GDT: Jays @ Cardinals 2:15 EST Rubber Match of the 3 Game Set

[Stangstag]

Silver lining, Bassitt required very few pitches to serve up home run derby pitches to the Cardinals. He was efficient.

 

Efficient inefficiency

[Captain_Obvious]

Efficient inefficiency

 

Efficiently ineffective. The new money ball.

[bones10]

If he was constantly shaking the catcher off, then he was already calling his own games anyways. So the pitchcom and selecting his own pitches SHOULD help him.

 

The pitch clock however… idk hopefully he can adjust

 

Should help him be a dictator, not necessarily helps him with better selection.

 

Anyone have input on this? It was my understanding that catchers game calling was a massive aspect to their game and has been for years. It seems unlikely that pitchers would be able to handle this new role without a huge learning curve. even then I feel like the catchers other set of eyes in tbe calling of pitches in a situation would straight up be better.

 

even if he was stepping off a lot last year, the catcher still had some input, and may even have had the final say after a lot of the mound visits between the two.

[Olerud363]

It's like... the game doesn't want any of us to be fans or something.

 

Manoah sucks

Team walks 14 times and doesn't score

Bassitt has the 3rd worst start in Jays history and is probably worse than Tanner Roark

 

 

I am in so much pain

 

The Cardinals out-homered the Jays 6-0. Their homerun per flyball rate was infinite times the Blue Jays fly ball per homerun rate.

 

If the Jays and opponents fly ball per homerun rate normalizes things will be OK I think. If the opposition continues to outhomer the Jays by a 324 to nothing pace the season will be very bad.

 

If the homerun rates don't normalize because somehow the Jays lost their man strength, and Jays pitchers all throw 90 (except Kukichi) then season will be bad.

 

I am usually the first one ready to jump off a ledge but I will wait a few games yet.

[jaysblue]

Meh I was always 50/50 on the Bassitt signing because of his age, but it's only one start so can't freak out just yet. Hopefully he turns it around and can be a decent mid-rotation starter this season who posts a 2-3 WAR season, which I think he should be once he settles in.

[jaysblue]

It's like... the game doesn't want any of us to be fans or something.

 

Manoah sucks

Team walks 14 times and doesn't score

Bassitt has the 3rd worst start in Jays history and is probably worse than Tanner Roark

 

 

I am in so much pain

 

Manoah won't be as good as he was last season. He's not posting a 2.24 ERA again. He'll still be a solid arm, but he's not an ace like everyone thinks he is. His ERA will be in the high 3's, low 4's most likely.

[Laika]

I did look up Bassit's velocity game logs from 2022

 

His sinker average velo in his first 3 starts last year was similar to yesterday

[BigCecil]

Manoah won't be as good as he was last season. He's not posting a 2.24 ERA again. He'll still be a solid arm, but he's not an ace like everyone thinks he is. His ERA will be in the high 3's, low 4's most likely.

 

I really like Manoah, but he is one of the most over hyped arms in MLB. Unless he masters another pitch like a change, that is plus, I think he will still be a solid 2-3, but will regress. Low K numbers. Avg V. Inconsistent breaking ball. The whole "mound presence" narrative is up there with vetrin presents.

[Stangstag]

I did look up Bassit's velocity game logs from 2022

 

His sinker average velo in his first 3 starts last year was similar to yesterday

 

That’s encouraging I suppose

[Stangstag]

I really like Manoah, but he is one of the most over hyped arms in MLB. Unless he masters another pitch like a change, that is plus, I think he will still be a solid 2-3, but will regress. Low K numbers. Avg V. Inconsistent breaking ball. The whole "mound presence" narrative is up there with vetrin presents.

 

I see him as a similar pitcher to Stroman. Not an ace but consistently a solid #2/#3

[Deadpool]

I think he needs to get rid of these 8 pitches and get 8 new ones

 

Needs a Gyroball.

[BigCecil]

I see him as a similar pitcher to Stroman. Not an ace but consistently a solid #2/#3

 

Funny, was thinking exact same comparable this am. More likely to give you a solid 2-4 'ish season than a #1 (which is a pretty rare commodity anyway).

[Laika]

63 Stuff+ on Bassitt's sinker last game

He threw it more than any other pitch, by far (40%)

 

He had a 96 Stuff+ on it last year

what the f*** happened yesterday!?

 

2022 Bassitt on the year, all pitches combined:

98 Stuff+ and 102 Location+

 

Bassitt yesterday:

77 Stuff+ and 97 Location+

[Jonn]

Unless you throw it very hard with great late break is the sinker even a good pitch anymore? I feel like low 90’s sinker are getting crushed way more now than they did 10-15 years ago.

[jaysblue]

I really like Manoah, but he is one of the most over hyped arms in MLB. Unless he masters another pitch like a change, that is plus, I think he will still be a solid 2-3, but will regress. Low K numbers. Avg V. Inconsistent breaking ball. The whole "mound presence" narrative is up there with vetrin presents.

 

I agree. Most casuals and the media here treats him as an ace, when in reality Kevin Gausman is the best pitcher on this staff.

 

Manoah still will be solid like you said, but will have seasons where he looks like a solid No. 2 or a 3/4. His ceiling is pretty much a Marcus Stroman type arm.

[Laika]

The average fastball from a RHP is like 94+ now

 

So a low 90s sinker will tend to have below average velo, and movement the modern models do not love.

 

A lot of mediocre sinkers should just never be thrown, you're right.

 

Bassitt's sinker in 2022 was actually pretty good. You take a 98 Pitching+ on it all day because it can set up all his other pitches.

 

But... there might be some model bias against sinkers. They do have some functions that perhaps are not properly appreciated by the models.

[John_Havok]

[Stangstag]

63 Stuff+ on Bassitt's sinker last game

He threw it more than any other pitch, by far (40%)

 

He had a 96 Stuff+ on it last year

what the f*** happened yesterday!?

 

2022 Bassitt on the year, all pitches combined:

98 Stuff+ and 102 Location+

 

Bassitt yesterday:

77 Stuff+ and 97 Location+

 

First start jitters? Wind got to him? Pitch clock adjustment issues? who knows

[G-Snarls]

First start jitters? Wind got to him? Pitch clock adjustment issues? who knows

 

Suddenly decision to call his own game

 

Lots of reasons

 

I am trying not to judge until I've seen at least 3-4 starts

[Solaxys]

We are all kinda praying Kikuchi Spring is the true Kikuchi at this point.

 

Manoah will sort it out and Kevin will be fine, but 3 inconsistent starters is going to be frustrating year, not to mention we'll be running these 3 next year again.

[Stangstag]

We are all kinda praying Kikuchi Spring is the true Kikuchi at this point.

 

Manoah will sort it out and Kevin will be fine, but 3 inconsistent starters is going to be frustrating year, not to mention we'll be running these 3 next year again.

 

It would be pretty funny if Kikuchi turned out to be a legit #2/3 this year and Bassit tanked.

[glory]

It would be pretty funny if Kikuchi turned out to be a legit #2/3 this year and Bassit tanked.

 

There is nothing wrong with Kikuchi's stuff/velocity so there's at least a chance of him bouncing back if he made some adjustments. Same with Berrios. It's Bassitt that scares the s*** out of me. I know it's one start, but call it Roark PTSD when you see an old SP who didn't throw that hard to begin with suddenly lose miles on his pitches.

[Stangstag]

There is nothing wrong with Kikuchi's stuff/velocity so there's at least a chance of him bouncing back if he made some adjustments. Same with Berrios. It's Bassitt that scares the s*** out of me. I know it's one start, but call it Roark PTSD when you see an old SP who didn't throw that hard to begin with suddenly lose miles on his pitches.

 

Roark/Ryu PTSD. We've been burned on a handful of SP contracts over the last couple years

[Jonn]

Berrios has been known to fool us. Hes looked good for 3 or 4 innings then absolutely shits the bed.

[Solaxys]

Berrios needs to be given Stripling treatment. Dude cannot be trusted 3rd time through even if his stuff looks good for the day.

 

But he is touted to be the innings eater. So 4 ER, 6-7 IP per game is good enough.

[G-Snarls]

Berrios has been known to fool us. Hes looked good for 3 or 4 innings then absolutely shits the bed.

 

Would be so hard to trust him in a post season game