Around Baseball 2018

[Boxcar]

Interesting. I didn't realize that improved spin was contributing to all of these guys suddenly becoming aces in Houston.

 

Is that sarcasm? Cole and Verlander were already pretty elite. Morton and McHugh are the really odd ones.

 

Verlander has the highest O-Swing in his career, highest swstrk in his career and a 5% drop in Z-swing from last year-all at age 35. That doesn't seem suspicious when added to all the other guys who magically improved in Houston?

 

Cole has a 12% drop in contact rate from last year, 16!!% swstrk, and the highest O-Swing in his career. That's a pretty drastic change!

 

Also, I don't buy that the Astros are a smart org. They've shown time and time again that they have no idea how to value players.

[BTS]

Is that sarcasm? Cole and Verlander were already pretty elite. Morton and McHugh are the really odd ones.

 

Verlander has the highest O-Swing in his career, highest swstrk in his career and a 5% drop in Z-swing from last year-all at age 35. That doesn't seem suspicious when added to all the other guys who magically improved in Houston?

 

Also, I don't buy that the Astros are a smart org. They've shown time and time again that they have no idea how to value players.

 

Not sarcasm. I obviously knew that all of these guys had improved, but I didn't know that their spin rates had all improved. I was under the impression that spin rate was one of the toughest things for a pitcher to improve.

[Boxcar]

With fastballs, Justin Verlander is first in spin rate among starting pitchers. On curveballs, Charlie Morton is second among qualified starters after Garrett Richards while Verlander is in the top 10.

 

We've also seen players make pretty big leaps once joining the Astros or getting together with the forward-thinking front office.

 

Through April, the Astros lead the majors in rotation ERA by a pretty big margin (2.54 with the Diamondbacks at 2.96 and no one else below 3.20).

 

If it was one guy, even two guys, fine. But the dramatic improvement in such a short amount of time with multiple pitchers? Especially older guys like Verlander and Morton? I don't buy it. Also, a "forward thinking, heavily analytical" FO would never make the Giles trade, or the Fiers trade, or the Liriano trade.

[Dr. Dinger]

If it was one guy, even two guys, fine. But the dramatic improvement in such a short amount of time with multiple pitchers? Especially older guys like Verlander and Morton? I don't buy it. Also, a "forward thinking, heavily analytical" FO would never make the Giles trade, or the Fiers trade, or the Liriano trade.

 

The Giles trade was fine, Velasquez sucks and can't hold up as a starter. The Verlander trade was a steal, the Cole trade was a steal. Sure they have some bad trades, but they also have some robberies.

[Boxcar]

The Giles trade was fine, Velasquez sucks and can't hold up as a starter. The Verlander trade was a steal, the Cole trade was a steal. Sure they have some bad trades, but they also have some robberies.

 

Velasquez didn't look like he sucked at the time the trade was made. Also, that last line reminds me of someone else who had a few robberies and some blunders...Alex Anthopoulos.

[Dr. Dinger]

Velasquez didn't look like he sucked at the time the trade was made.

 

The Astros had an extensive amount of time to evaluate his durability. The Phillies took a shot on his upside, but ultimately it looks like the Astros had him pegged. He's a poor man's Salazar.

[Dr. Dinger]

Also, that last line reminds me of someone else who had a few robberies and some blunders...Alex Anthopoulos.

 

Alex Anthopoulos was a good GM, what's your point? The Donaldson trade was arguably the biggest heist of the decade. Anthopoulos gave up absolutely no prospects of consequence in the Price, Marlins, or Tulo trades. The biggest blunder by far was trading Syndergaard, but it's looking like the Donaldson trade will blow that out of the water in terms of net WAR. Anthopoulos was a contract extension genius and routinely stocked the farm with trade chips and blue chippers. We are still reaping the rewards of his good work by way of Vlad.

[Boxcar]

Yeah, you know...minus all the dead money the Jays had to take on. Prospects are always a crap shoot, and Norris looked like he was going to be pretty good for awhile there.

 

My point was that he made a lot of reckless deals and analytical FOs don't make reckless trades.

[Dr. Dinger]

Yeah, you know...minus all the dead money the Jays had to take on. Prospects are always a crap shoot, and Norris looked like he was going to be pretty good for awhile there.

 

My point was that he made a lot of reckless deals and analytical FOs don't make reckless trades.

 

I see those as essentially free agent contracts since most major free agents wouldn't even consider signing in Toronto at the time (also now). None of those contracts that we took on were especially onerous. The Martin and Dickey contracts were also solid value, while the EE and Bautista extensions were straight up slave labour. If you want to talk about dead money (who? Tulo? Big deal), then also please go run a WAR/$ analysis on the extensions that AA signed for EE and Bautista in their prime. It was a shocking, scandalous amount of surplus value. I really don't care what we or the industry thought about Dan Norris at the time, the Jays front office correctly evaluated that he was expendable/high risk. Daniel Norris and Jeff Hoffman both sux ballsack, bud.

[connorp]

If it was one guy, even two guys, fine. But the dramatic improvement in such a short amount of time with multiple pitchers? Especially older guys like Verlander and Morton? I don't buy it. Also, a "forward thinking, heavily analytical" FO would never make the Giles trade, or the Fiers trade, or the Liriano trade.

 

So the solution is just simply a little bit of pine tar or similar but not enough to be overly blatant like Pineda?

But every other mlb has decided instead of taking this short cut (that’s hardly ever enforced) to having a dominant pitching staff, they are taking the high road and not joining the party?

 

Is this a fair summary of your hypothesis?

[Dr. Dinger]

Maybe they just blast their fingers with hairspray between innings

[Brownie19]

Is that sarcasm? Cole and Verlander were already pretty elite. Morton and McHugh are the really odd ones.

 

Verlander has the highest O-Swing in his career, highest swstrk in his career and a 5% drop in Z-swing from last year-all at age 35. That doesn't seem suspicious when added to all the other guys who magically improved in Houston?

 

Cole has a 12% drop in contact rate from last year, 16!!% swstrk, and the highest O-Swing in his career. That's a pretty drastic change!

 

Also, I don't buy that the Astros are a smart org. They've shown time and time again that they have no idea how to value players.

 

I don't doubt what you're saying, but I thought one of theories for Cole's success in Houston was that he's throwing his curve and slider way more than he did in Pittsburgh where they pitch to contact more (although sticking fingers makes the curve/slider more nasty)

[King]

So the solution is just simply a little bit of pine tar or similar but not enough to be overly blatant like Pineda?

But every other mlb has decided instead of taking this short cut (that’s hardly ever enforced) to having a dominant pitching staff, they are taking the high road and not joining the party?

 

Is this a fair summary of your hypothesis?

 

I don't doubt what you're saying, but I thought one of theories for Cole's success in Houston was that he's throwing his curve and slider way more than he did in Pittsburgh where they pitch to contact more (although sticking fingers makes the curve/slider more nasty)

 

Read the spin rate thread. Trevor Bauer is accusing the Astros of using a substance to dramatically improve their spin rates.

[Brownie19]

Thought this was a pretty cool article (for once) from fangraphs.

 

https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/adam-ottavino-rebuilt-himself-in-a-vacant-manhattan-storefront/

[Brownie19]

Read the spin rate thread. Trevor Bauer is accusing the Astros of using a substance to dramatically improve their spin rates.

 

Yeah - I've been in there. I'm just saying it may not just be cheating. Cole's using his breaking balls way more in Houston than he did in Pittsburgh.

[Pendleton]

Future team Canada ace

 

https://twitter.com/PitchingNinja/status/991481090534756357?s=19

 

I don't know why this didn't embed but it's a sexy 95 mph sinker from Soroka that just toppled below the bat.

[L54]

Read the spin rate thread. Trevor Bauer is accusing the Astros of using a substance to dramatically improve their spin rates.

 

Trevor Bauer is such a whiny little bitch

[connorp]

Read the spin rate thread. Trevor Bauer is accusing the Astros of using a substance to dramatically improve their spin rates.

 

Lol. You’re acting like it’s a caveman that just discovered fire. So all is takes is a little par tar or similar, something baseball rarely enforces unless it’s super blantant like Pineda couple years back, and you can magically resurrect your career and become Clayton Kershaw-lite. Yet all the guys struggling to stay in mlb, or that are in a contract year, or teams trying to compete.... everyone is taking the high road and not taking advantage of something that’s essentially allowed within reason in mlb??? Lol

 

TB is butt hurt because he tried to apply for a waiver for glue on his hand and got denied

[King]

So the solution is just simply a little bit of pine tar or similar but not enough to be overly blatant like Pineda?

But every other mlb has decided instead of taking this short cut (that’s hardly ever enforced) to having a dominant pitching staff, they are taking the high road and not joining the party?

 

Is this a fair summary of your hypothesis?

 

Lol. You’re acting like it’s a caveman that just discovered fire. So all is takes is a little par tar or similar, something baseball rarely enforces unless it’s super blantant like Pineda couple years back, and you can magically resurrect your career and become Clayton Kershaw-lite. Yet all the guys struggling to stay in mlb, or that are in a contract year, or teams trying to compete.... everyone is taking the high road and not taking advantage of something that’s essentially allowed within reason in mlb??? Lol

 

TB is butt hurt because he tried to apply for a waiver for glue on his hand and got denied

 

I don't even.

[Terminator]

 

I voted no but it's interesting to see how the overwhelming majority think he's a HoFer.

[connorp]

I don't even.

 

So I guess you’re claiming that pitchers don’t use substances to get a better grip on the ball because it’s illegal?

[King]

So I guess you’re claiming that pitchers don’t use substances to get a better grip on the ball because it’s illegal?

 

Yes, that's exactly what I claimed.

 

Holy f*** you're a dumbass.

[Boxcar]

So the solution is just simply a little bit of pine tar or similar but not enough to be overly blatant like Pineda?

But every other mlb has decided instead of taking this short cut (that’s hardly ever enforced) to having a dominant pitching staff, they are taking the high road and not joining the party?

 

Is this a fair summary of your hypothesis?

 

Are you like Samson except your hair is linked to your intellect?

[Boxcar]

 

I voted no but it's interesting to see how the overwhelming majority think he's a HoFer.

 

Is it interesting? People are pretty dumb and gullible by in large and the media narrative jerks Yadi's little ding dong any chance it gets.

 

He should be dropped on the first ballot but for some reason, these baseball writer pukes just love the guy.

 

He is/was a good catcher. He wasn't great.

[Boxcar]

Yeah - I've been in there. I'm just saying it may not just be cheating. Cole's using his breaking balls way more in Houston than he did in Pittsburgh.

 

Wouldn't you use your breaking balls more if you could make them spin more? Also, like Bauer said, spin rates are more pronounced at lower velocities.

[Brownie19]

Wouldn't you use your breaking balls more if you could make them spin more? Also, like Bauer said, spin rates are more pronounced at lower velocities.

 

I mean yes I would.

 

However, substance or no substance, a drastic change in your pitch usage could partially explain the newfound success. That's all I'm saying (I'll stop now).

[connorp]

Are you like Samson except your hair is linked to your intellect?

 

It’s my fault for calling your faulty logic? And as for King, I don’t know what the **** he’s whining about either.

You guys both obviously enjoy soy

[Boxcar]

It’s my fault for calling your faulty logic? And as for King, I don’t know what the **** he’s whining about either.

You guys both obviously enjoy soy

 

Soy leads to hair loss and of the two of us, I would bet 1000000 dollars that I have a thicker head of hair.

[connorp]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.yahoo.com/amphtml/sports/argument-make-pine-tar-foreign-substances-legal-pitchers-152648272.html

 

Here’s a good article advocating to make it legal so you don’t have guys like Boxy thinking it just takes a dab of Vaseline and you’re on your way to a CY Young award

[connorp]

Soy leads to hair loss and of the two of us, I would bet 1000000 dollars that I have a thicker head of hair.

 

Another medical miracle dropped down by Dr. Boxy. Stay away from soy and you’ll keep your hair. Keep this s*** coming and you could sell books