Brook Jacoby Appreciation Thread

[G-Snarls]

the thing is Goins passes the eye test. He has a great eye and he is taking pitches where they are thrown.

 

look at that sexy spray chart:

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/spraycharts.aspx?playerid=9807&position=2B&type=battedball&pid2=9807&ss1=2014&se1=2014&ss2=2015&se2=2015&cht1=hangtime&cht2=hittype&vs1=ALL&vs2=ALL

 

LOL

 

We seem to be in sync posting

[G-Snarls]

I cannot see how anyone assumes Goins cannot improve? Why can't he? No one knows if this is just a blip or he can sustain it, but there is no reason he cannot become a better hitter, it does happen.

 

Plus he actually did hit reasonably well (albeit without much power) all through the minors

[Dr. Dinger]

I never would have believed he'd hit for a 90-ish wRC+ full season

 

But he did

 

Kudos

 

124 games isn't a full season and Ryan Goins is still a below average hitter.

[Dr. Dinger]

Well I guess in Goins's case it would be more like from s***** to merely mediocre.

 

I like Goins just fine as a utility infielder who can play full-time on a short basis due to his defensive strength, but let's not pretend he's even a mediocre hitter.

[KingKat]

I like Goins just fine as a utility infielder who can play full-time on a short basis due to his defensive strength, but let's not pretend he's even a mediocre hitter.

 

So you're saying his improvement isn't real even though his change in approach is demonstrable?

 

And who said anything about him being more than a utility player going forward? Now you're just throwing out a strawman.

[Dr. Dinger]

So you're saying his improvement isn't real even though his change in approach is demonstrable?

 

And who said anything about him being more than a utility player going forward? Now you're just throwing out a strawman.

 

I didn't say his imrovement wasn't real, what I said is that even with his improvement he's still a below average hitter.

[KingKat]

His change in approach isn't demonstrable. He happened to swing at less pitches for a couple weeks in August.

 

And then he reverted back to his old approach?

[KingKat]

I didn't say his imrovement wasn't real, what I said is that even with his improvement he's still a below average hitter.

 

I would consider that mediocre but that's just semantics.

[Dr. Dinger]

I would consider that mediocre but that's just semantics.

 

And just to be clear, you want to give credit to Jacoby, not Goins?

[Followthelight]

Nobody is saying that he absolutely cannot improve.

 

 

He really didn't, though. Goins has hit .272/.324/.362 in 841 triple-A PA as a player in his mid-20s and didn't hit better at lower levels when he was young either.

 

But some of the posts are pretty much insinuatating just that....

 

I didn't say his imrovement wasn't real, what I said is that even with his improvement he's still a below average hitter.

 

Like this...Who says he cannot become better then a below average hitter? he is still young and has had 1 full season.... No one knows what the future holds...but let's not write him off yet.

[Dr. Dinger]

God bless Brook Jacoby for teaching Colabello how to muster a .407 BABIP! Success story!

[G-Snarls]

I didn't say his imrovement wasn't real, what I said is that even with his improvement he's still a below average hitter.

 

By 10-15% ATM. With GG caliber defense at a position where you'll generally accept below average hitting. In a lineup that's so deep you can happily plug him in the 8th spot and be happy with what he's been doing.

[Dr. Dinger]

he is still young

 

Not really.

[Dr. Dinger]

By 10-15% ATM. With GG caliber defense at a position where you'll generally accept below average hitting. In a lineup that's so deep you can happily plug him in the 8th spot and be happy with what he's been doing.

 

We're talking strictly about hitting, this is a thread about the hitting coach. His defense isn't germane to the discussion of how good a hitter he is.

[KingKat]

And just to be clear, you want to give credit to Jacoby, not Goins?

 

Meh. We both know that there's no way to measure Jacoby's impact. FWIW, this is what Goins had to say. You can't make very much or very little out of it. f*** if I know the truth.

 

“In my case last year, it was ‘take pitches, hit the ball the other way all the time,’ ” Goins said. “It wasn’t what I felt comfortable doing. It wasn’t what got me here. Then this year I come in and they both say, ‘Do what you want, and if you have questions, ask and we’ll help.’ And that’s exactly what’s happened.

“It’s been great. The biggest thing I think this year is being comfortable. If you’re not comfortable, you’re not going to have success.”

 

 

[HERPDERP]

I don't think anyone argues that Goins > Travis. Travis was on pace for a stellar RoY season.

 

Goins is an excellent bench bat that could also start for an NL team. He's also someone you have no problems having +500 AB.

[G-Snarls]

Look, all this said, I still want Travis back to be the regular 2B

 

Having Tulo, Travis and Goins is a VERY nice complement of MIF guys

[G-Snarls]

We're talking strictly about hitting, this is a thread about the hitting coach. His defense isn't germane to the discussion of how good a hitter he is.

 

True

 

I'm just not at all unhappy with his overall performance this year.

[G-Snarls]

You should always strive to put the best team on the field though. Goins' offense and defense have associated run values and the sum of the parts isn't greater than what you'd expect from Travis or other second baseman who bounce around among teams. He's not a starting-calibre player.

 

Also true

 

I want the best overall player and that will likely be Travis

 

Goins has filled in admirably this year AFAIC though, and has hit better than I expected him to. I'm happy.

[G-Snarls]

I don't think anyone argues that Goins > Travis. Travis was on pace for a stellar RoY season.

 

Goins is an excellent bench bat that could also start for an NL team. He's also someone you have no problems having +500 AB.

 

Prob not with what Correa (and Lindor) have done

[Dr. Dinger]

True

 

I'm just not at all unhappy with his overall performance this year.

 

Your satisfaction with his hitting is the quotient of his performance divided by your expecation, but that doesn't mean Brook Jacoby has turned him into a "good" hitter. He's still a below average hitter, just maybe not the complete dogshit hitter we all assumed he was.

[HERPDERP]

Prob not with what Correa (and Lindor) have done

 

both of them came up too late in the season

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&lg=al&qual=y&type=8&season=2015&month=0&season1=2015&ind=2&team=0&rost=&age=&filter=&players=

 

Lindor is 4.6 in 421 AB

Travis 2.3 in 238 AB

 

Of course we could expect some regression but Travis would have put up some pretty amazing numbers at seasons end.

[Dr. Dinger]

both of them came up too late in the season

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&lg=al&qual=y&type=8&season=2015&month=0&season1=2015&ind=2&team=0&rost=&age=&filter=&players=

 

Lindor is 4.6 in 421 AB

Travis 2.3 in 238 AB

 

Of course we could expect some regression but Travis would have put up some pretty amazing numbers at seasons end.

 

I can't imagine how tough it must be for Travis to watch what this team is doing and not be a part of it.

[Sammy225]

I can't imagine how tough it must be for Travis to watch what this team is doing and not be a part of it.

 

No s*** his interview during the party seemed somber last night.... He seemed excited but talking about his ups and downs you could tell he was disappointed

[Spanky99]

Ryan Goins just passed Greinke in career wRC+ yesterday.

 

Hah!

[BigCecil]

Look, all this said, I still want Travis back to be the regular 2B

 

Having Tulo, Travis and Goins is a VERY nice complement of MIF guys

 

^ this. If they can stay healthy 2016 for a good part of the season that is a productive trio.