Anthopoulos: 5 year contract limit is "flexible"

[KingKat]

As I said before. Boras clients demand top dollar. Blue Jays don't offer top dollar unless its via trade. No Boras client fits in the Blue Jays bargain hunting philosphy. Has nothing to do with the agent itself.

 

I have no problem with this interpretation. I do have a problem with you calling thoe other interpretation dumb. Like I said before those who believe that there's a tryst are basing their belief on things that actually happened. For you to call their interpretation dumb especially when your recollection of what transpired is deformed in a way that suits your opinion, makes you the dummy.

 

This is dumb.

[Ehjays]

I have no problem with this interpretation. I do have a problem with you calling thoe other interpretation dumb. Like I said before those who believe that there's a tryst are basing their belief on things that actually happened. For you to call their interpretation dumb especially when your recollection of what transpired is deformed in a way that suits your opinion, makes you the dummy.

 

Well said

[Olerud363]

I think Paxton is the one who had the issue with the Blue Jays. And Beeston wasn't even with the organization at the time. Boras was on the radio earlier this year he addressed all this. He has no problem making deals with the Blue Jays. This is all in peoples heads.

 

Beeston is a monster. An absolutely evil man. Others are better at politics then I am so pull their punches. Basicially Beeston was bitter and screwed Paxton by dropping hints to NCAA and caused Paxton to lose NCAA eligibility. It apparently went to a lawsuit (between Pax and NCAA).

 

The comments floating around about the Blue Jays screwing Farrell "their not good people", there's a reason for that. Beeston isn't good people.

 

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"Because it was Scott, the way you deal, you deal through him," Beeston said. "You don't deal through the family."

 

Amateur ballplayers are allowed to have so-called "family advisers," but risk forfeiting NCAA eligibility if "agents" become too involved in contract negotiations. It's a fine line, and there is a wink-and-nudge nature to the dance.

 

"That's how it operates," father Ted Paxton said. "It's just that it came to the attention of the NCAA."

 

Ted Paxton said the family was "surprised and confused" by Beeston's remarks, but is not bitter.

[Olerud363]

Check your history. Beeston was around before AA became GM. He was interim President looking for his replacement and handling some negotiations. He's literally the one who caused the Paxton situation by leaking Boras' involvment to the media.

 

As far as Boras is concerned, there's no reason for him to broadcast a tryst with the Jays if there is one. If nothing else, he can use hypothetical Jays interest as leverage. He certainly isn't smarting from the Paxton situation as much as Paxton himself but that doesn't mean he's keen to talk to the Jays or that the Jays are keen to talk to him.

 

Maybe the Jays and Boras are just ships in night who just don't have a convergence of interests right now. That's not an unfair speculation but the fact remains that the last time Beeston and Boras spoke it went pretty damn poorly, Neither side got what they wanted and the player ended up having to spend a season without MLB or NCAA eligibility. At that point it was the first time in years that the Jays had taken a Boras client and there haven't been any since.

 

 

 

Pretty easy to say when you're account of Beeston and Boras's history isn't even acurate.

 

Both Boras and Beeston are master politicians... they aren't like us, little guys on the internet. We get into a war with someone, we make our hate and discust at them pulbically known and battle them with fierce intensity on the internet message boards... Boras and Beeston have a war... it's a gentlemen's war.

 

These guys don't want the little guys like us even aware of their war... we're not worthy of being privy to it. So it's cupcakes and roses publically... but behind the scenes different story.

[connorp]

I have no problem with this interpretation. I do have a problem with you calling thoe other interpretation dumb. Like I said before those who believe that there's a tryst are basing their belief on things that actually happened. For you to call their interpretation dumb especially when your recollection of what transpired is deformed in a way that suits your opinion, makes you the dummy.

 

I don't remember the drama but I just cant wrap my head around a team that would automaically disregard a player they are really high on and can help the team in a big way. More than likely this is jut a case where boras wants more than jays are willing to pay. Not like they're known for emptying the pockets with FA

[KingKat]

I don't remember the drama but I just cant wrap my head around a team that would automaically disregard a player they are really high on and can help the team in a big way. More than likely this is jut a case where boras wants more than jays are willing to pay. Not like they're known for emptying the pockets with FA

 

In many ways it's a trist of convenience. The interests aren't aligned so there's no reason to bury the hatchett. The Jays could get desperate though as options delcine. Someone like Geoff Baker fits the Jays like a glove and, Boras or not, there's only so much he could be realistically demanding. If AA handles all negotiations, it seems like something that could and should be done but Beeston is such a tool that you never really know how far he would take this. Between Boras and Beeston, I put more faith in Boras to be the one who sees the big picture. Ultimately, he always gets the best deals for his clients. I think he would do that even in the unlikely scenario where the best for his client is the Jays

[Ehjays]

 

The comments floating around about the Blue Jays screwing Farrell "their not good people", there's a reason for that. Beeston isn't good people.

 

Not sure how we screwed Farrell........We gave him his first big league managerial job, and when we were blocking his "dream" we gave him an out. If anyone got screwed it was us. Screwing him would have been us saying "dream job eh, for this last year of your commitment to the Toronto Blue jay Organization we're sending you on a special assignment for this year and replacing youas manager." That would be screwing him.

[Olerud363]

Not sure how we screwed Farrell........We gave him his first big league managerial job, and when we were blocking his "dream" we gave him an out. If anyone got screwed it was us. Screwing him would have been us saying "dream job eh, for this last year of your commitment to the Toronto Blue jay Organization we're sending you on a special assignment for this year and replacing youas manager." That would be screwing him.

 

I probably should tone it down a bit on this, so let me explain rationally. Farrell's budies in Cleveland basically have said that Farrell was treated badly.

 

Putting it all together we have comments from Farrell regarding hiring his Boston hitting coach, comments from Lind regarding Farrell vs. Murphy, comments from Farrell regarding "Player development", long standing comments from Beeston/Gaston/Murphy regarding philosaphy on player development and hitting approach (old is good, pull is good, opfield is bad, oba is bad).

 

My guess is Farrell wanted an on base ish team and had a lot of thoughts on player development. Cito still has Beeston's ear so Beeston basically thought the opposite of Farrell. AA was really hired to implement Beeston's vision (starting with a year long retirement ceramony for Cito) so AA is powerless.

 

Beeston didn't like or listen to Farrell, and thus the reported tension extended to AA and Farrell (AAs is only there to fulfill Beeston's wishes, like anybody has to for their boss).

 

In the end Farrell didn't get screwed, got his dream job and won the World Series. It would be more accurate to say that Beeston and Farrell did not see eye to eye, Beeston didn't take Farrell's ideas seriously.... Farrell in the end went to be part of a team where everybody was on the same page.

[Ehjays]

I probably should tone it down a bit on this, so let me explain rationally. Farrell's budies in Cleveland basically have said that Farrell was treated badly.

 

Putting it all together we have comments from Farrell regarding hiring his Boston hitting coach, comments from Lind regarding Farrell vs. Murphy, comments from Farrell regarding "Player development", long standing comments from Beeston/Gaston/Murphy regarding philosaphy on player development and hitting approach (old is good, pull is good, opfield is bad, oba is bad).

 

My guess is Farrell wanted an on base ish team and had a lot of thoughts on player development. Cito still has Beeston's ear so Beeston basically thought the opposite of Farrell. AA was really hired to implement Beeston's vision (starting with a year long retirement ceramony for Cito) so AA is powerless.

 

Beeston didn't like or listen to Farrell, and thus the reported tension extended to AA and Farrell (AAs is only there to fulfill Beeston's wishes, like anybody has to for their boss).

 

In the end Farrell didn't get screwed, got his dream job and won the World Series. It would be more accurate to say that Beeston and Farrell did not see eye to eye, Beeston didn't take Farrell's ideas seriously.... Farrell in the end went to be part of a team where everybody was on the same page.

 

Ok, Yeah i Gotcha! I see your point.

[connorp]

In many ways it's a trist of convenience. The interests aren't aligned so there's no reason to bury the hatchett. The Jays could get desperate though as options delcine. Someone like Geoff Baker fits the Jays like a glove and, Boras or not, there's only so much he could be realistically demanding. If AA handles all negotiations, it seems like something that could and should be done but Beeston is such a tool that you never really know how far he would take this. Between Boras and Beeston, I put more faith in Boras to be the one who sees the big picture. Ultimately, he always gets the best deals for his clients. I think he would do that even in the unlikely scenario where the best for his

client is the Jays

 

Yeah I can agree with that line of thinking. Sure there can be animosity and a reluctance to deal with someone..but if there's a glove that fits perfectly anyone with half a brain wouldn't hold the team back for a high school like grudge

[Brenner]

Maybe they are in on Choo, otherwise why keep bringing this 5 yr max rule up. He would make Rasmus very expendable, though an OF of Choo, Rasmus, Joey Batts may be the best in baseball?

[TRM]

Honestly, the 5 year policy wasn't a horrible one. A lot of it makes sense in theory, provided that there are good matches for the Jays that don't expect 6+ year deals.

 

Long deals almost always end poorly.

[NorthOf49]

Maybe they are in on Choo, otherwise why keep bringing this 5 yr max rule up. He would make Rasmus very expendable, though an OF of Choo, Rasmus, Joey Batts may be the best in baseball?

AA wants to spend almost all of his resources on starting pitching. So if they make a play on Choo, I assume it's to move Rasmus out for a starter. Choo could play CF, or you'd move Bautista to first (or Melky to DH, Choo to LF), trade Lind and acquire a new centrefielder.

[TRM]

No Choo at CF.

 

Just no.

[Angrioter]

Honestly, the 5 year policy wasn't a horrible one. A lot of it makes sense in theory, provided that there are good matches for the Jays that don't expect 6+ year deals.

 

Long deals almost always end poorly.

 

The "5 years policy" is correct but .............limited to the Jays to attract talent from the free agency.

[Sammy225]

AA wants to spend almost all of his resources on starting pitching. So if they make a play on Choo, I assume it's to move Rasmus out for a starter. Choo could play CF, or you'd move Bautista to first (or Melky to DH, Choo to LF), trade Lind and acquire a new centrefielder.

 

I would think it would go more something like this (if something was to happen). Rasmus traded (Gose to CF Choo to LF) then Lind to be Traded then Melky would be DH.

[NorthOf49]

No Choo at CF.

 

Just no.

Trade for Kemp too then? Or do all this:

 

- Sign Choo at 6/114

- Trade DJ Davis and A-ball pitching prospect for Matt Kemp and $20M

- Trade Rasmus for Homer Bailey

- Trade EE and Melky for Taijuan Walker and Nick Franklin, then trade Walker and C prospect for Cole Hamels and $8M

- Trade Buehrle and C prospect and $5M for Billy Butler

[Brenner]

Here's my theory on this:

 

The five-year limit was enacted to get leverage on free agents. They wouldn't be able to bully the Jays into handing out six or seven years because AA and the Beest could say, "sorry, that's against club policy." But what happened is that agents started ignoring the Blue Jays, and their reputation in the industry as free agent players took a nosedive as any player worth his salt was signing for five+ years, it wasn't unreasonable at all to expect teams to go past five. Calling the Blue Jays was a waste of time since they weren't committed to spending. AA has realized this, prompting this new information.

 

I don't think the 5 year max limit is to get leverage on FA, that would be rather silly to expect that considering there are plenty of other teams in the league. I always assumed it was to gain leverage on possible extensions with their own players and to be able to control the length of those.

 

There are very few FA that get over 5 years and none to date I think the Jays would have cared to compete for and other than Choo there are no current FA who will get more than 5 years that the Jays would care for. The 5 year limit has no impact on 95% of the FAs out there, and 0 of the pitchers.

[mitchf]

Choo isn't a possibility.

 

36 year old Jimenez will be a great Blue Jay!

[jays_fever]

Trade for Kemp too then? Or do all this:

 

- Sign Choo at 6/114

- Trade DJ Davis and A-ball pitching prospect for Matt Kemp and $20M

- Trade Rasmus for Homer Bailey

- Trade EE and Melky for Taijuan Walker and Nick Franklin, then trade Walker and C prospect for Cole Hamels and $8M

- Trade Buehrle and C prospect and $5M for Billy Butler

 

What's with your hard on for Kemp..

[Chappy]

The winter meeting have been really boring.

[NorthOf49]

What's with your hard on for Kemp..

I'm going to make him my display pic!

[Ehjays]

The winter meeting have been really boring.

 

I agree, when AA changing his stance on the 5 year contract limit gets the main thread then yes the meetings are boring

[G-Snarls]

Jeez, tell Dombrowski to accept a Fister package equivalent and done

 

[G-Snarls]

I want him. I just don't want to see Scherzer become AA's "2014 Dickey"

[mitchf]

I want him. I just don't want to see Scherzer become AA's "2014 Dickey"

Well what do you want? Scherzer isn't coming here unless we trade Detroit our 2 best prospects and more.

[FireAlexAnthopoulos]

Translation: "I'm about to f*** this franchise over even more with some of the worst contracts in baseball."

[G-Snarls]

Well what do you want? Scherzer isn't coming here unless we trade Detroit our 2 best prospects and more.

 

Ideally for only 1 of Stroman or Sanchez, a quality bullpen arm (Santos or Janssen) and one other player (a replaceable major leaguer or a non-elite prospect)

 

That probably doesn't get it done I realize, since Scherzer > Fister

 

The fact he's a Boras client and therefore likely unextendable will mean teams almost certainly won't give up 2 elite prospects for him

[mitchf]

Ideally for only 1 of Stroman or Sanchez, a quality bullpen arm (Santos or Janssen) and one other player (a replaceable major leaguer or a non-elite prospect)

 

That probably doesn't get it done I realize, since Scherzer > Fister

 

The fact he's a Boras client and therefore likely unextendable will mean teams almost certainly won't give up 2 elite prospects for him

Except Alex.

[G-Snarls]

Except Alex.

 

Don't even...