Deadline looms - What direction should we take .5 gms out of Wild Card

[jays76]

Just because you're the best pitcher on given team, doesn't qualify you as an "ace". People like to use that term for the top 10-15 pitchers in the game (if that). Guys like Kershaw, Felix, Wainwright, are legitimate aces. That's what Atothe is getting at.

 

I get that Atothe is using it in that sense but I was actually using it in the correct term. I was using it in the standardized term which is considered the proper definition in the modern lexicon of baseball, and technically if you are the best pitcher on your team you are considered an ace:

 

"In baseball, an ace is the best starting pitcher on a team and nearly always the first pitcher in the team's starting rotation. Barring injury or exceptional circumstances, an ace typically starts on Opening Day. In addition, aces are usually preferred to start crucial playoff games, sometimes on three days rest."

 

http://www.chatsports.com/colorado-rockies/a/Rockies-Trade-Rumors-Jorge-De-La-Rosa-update-Orioles-out-10-53-136

 

I never said he was an upper echelon elite pitcher in the game but I did say he was a damn good pitcher who was underrated and the ace of Coors field, which obviously he is..

[over500]

Someone wants to trade Hutch + 2 prospects for Jorge f***ing De La f***ing Rosa?

[GD]

Someone wants to trade Hutch + 2 prospects for Jorge f***ing De La f***ing Rosa?

 

Lol he was trolling with Gausman/De La Rosa.

 

I hope.

[jays76]

Someone wants to trade Hutch + 2 prospects for Jorge f***ing De La f***ing Rosa?

 

Lol ok clearly I've taken this too far.

[GD]

Lol ok clearly I've taken this too far.

 

I can't believe you've gone and done this.

[jays76]

I can't believe you've gone and done this.

 

 

All kidding aside I would pull the trigger on JDL for Nolin and 1 or 2 mid tier prospects (say Tom Robson & Matt Smoral or basically any other pitcher ranked after Chase DeJong).

[GD]

All kidding aside I would pull the trigger on JDL for Nolin and 1 or 2 mid tier prospects (say Tom Robson & Matt Smoral or basically any other pitcher ranked after Chase DeJong).

 

I feel like Nolin could contribute roughly as well for cheaper.

[saskjayfan]

Less than right now. You add Lawrie, Lind, EE and get Franklin to Replace Goins, Kawa, Francisco, and Johnson you are getting rid of a lot of #9 hitters there lol.

 

league average ops is .706. Francisco has an .841 OPS....that's a decent number 9 hitter.

[jays76]

I feel like Nolin could contribute roughly as well for cheaper.

 

 

Really, are you putting me on now? I've been over discussing JDL way too much today but I guess I brought this all on myself. Imo he's a proven major leaguer with at least a couple decent seasons left who's performed at a consistent level for a number of years as the staff ace in a hitter friendly ballpark. I was purposely a little over the top with my assessment of him earlier today when having some fun but I do respect his game.

 

Sean Nolin is a mystery for me, yes he's been successful for the FisherCats but will that translate into the majors? He got lit up for 6 runs in 1 inning last year posting a 40.5 ERA in his debut. I would never hold that against him because it was one outing but he reminds me a lot of J Happ (and it's not just because he's 6'4 and a lefty). His FB doesn't have much movement or power which can lead to disastrous results as it does for Happ. Personally I don't think his stuff will translate well to the majors but I could be wrong.. but that is a serious insult to put a guy with JDL's pedigree in the bigs on par with a minor league enigma like Sean Nolin.

[GD]

I would never hold that against him because it was one outing

 

Then why bring it up?

 

He has a 1.87 K-BB and he's 33. Nolin's been consistently good throughout the minors. De La Rosa is probably a bit better but Nolin is cheaper and younger. I don't think it's a significant difference though.

[kcjaysfan]

technically if you are the best pitcher on your team you are considered an ace

 

The problem with using "ace" in this manner is that is then becomes an almost completely meaningless term.

[dineke]

All kidding aside I would pull the trigger on JDL for Nolin and 1 or 2 mid tier prospects (say Tom Robson & Matt Smoral or basically any other pitcher ranked after Chase DeJong).

 

lol yeah sure you were kidding.

[dineke]

Then why bring it up?

 

He has a 1.87 K-BB and he's 33. Nolin's been consistently good throughout the minors. De La Rosa is probably a bit better but Nolin is cheaper and younger. I don't think it's a significant difference though.

 

Because he would trade Hutch + 2 prospects for Jorge De le Rosa. The guy is his fetish.

[jays76]

Then why bring it up?

 

He has a 1.87 K-BB and he's 33. Nolin's been consistently good throughout the minors. De La Rosa is probably a bit better but Nolin is cheaper and younger. I don't think it's a significant difference though.

 

 

Essentially just to highlight the Happ-esque side of his potential when the powerless downhill fastball isn't moving.

 

JDL isn't elite and he's getting up there for sure but I like his consistency and experience at this level. He's been to the playoffs before and doesn't get rattled often as he's seen it all now. I really think there's a lot of intangibles that go along with that and he'd go from the ace of the Rockies who has put up winning records year after year on a losing team to our no.3 starter (possible no.2 if he really flourishes). What is that worth monetarily to this team? Well he's owed 4M for the rest of this season and 10-15M next season (essentially Ervin Santana money) if we choose to re-sign him. What does it mean to our farm? Nolin is rated as our 6th best arm and in my proposal any other arms included would be rated lower than that. I would gauge it as a worthwhile move but I can respect if you and others disagree. Either way I'm sure the Rockies would never bite anyways, they'd probably request a way more prestigious headliner (Sanchez, Asuna, or Norris) which we can all agree would be an overpay.

[jays76]

lol yeah sure you were kidding.

 

Why so serious? I would've figured the guy with pic of a dude holding a gat to a helpless girls face would definitely have a sense of humor.

[GD]

Essentially just to highlight the Happ-esque side of his potential when the powerless downhill fastball isn't moving.

 

JDL isn't elite and he's getting up there for sure but I like his consistency and experience at this level. He's been to the playoffs before and doesn't get rattled often as he's seen it all now. I really think there's a lot of intangibles that go along with that and he'd go from the ace of the Rockies who has put up winning records year after year on a losing team to our no.3 starter (possible no.2 if he really flourishes). What is that worth monetarily to this team? Well he's owed 4M for the rest of this season and 10-15M next season (essentially Ervin Santana money) if we choose to re-sign him. What does it mean to our farm? Nolin is rated as our 6th best arm and in my proposal any other arms included would be rated lower than that. I would gauge it as a worthwhile move but I can respect if you and others disagree. Either way I'm sure the Rockies would never bite anyways, they'd probably request a way more prestigious headliner (Sanchez, Asuna, or Norris) which we can all agree would be an overpay.

 

Intangibbles. W/L. Sentences that don't mean anything. Misspelling an important player's name. Ridiculous trade proposals.

 

Congrats. By trolling this far, you've managed to create an entire Fire Joe Morgan post.

[jays76]

Intangibbles. W/L. Sentences that don't mean anything. Misspelling an important player's name. Ridiculous trade proposals.

 

Congrats. By trolling this far, you've managed to create an entire Fire Joe Morgan post.

 

First of all what is Intangibbles? For a guy looking down on me for misspelling a name that's pretty ironic. Why doesn't it mean anything, why are they ridiculous trade proposals? Because the almighty GD thinks so and heaven forbid I misspelled a name so there goes my argument. I thought this was a place where people could objectively discuss baseball topics and not get self righteous and petty when they don't agree with another person's opinion. I thought you were better than that, guess not..

[GD]

First of all what is Intangibbles? For a guy looking down on me for misspelling a name that's pretty ironic. Why doesn't it mean anything, why are they ridiculous trade proposals? Because the almighty GD thinks so and heaven forbid I misspelled a name so there goes my argument. I thought this was a place where people could objectively discuss baseball topics and not get self righteous and petty when they don't agree with another person's opinion. I thought you were better than that, guess not..

 

Lol, you start off in a thread by trolling, then flip to "I was just trolling," then start bringing up wins and loss record and misspelling a top prospect's name (and not a typo). Like, you can speak objectively all you want, but how can you want to be taken seriously after you outright state that you were trolling before continuing on with the same line of thought?

[dineke]

Why so serious? I would've figured the guy with pic of a dude holding a gat to a helpless girls face would definitely have a sense of humor.

 

Ridiculous trade proposal = humor in your book?

[GD]

He said they'd ask for Sanchez or someone for Jorge f***ing De La Rosa.

 

Let's just lock this thing up.

 

Also, he's violating everything about the term "ace pitcher."

[G-Snarls]

Personally (and I've tweeted this to Wilner), I think we should trade our bad players to another team for some of their good players

[GD]

Personally (and I've tweeted this to Wilner), I think we should trade our bad players to another team for some of their good players

 

http://i.imgur.com/A46JK.gif

 

http://www.picgifs.com/reaction-gifs/reaction-gifs/mind-blown/picgifs-mind-blown-774951.gif

 

http://www.picgifs.com/reaction-gifs/reaction-gifs/mind-blown/picgifs-mind-blown-1995183.gif

[G-Snarls]

Hehe

[RIPEXPOS]

I'd be fine standing pat I think. Once Lawrie, EE, and Lind get healthy, we'll be pretty solid ip and down the lineup. I'm content with Saki at 2nd.

[jays76]

Lol, you start off in a thread by trolling, then flip to "I was just trolling," then start bringing up wins and loss record and misspelling a top prospect's name (and not a typo). Like, you can speak objectively all you want, but how can you want to be taken seriously after you outright state that you were trolling before continuing on with the same line of thought?

 

 

Fair enough and I can see how that looks but halfway through the day I said I was putting the kidding aside and we began having an engaging chat about JDL/Nolin. Sure I spelled Osuna "Asuna" but what is that some unforgivable faux pas on these baseball threads or something? I was serious in our discussions without put ons, I really do feel JDL is not overly expensive nor are we giving up too much by offering our 6th best arm on the farm and a few lower ranked accessories. Yes I know everybody hates the W/L loss factor but the main reason for inclusion was to signify the big league experience in comparison to Nolin, I wasn't using it in the context of being the focal point of his pitching ability.

 

My bad with the Hutch troll, I'm not his biggest fan and throw him into every trade discussion. That obviously blurred the line today so I could see how your now jumping on every little thing regarding thread etiquette (misspelling names, W/L, etc) and thinking I'm on a troll warpath. Fair enough

[GD]

W/L is more than a little thing for me lol

[Stangstag]

He said they'd ask for Sanchez or someone for Jorge f***ing De La Rosa.

 

Let's just lock this thing up.

 

Also, he's violating everything about the term "ace pitcher."

 

Dude, stop being a douche. He was making legit discussion

[GD]

Dude, stop being a douche. He was making legit discussion

 

He admitted he was trolling. This classifies as legitimate discussion?

[jays76]

Ridiculous trade proposal = humor in your book?

 

 

The humor for me was in the reactions people had to suggesting Hutch in that trade. And also how incredulous they were to Jorge De la Rosa which I found really amusing as I sincerely do think he's a good pitcher. Did I overhype him and ham it up a little when people started losing it over Jorge De La Rosa? Sure. Obviously I don't have a fetish for him or think he's the greatest thing since sliced bread but I do respect him and think he'd be a solid addition.

[jays76]

He said they'd ask for Sanchez or someone for Jorge f***ing De La Rosa.

 

Let's just lock this thing up.

 

Also, he's violating everything about the term "ace pitcher."

 

 

They haven't traded him to the O's yet because they want their best prospect so yeah why wouldn't they ask for Sanchez, they'd be stupid not to ask. What some people define as ace pitcher and what the technical term of ace pitcher is defined as are two totally different things.