Jeff Blair - Signs from FO strongly suggest both Melky and Colby gone next year

[GeorgiaPeach]

I wish people had stuck to their account names from the old forum. Edited July 16, 2014 by GeorgiaPeach

[GeorgiaPeach]

And I hold Victor Sanchez in a higher regard than Sanchez & Norris.

[GeorgiaPeach]

You're not a real fan if you don't want Cliff Lee

 

I'll take Lee. But the Phills have to pay his entire contract and ask for something less than Marcus Knecht as a return.

[saskjayfan]

I wish people had stuck to their old account names from the old forum.

 

I wish guys would stick to one account on the new forum!

[GeorgiaPeach]

I wish guys would stick to one account on the new forum!

 

And that.

[BlueJaysGirl]

There are so many things that can be done that are really risky.

 

Trade for some good players and absolutely pillage our farm system.

 

Blow it up and get some really good prospects, MLB-ready prospects, to set up what may (or may not) be a sustained run at success.

 

Or tinker with what we have now and hope for the best.

 

I see benefits to all three models, and all come with risk. Scary risk.

 

But I'd take the tinker option first, then blow it up option second, and I would simply not rape our farm.

 

So, to tinker, I want a guy like Prado or Headley, just to get us through the rest of the season, and for sure fill a little gap until EE, Lind and Lawrie come back in August. If that means trading a couple B prospects, fine. Otherwise, we don't win again in July and by the time were sort of healthy we're 14 games back.

 

To Rasmus and Cabrera, I think AA gives both QO, but we'll know closer to October of course.

 

Rasmus will get white hot at some point. Cabrera has been solid on a team that has s*** for OF prospects on the farm. I hate Pillar, and Gose, well, I'm not convinced. So I think we roll the dice and hope we keep Melky and Rasmus gives us a draft pick.

[KingKat]

 

Not the level of conversation one would expect from a true baseball fan.

 

 

 

It cannot be said enough that you are not the arbitrater of who is and isn't a true fan or even what the appropirate level of discourse for a true fan. Most of what you write is highly defensible, well reasoned baseball argument and the rest is dribble like the above statement where you make sure to set yourself up as some sort of great intelect slumming it with inferior human beings. That you mix eggregious statements like the above with otherwise well-argued points is what makes you comes off like an idiot and a jerk even when you say some otherwise smart things. This is why nobody likes you even when they might otherwise agree with you. Of course, you also seem smart enough to be self aware so you probably know full well that arguing pretty effectively while also being annoying is a pretty effective strategy to get under people skins, certainly more so than merely insulting people or merely being a contrarian.

 

Angles you can use to argue against the consensus, opportunities for a bit of armchair sociology, these seems to be the honey that attracts you. Most people sense that you're essentially a troll but you're a slippery one. You avoid bannable offenses, you argue very well, often much better than those that take up your arguments. You're very good at what is essentially a vain pursuit. This must please you greatly and vindicate the posture of superiority that you like to take anyways which in a sense creates a kind of vicious circle where feeling superior makes it even easier to effectively act superior which makes you feel superior, etc. I doubt I'm telling you anything you don't know and I certainly don't expect you to stop doing something what you seem to enjoy but your rhetorical strategies kind of beg to be analyzed.

[GeorgiaPeach]

He obviously has a bone to pick, because he isn't trashing others for making silly suggestions. Not a big deal, disrupting people's lives and irritating people is fun for me as well.

 

I just hate hide-outs.

[BTS]

It cannot be said enough that you are not the arbitrater of who is and isn't a true fan or even what the appropirate level of discourse for a true fan. Most of what you write is highly defensible, well reasoned baseball argument and the rest is dribble like the above statement where you make sure to set yourself up as some sort of great intelect slumming it with inferior human beings. That you mix eggregious statements like the above with otherwise well-argued points is what makes you comes off like an idiot and a jerk even when you say some otherwise smart things. This is why nobody likes you even when they might otherwise agree with you. Of course, you also seem smart enough to be self aware so you probably know full well that arguing pretty effectively while also being annoying is a pretty effective strategy to get under people skins, certainly more so than merely insulting people or merely being a contrarian.

 

Angles you can use to argue against the consensus, opportunities for a bit of armchair sociology, these seems to be the honey that attracts you. Most people sense that you're essentially a troll but you're a slippery one. You avoid bannable offenses, you argue very well, often much better than those that take up your arguments. You're very good at what is essentially a vain pursuit. This must please you greatly and vindicate the posture of superiority that you like to take anyways which in a sense creates a kind of vicious circle where feeling superior makes it even easier to effectively act superior which makes you feel superior, etc. I doubt I'm telling you anything you don't know and I certainly don't expect you to stop doing something what you seem to enjoy but your rhetorical strategies kind of beg to be analyzed.

 

Why haven't you IL'd him? Smart guy. Absolutely miserable to interact with.

[dineke]

You guys suck. This franchise has already won 2 WS but have they had Cliff Lee pitch for them? NO!

[Hawkins]

First time poster: I agree with Blair. The QO will be about 15 million and AA will not get approval to give either of them 15 million for one season. I think AA doesn't have the freedom to make the moves he wants. He got the fan base excited with his approach to the draft (trading to acquire B level FA to let them walk and get extra picks) and signing international FA. He moved Wells' contract and was looking the best GM ever (should have stayed the course). When the Marlins trade was offered I think AA assumed he would get some veterans and still have the money to continue to shopping for talent. Jays players offering to defer money so they could sign Santana clearly shows that he doesn't have a budget he has to ask for permission. Not knowing if money can be reallocated makes it very hard to build a team. If he knew he could spend $138 million for 2014 then it would have made since to trade Colby (value was high) for prospects and sign Santana and money wouldn't have been an issue. AA is not perfect but Rogers is holding him back.

[KingKat]

Why haven't you IL'd him? Smart guy. Absolutely miserable to interact with.

 

Good question. I guess because his posts are not entirely devoid of value and I don't like to wholesale reject someone when that's the case. Instead I engage with him fairly regularly even though I often end up giving him the kind of reaction he seems to be seeking. I guess I'm like Charlie Brown kicking the football. I always feel like if you're intelectually honest and give credit when you feel credit is due and are honest in your criticism, you'll find some kind of sensible common ground. I was the same way with Lee_Marvin. I think I only ever put one poster on ignore on the old board. I don't remember the poster's name but everything he wrote was deeply offensive and there wasn't even the ghost of a starting point for a discussion so I thought it was best to spare myself reading stuff that only had the potential to upset me (and was probably contributed for that sole purpose).

[KingKat]

I agree with Blair.

 

I think you may have inadvertedly hit the nail on the head. In theory Blair isn't giving an opinion, he's stating fact but I think the reality is that he's projecting the conclusion he's come to on his own as the front office's positon. It is not a fact, it is an opinion. Blair is positioning it as a fact because he knows that even if the Blue Jays front office hasn't come to that conclusion yet, the idea is likely to gain traction and become the front office position anyways unless the players find a way to significantly boost their value between now and the end of the season.

[reedjohnsonfan]

On another note, I find it odd that anyone doesn't want the games to be shortened. You get just as much action. Maybe longer games=more time at the bar away from your wife?

[GeorgiaPeach]

On another note, I find it odd that anyone doesn't want the games to be shortened. You get just as much action. Maybe longer games=more time at the bar away from your wife?

 

I can only remember one time when I wasn't rushed to get home for anything while at a game and thought, when is this gonna be over. April 16th 2008 vs. Texas. The game went 14 innings.

[GeorgiaPeach]

I am mocking GeorgiaPeach, who is constantly preaching about being a true baseball fan, and looking down upon anyone else (with inane reasons, such as, if you want the game to be shorter in duration, you're not a true fan - he's like Jeff Foxworthy "You might not be a true fan," but his punchlines are unintentionally cringe-worthy and humorous) who doesn't have his perceived dedication and view of the game, and stating that they're not even worthy of even engaging in conversation on the subject.

 

Aw, you're cute sticking up for the little guy.

 

I'm giving GeorgiaPeach a taste of his own medicine. It's only illustrative attempts to get him to self-reflect into a more reasonable position.

 

So if someone irritates/pisses me off with something they do or say, I should just let it slide? Sorry that's not me, never has been and never will be.

 

I state my position. And I correct others. I don't feel the need to "+1" or "ditto" anyone, or lend their argument moral support, so basically all of my comments will conflict with, amend or supplement someone else's statement, if directed at them.[

 

Essentially you poke holes in others arguments without putting your own opinions out there.

 

 

Well, there is superiority play at play here, in the instant case. That is correct. But, here, it's about taking down another's sense of superiority, based on subjective judgment, and showing, through illustration of his own actions cast back at him, that "live and let live" is a better way to approach fandom. Who cares who is a better fan? Who cares if you know more or spend more time following the game? Why decide not to speak to these people, just for that reason?

 

I don't keep standings to determine who the better fan is. I just prefer not to have to listen to casual or non baseball fans talk about the game. I don't even care to converse with friends, peers or family about baseball who are casual/non-fans. I'm anti-social and don't care to dredge up Baseball 101 talk with friends or strangers. And when I travel to games I'll talk to the odd seasoned usher about the team, city, park etc....But I'm not sitting there watching the game needing to talk to or high-five surrounding fans to feel like I'm helping someone or a needing to feel that the games one big party. I'd prefer to be left alone.

 

After all, I consider myself a far more dedicated and knowledgeable fan than GeorgiaPeach, yet I will not shun him when conversing about baseball.

 

Dedicated and more knowledgable, very possible. There's things in baseball that don't interest me and I don't care to learn about because it doesn't serve any personnel need or purpose. And there's tons of very knowledgeable fans out there.

[KingKat]

It's about getting the most accurate opinion and way of viewing things that matters. And sometimes that takes criticism. The adults have to learn to take it. The kids should embrace it. The children will ignore (function) it.

 

I can't imagine how you could perceive the above as anything but incredibly condescending.

 

But I'm left to wonder ... why aren't you taking the time to blast the hive? Nox uses this tactic all the time. All. The. Time. BTS, as well. JFaS. Northof49. The whole crew. They mock ERA (and those who dare speak its name), and other more "conventional" means of analysis or ways of looking at the game, by pretending to promote it in a silly, uneducated manner. Yet, we loves us some Nox, right? Take them to task for their various and habitual transgressions, and I will pay your attacks more heed than simply placing them in the "jilted lover" (you never even wanted to spoon!) folder they're currently filed within. Just because they don't attack you or your views or posts, doesn't make their manner of criticism and abuse right.

 

Nox is often a jerk on this board. At times, I could almost believe you're his troll account but there are some things you say that I can't see Nox saying even in jest and I really don't think he would go to the effort of investing so much more into his "troll" account than his "real" one. Of the people you mentioned, whose posts I find the most mean-spirited.

 

I guess Nox's three saving graces are. a. He has a better handle on statistics that most on this board. He's a great person to put an honest question to and get an informed response. If you say to Nox, I don't understand a can you explain it to me? He will do so without condescension. I value that greatly. b. He generally picks targets that don't attract a lot of sympathy to begin with. Sometimes I think he's being unduly harsch but it will later become obvious that the person was just putting us on anyways. He seems to have a nose for disingenuous posters. Certainly more than I do. I almost always take people at face value initially and sometimes waste a lot of time that way. Nox will also pick on the merely naive which is less defensible. He does it to make a point but he can make his points in pretty insulting ways. b. As mentioned before, he's a lot less ubiquitous on the board than you are so that alone makes him a less obvious target for criticism. He's also less long winded and verbose and more direct in his insults. There's a way you have of putting people down that is just incredibly pretentious (see above quote). When Gibbers (or Boxy to use anoother example), insults someone, it's usually in a quite crude fashion and for whatever reason that bothers me less than what you post. In any case, I wasn't looking to take up Gibber's argument. I just used that as a pretext to talk about you. If Gibbers wants to continue arguing with you, he can do so without my help. I know he's not looking to be defended by me or by anyone else.

[o2cui2i]

Ok... You're all the prettiest girls at the ball, now get back to baseball. WAY TOO MANY personal attacks and petty comments in this thread.

 

Just sayin peeps.

[GD]

I actually thought that that was a pretty mature discussion for that kind of topic. Could have been a lot less mature.

[TheHurl]

Moogy is the judge of true baseball fandom, GD is the judge of maturity and Nox is an *******...well at least one thing is right with the board.

[GD]

Sounds about right.

[G-Snarls]

Ok... You're all the prettiest girls at the ball, now get back to baseball. WAY TOO MANY personal attacks and petty comments in this thread.

 

Just sayin peeps.

 

We need some baseball games to happen, vän. Real ones.

[reedjohnsonfan]

I can only remember one time when I wasn't rushed to get home for anything while at a game and thought, when is this gonna be over. April 16th 2008 vs. Texas. The game went 14 innings.

 

Being at the game, I can give you that. I meant on TV, with the new challenge system the games take way too long IMO. Too many commercials as well.

[DH12]

Thank Goodness Rasmus won't be back. Would like to keep Cabrera

[o2cui2i]

We need some baseball games to happen, vän. Real ones.

 

So, you're the one that judges which games are "real " and which are not? lol

 

Sorry... Had to do it

 

I agree. Need a few wins to get things turned for the team and this forum

[G-Snarls]

So, you're the one that judges which games are "real " and which are not? lol

 

Sorry... Had to do it

 

I agree. Need a few wins to get things turned for the team and this forum

 

LOL.

 

Yeah. And I thought games started up again tonight but no... another s***** day of no games. Not even fake exhibition ones!

[G-Snarls]

Enough Moogy. Warned. Also closing the thread. Has outlived it's usefulness.