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AA and Character

AdamGreenwood

By AdamGreenwood
in Toronto Blue Jays Talk

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Terminator All-Star

Terminator

Old-Timey Member
Posted
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Chemistry is a thing but it's largely reduced because baseball is a game based upon individual outcomes and not so much based upon teamwork like other sports. Even further, it's too difficult to quantify, especially as fans who are disconnected from the inner workings of the game. Therefore, it's mostly worth ignoring especially when winning seems to cure any chemistry issues that there may be.

 

Now if I'm a GM and I KNOW that a guy is a cancer, then maybe I avoid him or at least factor that in to how much I value him. Even then you'd have to be careful. But as a fan it isn't really something I care much about.

BigCecil Vancouver Canadians

BigCecil

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted
A lot of complaining idiots. Bautista is a wonderful dude and even greater player. I hope he is properly appreciated by fans but I doubt it.

 

He is I think. Winning obviously would galvanize that.

 

Was listening to a radio report. They did a major study on robo umps and the MLB player who got the most called strikes on balls outside the zone was Jose.

 

Another good argument for robo umps.

Slade FCL Blue Jays

Slade

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted
He is I think. Winning obviously would galvanize that.

 

Was listening to a radio report. They did a major study on robo umps and the MLB player who got the most called strikes on balls outside the zone was Jose.

 

Another good argument for robo umps.

 

Do you have a source on that? It would certainly be an interesting read.

RealAccountant Dunedin Blue Jays

RealAccountant

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted

He specifically mentioned in one of his interviews prior to the trade acquisitions that he has grown as an executive, and he has come to understand that it is far better to have a good talent with good character, then a great talent with bad character.

 

Around May or June.

saskjayfan Dunedin Blue Jays

saskjayfan

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted
I've never been one to say that chemistry, particularly bad chemistry can't affect a teams results. What is BS is that you can "trade for chemistry", either you have it or you don't. AA upgraded talent, simple as that.

 

so you're saying AA is a good GM...lol

BigCecil Vancouver Canadians

BigCecil

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted
That was using 2008-2009 data. The umps have changed. Here's a good recent study: http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/umpires-are-less-blind-than-they-used-to-be/

 

And one that compares all umps: https://baseballwithr.wordpress.com/2015/04/08/conceptualizing-the-mlb-strike-zone-using-pitchfx-data-part-ii-2/

 

 

There is some measurement error in Pitchf/x so we wouldn't reach 0%, but yes it need to happen.

 

Thanks. Ill read them. I don't think the link I found was what I heard. The one I heard said that Jose was the player receiving the most bad calls in MLB on pitches away.

BigCecil Vancouver Canadians

BigCecil

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted
We have the technology to turn 14% to 0%. 14% is roughly 1 pitch every 2 ABs. That can be pretty damn substantial.

 

Its huge. North has posted some more recent data and I'm trying to find the study I recently heard spoken about.

 

I love instant replay. Its changed the gm so much for the better. Regardless if we win or lose a challenge the right call is made and we don't have to spend days cursing an ump for changing the outcome of a gm over a missed call. Its not a slight against them. It all happens in real time at high speed.

 

Robo Umps is the same principle.

Key22 Draft Eligible

Key22

Verified Member
Posted
Posted
While it is an individual game ... Character comes in when the dead pull homer hitter tries to take the outside pitch and hit a ground ball to second to score the run to win the game...rather than trying to pad his OPS. Its the fielder who runs into tha wall for his pitcher. When you have a good clubhouse they all do that all the time. Also adds confidence to your pitchers who don't feel they have to strike everyone out to win. You get mentally strong players...Martin and you get professional pitchers...MB and RA and Price and you get a bunch of talent. AA gave up a ton of minor league talent...but at least we are seeing on field talent as a result.
reedjohnsonfan Dunedin Blue Jays

reedjohnsonfan

Verified Member
Posted
Posted
This team couldn't of done any worse given the talent. They were 15-27 in 1 run games, 99 "pythogaran wins". They aren't magically winning more games then the stats predict.

 

Now maybe certain players are playing better because of chemistry?? I reject that theory. If guys are playing better it's because of intelligence a.k.a. good advice. It's a little different then chemistry. Maybe Bautista helps Donaldson prepare for each at bat, maybe the veterans are helping Goins be more patient.

 

I mean Jeff Franceur might be the nicest guy ever.. but if he was the clean up hitter and leader and he said "hey guys, I think you gotta be aggressive, you just gotta swing early in the count cause it might the best pitch you see".. he might be the greatest guy but he's giving bad advice.

 

I think their RISP has been higher than expected, someone correct me if I'm wrong. So pythagorean W-L doesn't tell the whole story, but obviously they are even better than their record indicates, especially with the additions of Price and Tulowitzki.

SAAviour FCL Blue Jays

SAAviour

Verified Member
Posted
Posted
When AA first became a general manager, he was a bit of a bargain hunter, picking up guys with known character defects - Colby Rasmus, Yunel Escobar, Brett Lawrie etc.

However, he's unloaded all of those guys, some of them at a discount, and gone out of his way to pick up some guys known to have good character (Price).

 

Question 1: Do you think having players with good character, helps team chemistry, which then helps teams focus on the game, thus generating more wins.

Question 2: Do you think that the recent trades represent AA changing course, on his former plan of picking up players with character flaws, and trying to build a more cohesive chemistry?

Question 3: Does this mean the Jays will have no interest in picking up Jonathan Papelbon from the Phillies on the cheap?

 

Character definitly helps, but also....

Colby sucks, Laurie sucks, and Escobar sucks....ok maybe they don't suck, but they aren't Tulo, Donaldson, Price type of players. We are stacked now!

KingKat All-Star

KingKat

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted
Now that his arm strength is back, I'm wondering if the team can just live with Jose in right. He's not a good OF but he makes up for that somewhat when he's making strong throws. It just seems weird to ask a superstar hitter to learn a new position when he's only under control for one year anyways. I'd be a bit more open to it if the DH spot were open and available as a fall back but since it isn't, I think keeping everyone where they are is the wisest course.
BigCecil Vancouver Canadians

BigCecil

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted
Puig in left, Revere/Pillar platoon in centre, Jose in right, Colabello/Smoak at first.

 

Sincere question here because I know you will have a statistically justifiable answer:

 

Puig arm > Jose's (notwithstanding the 2 great throws he just made in one game against NYY) Why would you put Puig in LF? Puig is not a great RF'er but he isn't declining as much as Jose's OF defensive numbers.

 

Kingat ^ above does make sense on the new pos issue for Jose. But he is a former IF.

AdamGreenwood Dunedin Blue Jays

AdamGreenwood

Old-Timey Member
Posted
  • Author
Posted
We have the technology to turn 14% to 0%. 14% is roughly 1 pitch every 2 ABs. That can be pretty damn substantial.

 

An that same technolgy can turn Russel Martin's 6 WAR/season into 3 WAR/season.

Followthelight First Round Pick

Followthelight

Verified Member
Posted
Posted
Now that his arm strength is back, I'm wondering if the team can just live with Jose in right. He's not a good OF but he makes up for that somewhat when he's making strong throws. It just seems weird to ask a superstar hitter to learn a new position when he's only under control for one year anyways. I'd be a bit more open to it if the DH spot were open and available as a fall back but since it isn't, I think keeping everyone where they are is the wisest course.

 

His arm in no way makes up for his fielding...how many times does his glove come onto play versus his strong arm? You don't throw out many runners over the course of the season.

KingKat All-Star

KingKat

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted
His arm in no way makes up for his fielding...how many times does his glove come onto play versus his strong arm? You don't throw out many runners over the course of the season.

 

Yeah and I didn't say that did I? I'm just saying it's a positive. Not saying that it completely offsets the negative that is his fielding and I made that pretty clear.

baubau FCL Blue Jays

baubau

Verified Member
Posted
Posted
save assets or spend a fortune on heyward. eenie meenie.

 

Yeah, but getting a asset like Puig is going to cost at least Osuna, Alfrod, maybe Pompey, and Hutch. If you want to spend assets go after a pitcher like Corrasco, and used save money from that on Hayward. Get more value out of your money/assets and moar WINZ.

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