Can Ryan Goins stick?

[GD]

I've always said I think he has a 10% chance of sticking, if not here then somewhere else. That actually means I think he had a 90% chance of not sticking. Can you grasp that for a second please?

 

He's not even referring specifically to you. There are a lot of fans that think that that 10%, which I find quite high mind you, is too low.

[GD]

Lol!! Do you even watch the games?

 

From his mother's basement, of course.

[GD]

86 wRC+ as a 25 year old in AAA

 

I'm on his fangraphs page and it lists a 90 wRC+

[gruber92]

The question to determine who's shittier is if Goins' glove can be better than Thames' bat, lol.

 

Goins is a polished defender, refute that all you want. He just has to put up average offensive number to contribute in a positive way.

[gruber92]

So the official gruber92 stance is to lol at the notion that Ryan Goins is a replacement-level player because he's looked pretty OK in 8 games. I think we're done here.

 

Holy f*** bro, seriously?

[gruber92]

So the official gruber92 stance is to lol at the notion that Ryan Goins is a replacement-level player because he's looked pretty OK in 8 games. I think we're done here.

 

Holy f*** bro, seriously?

[GD]

Goins is a polished defender, refute that all you want. He just has to put up average offensive number to contribute in a positive way.

 

-Goins MAY be a polished defender. We need more than an 8 game sample to see that.

-These are the league average numbers for a 2B.

[gruber92]

Oh, that's all!?

 

I'm just rooting for the guy. He has a fundamental base that Mottola can work with. Have you watched his Ab's? How can anybody who has watched him hit refute this?

[gruber92]

Oh god the comments section. Especially this:

 

"What good prospects did he trade away? Goins, Gose, Pillar, and Sierra all look pretty good to me."

 

Please don't bring the casual camels into this.

[GD]

Oh god the comments section. Especially this:

 

"What good prospects did he trade away? Goins, Gose, Pillar, and Sierra all look pretty good to me."

 

http://24.media.tumblr.com/f87ee0bf7331f43354171e200193bfaa/tumblr_mnshmzgvkz1stojq7o1_400.jpg

[GD]

 

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m851grT4C31ql09up.gif

[Nox]

Goins is a polished defender, refute that all you want. He just has to put up average offensive number to contribute in a positive way.

 

Well considering that he's 25 and projects to put up offensive production 34% below average, it's essentially a lottery ticket. Far less than a 10% chance ( a number you pulled directly out of your ass) at becoming a league average bat.

[GD]

Well considering that he's 25 and projects to put up offensive production 34% below average, it's essentially a lottery ticket.

 

Wow. RoS projections are really, really bad for him lol.

[theblujay]

I'm just rooting for the guy. He has a fundamental base that Mottola can work with. Have you watched his Ab's? How can anybody who has watched him hit refute this?

 

They don't believe he can get better because he's too old to have any room to grow. Which of course isn't always true.

[gruber92]

Well considering that he's 25 and projects to put up offensive production 34% below average, it's essentially a lottery ticket. Far less than a 10% chance ( a number you pulled directly out of your ass) at becoming a league average bat.

 

How about we just let the kid play and try and prove himself. What do ya think?

[theblujay]

Let him play, BABIP fueled September, Starter next season, fails, we have no 2B

 

That's how this will go

 

Even if that happens and if he sucks his good D will be an upgrade over what we got from 2B this year

[gruber92]

Let him play, BABIP fueled September, Starter next season, fails, we have no 2B

 

That's how this will go

 

WTF is it with all this BABIP fueled ********? Somebody else quoted that Pillar's BABIP was something like .220 and comparing the two like Goins is so much more luckier. Don't you think the reason on why Goins' BABIP is a lot higher is because he put himself in hitter's counts more often? Pitch recognition is a skill set and Goins earned those hitter's counts against quality pitching and is obviously taking advantage. Some of it is luck obviously,but that applies to every hitter. Please don't undermine what he has done so far,your not being fair.

[gruber92]

Apparently you don't understand what BABIP is

 

I guess not.

[gruber92]

That would explain a lot

 

I always thought it meant Batting Average on Balls in Play. I don't know all the specifics. That would explain i'm not a statistically fueled nerd.

[Abomination]

That would explain a lot

 

You need to tone it down a little. If someone doesn't understand a stat (and isn't just trying to stir up trouble), try explaining it to them so they learn something.

[gruber92]

http://www.fangraphs.com/library/offense/babip/ good reference point

 

Thanks for the link,and i skimmed through it. For myself,i like the old fashioned way of assessing a player. It all starts with pitch recognition,being able to put yourself in a hitter's count as frequent as possible. We all know how dramatic the league batting average is from being up 1-0 instead of 0-1. Being up 2-0 or 3-1 is even more dramatic. I also look at body language when taking a pitch,that also says a lot. Does the hitter keep his head and front shoulder in through his swing long enough? Line drive rate? Basically if a hitter has the ability to hit the ball hard consistently,the numbers will follow. It's a simple game and i like viewing it in a simply based,fundamental manner.

[gruber92]

You can evaluate hitters whatever way you would like but you can't completely toss advanced stats out the window (like that other guy I. This thread)

 

Of course not because advanced stats hold true for the most part. The thing is,sometimes players with good fundamental bases can prosper with different types of applications (scenery,coaching,maturity or whatever). If there is no base,there is no hope. Being just an overall smart person and work ethic also helps.

[Boxcar]

Let's be real for a second. Maybe you're an exemption but the "hive" on here want him to fail, so they can reflect back on this thread and hammer out to everyone how their statistical genie is NEVER WRONG. It would be too much of a disappointment if Goins does in fact stick, especially with the traction this thread has. I bet even if he does stick, they'll still find reasons on why he shouldn't be here. It's almost like their not real fans anymore, just a bunch of statistical gurus managing a baseball team in a video game.

 

All of this is in your head.

[Boxcar]

The situations are not the same. We're just hoping that Goins can hit to stick, in Thames we were looking for a f***ing miracle. The only way Thames would've stuck is if he hit 300 with 25-30 HR power. The offensive expectations for Goins are nowhere near the same, from a second baseman's type numbers of course.

 

How the are these situations different? Thames and Goins are both mediocre non prospects, both are being given a shot at a vacant position and in both cases AA is being fooled by success in a small sample. Actually, Thames probably had more upside than Goins when he came up. People were enamored with Chocolate Thunder, just like with Goins now.

 

Where's Thames? Couldn't even crack the Mariners' 25 man and they don't even care about defense. Goins might be the next Mike McCoy but it will take a miracle for anything more than that.

Edited September 2, 2013 by Boxcar

[Convo]

Are you f***ing retarded? How the f*** are these situations different? Thames and Goins are both mediocre non prospects, both are being given a shot at a vacant position and in both cases AA is being fooled by success in a small sample. Actually, Thames probably had more upside than Goins when he came up. People were enamored with Chocolate Thunder, just like with Goins now.

 

Where's Thames? Couldn't even crack the f***ing Mariners' 25 man and they don't even care about defense. Goins might be the next Mike McCoy but it will take a miracle for anything more than that.

 

You're probably right but your attitude is not.

[Boxcar]

Thanks for the link,and i skimmed through it. For myself,i like the old fashioned way of assessing a player. It all starts with pitch recognition,being able to put yourself in a hitter's count as frequent as possible. We all know how dramatic the league batting average is from being up 1-0 instead of 0-1. Being up 2-0 or 3-1 is even more dramatic. I also look at body language when taking a pitch,that also says a lot. Does the hitter keep his head and front shoulder in through his swing long enough? Line drive rate? Basically if a hitter has the ability to hit the ball hard consistently,the numbers will follow. It's a simple game and i like viewing it in a simply based,fundamental manner.

 

The old fashioned way of assessing players ends in giving Derek Jeter and 40-something-games-at-first Rafael Palmeiro Gold Gloves.

[Boxcar]

DFAd by the orioles today

 

Yeah I saw, without a single f***ing at bat for them. Goddamn, like maybe Ramon Ortiz will come back next year and go 3 or 4 starts in a row with no earned runs, a k/bb well below 1 and a 50% fb rate and these dumbass casuals will be going on about how he's found the fountain of youth.

 

To this day it amazes me how often cases like Goins and Thames go exactly as planned and these idiots act all cocky about it after 8 games.

[Boxcar]

You're probably right but your attitude is not.

 

You're right, I made it more PG, though I've already been quoted twice lol.

 

I'm in an irritable mood with a bad sunburn.

[havok24]

A 21 page thread dedicated to Ryan f***ing Goins lol.

[John_Havok]

I know....just....wow