethal if he had a slider that tunneled.

 

Agree and disagree, his curve was/is sick when thrown with conviction, and if he were to bail on it, a slider should've been worked on, we'll see if he utilizes it more(curve).

[Angrioter]

Change up is only effective if he throws md 90s.

 

Wrong.. Change up isn't just about velocity.

 

Movement, deception, localization, other

[Krylian]

Change up is only effective if he throws md 90s.

 

Marco Estrada says hi.

[John_Havok]

Wrong.. Change up isn't just about velocity.

 

Movement, deception, localization, other

 

All correct, however the single biggest factor of a changeup being effective is velocity difference from the fastball. The best changeups are usually 10 mph slower than a pitchers fastball. This is the case with Marco.

 

So while it doesn't matter how hard the fastball is... it matters how much slower the changeup is. The more separation, the better

[Spanky99]

All correct, however the single biggest factor of a changeup being effective is velocity difference from the fastball. Tye best changeup are usually 10 mph slower than a pitchers fastball.

 

So while it doesn't matter how hard the fastball is... it matters how much slower the changeup is. The more separation, the better

 

8-12 mph