Official MiLB/Prospects Thread

[Laika]

Ryan Schimpf

Daniel Robertson

Kelly Johnson

Rickie Weeks Jr

Scott Sizemore

Yoan Moncada

Logan Forsythe

Jason Kipnis

Dan Uggla

 

+ most these would be very, very high end outcomes, 75th percentile and above, for Biggio. IMO.

[Carlos Danger]

Biggio AA

 

Age Dif G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB

23 -1.2 132 563 449 80 113 23 5 26 99 20 8 100 148 .252 .388 .499 .887 224 2 5 1 8 4

 

Zobrist AA

 

25 0.8 83 381 315 57 103 25 6 3 30 9 5 55 46 .327 .434 .473 .907 149 7 5 5 1 1

 

 

Maybe one of you guys can better correlate this.. But if I am reading it right it appears Zobrist never had a full season of only AA ball. He did AA/AAA same year.

 

However, he was 25 yrs old when he started AA and went to AAA. Biggio is two years younger. I didn't add Zobrist's AAA numbers because I don't think it would be fair.. There are a lot of stats that Biggio is not too far off from Zobrist for AA ball and considering he is 2 yrs younger..

 

Food for thought...

 

EDIT TO ADDL The categories are all lined up when I edit and then it changes when I post... WTF!

[King]

Biggio AA

 

Age Dif Tm Lg Lev Aff G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB

23 -1.2 AA 132 563 449 80 113 23 5 26 99 20 8 100 148 .252 .388 .499 .887 224 2 5 1 8 4

 

Zobrist AA

 

25 0.8 Corpus Christi 83 381 315 57 103 25 6 3 30 9 5 55 46 .327 .434 .473 .907 149 7 5 5 1 1

 

 

Maybe one of you guys can better correlate this.. But if I am reading it right it appears Zobrist never had a full season of only AA ball. He did AA/AAA same year.

 

However, he was 25 yrs old when he started AA and went to AAA. Biggio is two years younger. I didn't add Zobrist's AAA numbers because I don't think it would be fair.. There are a lot of stats that Biggio is not too far off from Zobrist for AA ball and considering he is 2 yrs younger..

 

Food for thought...

 

The Zobrist comp doesn't make any sense. They aren't similar profiles at all. The only thing you could say they have in common is they play multiple positions but even then Biggio has yet to play anywhere other than 2B or 1B and he hasn't proven to be any good at those positions.

[Carlos Danger]

The Zobrist comp doesn't make any sense. They aren't similar profiles at all. The only thing you could say they have in common is they play multiple positions but even then Biggio has yet to play anywhere other than 2B or 1B and he hasn't proven to be any good at those positions.

 

He has played 3b, 2b, 1b and is now playing OF in the AFL... I think the Jays are trying to make him a super utility, but he is much more then a Ryan Goins type IMO, more like a Marco Scutaro, starter type super utility, so who is the best starting super utility guy... Well, not sure about this past season, but prior Zobrist was always at the top or near to.

[King]

He has played 3b, 2b, 1b and is now playing OF in the AFL... I think the Jays are trying to make him a super utility, but he is much more then a Ryan Goins type IMO, more like a Marco Scutaro, starter type super utility, so who is the best starting super utility guy... Well, not sure about this past season, but prior Zobrist was always at the top or near to.

That's why the Kelly Johnson comparison makes sense. Zobrist has been a top 10 player in the game over the past 10 years, it's not realistic.

 

And if Biggio ends up with a Kelly Johnson like career that would be a favourable outcome, one in which the Jays should be happy with.

[Brownie19]

That's why the Kelly Johnson comparison makes sense. Zobrist has been a top 10 player in the game over the past 10 years, it's not realistic.

 

And if Biggio ends up with a Kelly Johnson like career that would be a favourable outcome, one in which the Jays should be happy with.

 

Ben Zobrist really is the face of the new age of baseball. Finally - teams value players who can play multiple positions well and use that versatility throughout the season to maximize matchups and platoon splits. He's also one of the swing path change players who went from bring a marginal AAAA player to an all-star hitter.

 

It was really nice to see Ben bounce back this year. He started too late to make the HOF - but he's had an incredible career.

[Laika]

Ben Zobrist really is the face of the new age of baseball. Finally - teams value players who can play multiple positions well and use that versatility throughout the season to maximize matchups and platoon splits. He's also one of the swing path change players who went from bring a marginal AAAA player to an all-star hitter.

 

It was really nice to see Ben bounce back this year. He started too late to make the HOF - but he's had an incredible career.

 

Ben Zobrist is 37. He was a great poster boy for modern baseball about a whole decade ago. The OBP and positional versatility combo is kind of passé now -- it's all about athleticism and next level hitting/pitching mechanics now.

 

Candidates for the face of "new age baseball" that pop to my mind might be...

 

Trevor Bauer

Matt Chapman

Joey Gallo

Chris Taylor

Trevor Story

Alex Bregman

Whit Merrifield

Luke Maile

Sheryl Ring

Edited October 15, 2018 by Laika

[Orgfiller]

Ben Zobrist is 37. He was a great poster boy for modern baseball about a whole decade ago. The OBP and positional versatility combo is kind of passé now -- it's all about athleticism and next level hitting/pitching mechanics now.

 

Candidates for the face of "new age baseball" that pop to my mind might be...

 

Trevor Bauer

Matt Chapman

Joey Gallo

Chris Taylor

Trevor Story

Alex Bregman

Whit Merrifield

Luke Maile

Sheryl Ring

 

Lindor bro.

[Carlos Danger]

Ben Zobrist is 37. He was a great poster boy for modern baseball about a whole decade ago. The OBP and positional versatility combo is kind of passé now -- it's all about athleticism and next level hitting/pitching mechanics now.

 

Candidates for the face of "new age baseball" that pop to my mind might be...

 

Trevor Bauer

Matt Chapman

Joey Gallo

Chris Taylor

Trevor Story

Alex Bregman

Whit Merrifield

Luke Maile

Sheryl Ring

 

I agree 110% with that whole list except Matt Chapman! OVERRATED!

[Laika]

Ben Zobrist is 37. He was a great poster boy for modern baseball about a whole decade ago. The OBP and positional versatility combo is kind of passé now -- it's all about athleticism and next level hitting/pitching mechanics now.

 

Candidates for the face of "new age baseball" that pop to my mind might be...

 

Trevor Bauer

Matt Chapman

Joey Gallo

Chris Taylor

Trevor Story

Alex Bregman

Whit Merrifield

Luke Maile

Sheryl Ring

 

lol

[Laika]

I agree 110% with that whole list except Matt Chapman! OVERRATED!

 

Yeah I suppose you're right. When you take the highest of the average of a select few of his more important stats and look at them in totality and factor in the eye test, he is overrated!

The fact that he had 6.5 WAR this season after hitting .234 last season basically tells you all you need to know about WAR. What is it good for? Finish my sentence

[Boxcar]

Ben Zobrist is 37. He was a great poster boy for modern baseball about a whole decade ago. The OBP and positional versatility combo is kind of passé now -- it's all about athleticism and next level hitting/pitching mechanics now.

 

Candidates for the face of "new age baseball" that pop to my mind might be...

 

Trevor Bauer

Matt Chapman

Joey Gallo

Chris Taylor

Trevor Story

Alex Bregman

Whit Merrifield

Luke Maile

Sheryl Ring

 

All of these are fantastic candidates.

[Spanky99]

Ben Zobrist is 37. He was a great poster boy for modern baseball about a whole decade ago. The OBP and positional versatility combo is kind of passé now -- it's all about athleticism and next level hitting/pitching mechanics now.

 

Candidates for the face of "new age baseball" that pop to my mind might be...

 

Trevor Bauer

Matt Chapman

Joey Gallo

Chris Taylor

Trevor Story

Alex Bregman

Whit Merrifield

Luke Maile

Sheryl Ring

 

Yeah I suppose you're right. When you take the highest of the average of a select few of his more important stats and look at them in totality and factor in the eye test, he is overrated!

The fact that he had 6.5 WAR this season after hitting .234 last season basically tells you all you need to know about WAR. What is it good for? Finish my sentence

 

Bwahahahaha...

[Carlos Danger]

Yeah I suppose you're right. When you take the highest of the average of a select few of his more important stats and look at them in totality and factor in the eye test, he is overrated!

The fact that he had 6.5 WAR this season after hitting .234 last season basically tells you all you need to know about WAR. What is it good for? Finish my sentence

I am glad we agree. I thought you might be triggered.. I love a happy ending.

[Olerud363]

Biggio AA

 

Age Dif G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB

23 -1.2 132 563 449 80 113 23 5 26 99 20 8 100 148 .252 .388 .499 .887 224 2 5 1 8 4

 

Zobrist AA

 

25 0.8 83 381 315 57 103 25 6 3 30 9 5 55 46 .327 .434 .473 .907 149 7 5 5 1 1

 

 

Maybe one of you guys can better correlate this.. But if I am reading it right it appears Zobrist never had a full season of only AA ball. He did AA/AAA same year.

 

However, he was 25 yrs old when he started AA and went to AAA. Biggio is two years younger. I didn't add Zobrist's AAA numbers because I don't think it would be fair.. There are a lot of stats that Biggio is not too far off from Zobrist for AA ball and considering he is 2 yrs younger..

 

Food for thought...

 

EDIT TO ADDL The categories are all lined up when I edit and then it changes when I post... WTF!

 

The big difference is strikeouts and defence. I've heard middling reports on Biggio's defence, and he strikes out far more than Zobrist.

 

I think the Kelly Johnson comparison is a good outcome.

[Brownie19]

Ben Zobrist is 37. He was a great poster boy for modern baseball about a whole decade ago. The OBP and positional versatility combo is kind of passé now -- it's all about athleticism and next level hitting/pitching mechanics now.

 

Candidates for the face of "new age baseball" that pop to my mind might be...

 

Trevor Bauer

Matt Chapman

Joey Gallo

Chris Taylor

Trevor Story

Alex Bregman

Whit Merrifield

Luke Maile

Sheryl Ring

 

That's fair - but I think it took teams around baseball a long time to catch onto how valuable Zobrist was. His swing change was also well documented - I wonder if that opened up players minds about the possibility of making wholesale changes. I guess we can call him the godfather of new age baseball.

Edited October 15, 2018 by Brownie19

[King]

That's fair - but I think it took teams around baseball a long time to catch onto how valuable Zobrist was. His swing change was also well documented - I wonder if that opened up players minds about the possibility of making wholesale changes. I guess we can call him the godfather of new age baseball.

 

Swing changes are mostly ******** narratives created by the media to create a story. Players are always tinkering with their swing.

 

It's far more likely that Zobrist was always a talented player, he just needed more time and opportunity to succeed. Zobrist was an elite level performer at the upper levels of the minors, just like Josh Donaldson, Max Muncy, etc.

[Boxcar]

Swing changes are mostly ******** narratives created by the media to create a story. Players are always tinkering with their swing.

 

It's far more likely that Zobrist was always a talented player, he just needed more time and opportunity to succeed. Zobrist was an elite level performer at the upper levels of the minors, just like Josh Donaldson, Max Muncy, etc.

 

Justin Turner, Jose Bautista and other guys who grew up being told to "let the ball travel" and try to "spray the ball" say differently.

[King]

Justin Turner, Jose Bautista and other guys who grew up being told to "let the ball travel" and try to "spray the ball" say differently.

Oh look, more guys who had a history of an elite level performance in the minors. Maybe they were just always f***ing good.

 

You can't change your swing and go from bad to instantly an elite level performer, it doesn't work like that. Your example would have worked better for Johan Camargo.

[Laika]

Oh look, more guys who had a history of an elite level performance in the minors. Maybe they were just always f***ing good.

 

You can't change your swing and go from bad to instantly an elite level performer, it doesn't work like that. Your example would have worked better for Johan Camargo.

 

It's kind of funny. You get these guys like Chris Taylor and JDM now who have like, .390 wOBAs, .400 OBPs with power in the minors... they struggle for a few very truncated partial MLB seasons and then get comfortable and start hitting well and everyone is instantly screeching about the flyball revolution and the magic of altering your approach

[Brownie19]

Swing changes are mostly ******** narratives created by the media to create a story. Players are always tinkering with their swing.

 

It's far more likely that Zobrist was always a talented player, he just needed more time and opportunity to succeed. Zobrist was an elite level performer at the upper levels of the minors, just like Josh Donaldson, Max Muncy, etc.

 

Zobrist opening spoke about how Jaime Cevallos completely rebuilt his swing and approach, which ultimately lead to massive improvements. I mean I guess it could be the plasebo effect to some extent and he was going to become a stud hitter regardless, but personally, I'm certainly buying the swing change was the primary factor. Same with Muncy man...he openly talked about how him and his dad rebuild his swing in the 2016 offseason in one last effort to be a ML ball player.

 

https://www.draysbay.com/2009/4/23/849233/cracking-the-zobrist-code-what-is

 

Also - why are you suggesting JD and Muncy were elite level performers in the upper minors? Max Muncy posted wRC+'s of 102 and 108 in AAA before the swing change. JD posted wRC+'s of 103 and 94 before making changes. These players were s***.

[John_Havok]

Zobrist opening spoke about how Jaime Cevallos completely rebuilt his swing and approach, which ultimately lead to massive improvements. I mean I guess it could be the plasebo effect to some extent and he was going to become a stud hitter regardless, but personally, I'm certainly buying the swing change was the primary factor. Same with Muncy man...he openly talked about how him and his dad rebuild his swing in the 2016 offseason in one last effort to be a ML ball player.

 

https://www.draysbay.com/2009/4/23/849233/cracking-the-zobrist-code-what-is

 

Also - why are you suggesting JD and Muncy were elite level performers in the upper minors? Max Muncy posted wRC+'s of 102 and 108 in AAA before the swing change. JD posted wRC+'s of 103 and 94 before making changes. These players were s***.

 

The swing change probably accounts for some of it, and the difference in balls accounts for the rest

[Brownie19]

The swing change probably accounts for some of it, and the difference in balls accounts for the rest

 

wat? different balls made Zobrist, JD, Muncy, etc. star hitters?

[Jimcanuck]

Skill development is not linear, otherwise projections would be far more accurate than they are. What is it, like 50% of MLB regulars never sniffed the BA top 100?

 

Just as much of a factor as swing changes and the MLB ball is mental approach - particularly for hitters. Look at a guy like EE, who went from a mediocre to elite hitter seemingly overnight in 2012 by improving his plate discipline.

[Boxcar]

Oh look, more guys who had a history of an elite level performance in the minors. Maybe they were just always f***ing good.

 

You can't change your swing and go from bad to instantly an elite level performer, it doesn't work like that. Your example would have worked better for Johan Camargo.

 

Or maybe they were given s***** advice until someone finally told them that it's ok to be a pull hitter.

 

Turner in particular started hitting the ball out in front of the plate instead of letting it travel, changed everything and your dumn

[King]

nah thats facts

[Spanky99]

Short little 1 on 1 with Vladito and Blunt @ the phenom's condo in the AFL... doesn't sound like Vladdy's upset with the Jays. "I've waited 19 years, what's another 3 weeks"

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/vladdy-jrs-waited-19-years-mlb-whats-another-3-weeks/

[Spanky99]

Good thing they cropped out the gun pointed at his head.

 

lol... his pops is telling him to say the right things. He adamantly said he was ready, lol. *nudge, nudge* *wink, wink*

 

Kris Bryant's grievance file is still under investigation... I'm sure he's happy with the Cubs.

[Dr. Dinger]

You can hardly expect a hard-hitting, controversial interview to be conducted by the TV network owned by Rogers. I’m surprised they even mentioned service time.

[Spanky99]

You can hardly expect a hard-hitting, controversial interview to be conducted by the TV network owned by Rogers. I’m surprised they even mentioned service time.

 

Brunt asked all the questions people wanted to hear? Also he and Shi went on to talk about the service time in more detail on the coverage last night on TV, it's how I learned Bryant's grievance is still on file with the MLB, Eloy Jimenez agent has filed a grievance, they expect Vladito to follow suit along with FTJ, if he isn't up at some point next year, interesting stuff that's basically meaningless in consideration with the CBA.