Davidi: Payroll will be at least $140 M next year

[kgm1]

It's funny how many people were so adamant that there is no more money, or that we would only barely increase payroll. That roughly $25M per team in added revenue alone should have been a reasonable indication as well as the fact that when AA made those deals last winter they knew what they were getting with some of those contracts.

 

I think were closer to $150M by the time spring training hits.

 

I certainly didn't think there would be that much more money Chappy . At least they are talking about the defense , It has been ugly up the middle

[BarrysSyringe]

Why are people comfortable with having a career back up catcher starting for us? Sure he is great defensively but he is an offensive liability and so is Ryan. Thats basically giving aways at least 6 outs a game. I would love to see a trade which would see the Cardinals acquire Bautista, Edwin for Taveras and Wong. We get better up the middle and much younger while unloading money that can be used to upgrade our pitching staff

[Terminator]

Why are people comfortable with having a career back up catcher starting for us? Sure he is great defensively but he is an offensive liability and so is Ryan. Thats basically giving aways at least 6 outs a game. I would love to see a trade which would see the Cardinals acquire Bautista, Edwin for Taveras and Wong. We get better up the middle and much younger while unloading money that can be used to upgrade our pitching staff

 

I kind of get Molina. With his pitch framing you can live with his .280 wOBA. But with Ryan you are looking at a .230-.260 wOBA and that's just not going to cut it. He's more suited to be a backup.

[BarrysSyringe]

I kind of get Molina. With his pitch framing you can live with his .280 wOBA. But with Ryan you are looking at a .230-.260 wOBA and that's just not going to cut it. He's more suited to be a backup.

Say the trade i suggested were to happen, that would free you up lots of money to go and sign McCann for say 13 million per for 4 years. You still have 14 million to go and spend on pitchers and what not. Id target Halladay and Garza or Kuroda. Yes that would cost more, but our payroll is gonna have to be a bit larger than 140 million for us to have a chance to compete.

[Arkadium]

I kind of get Molina. With his pitch framing you can live with his .280 wOBA. But with Ryan you are looking at a .230-.260 wOBA and that's just not going to cut it. He's more suited to be a backup.

 

He doesn't just pitch frame well. I would argue he does all catching duties well: game calling, throwing out runners, receiving, and pitch framing. I imagine he even has those intangible qualities too like good chemistry with the pitchers.

Edited August 6, 2013 by Arkadium

[BarrysSyringe]

It isn't going to happen man, AA's all in, this team isn't getting younger anytime soon. Who's to say it isn't going to be larger than140??? I was laughed off the board when I said our payroll was going to be 115. No one knows but the FO and Rogers.

I am playing armchair GM, this is just what i would do. Its sad that the GM wouldnt do whats bestfor the team

[Angrioter]

I don't understand the Ryan idea at all because we already have a shortstop.

 

I'll try to come up with a plan of my own in the next few days.

 

-Ryan designated defender, he suck.

-Gattis isn't catcher.

-Taveras/Wong in, Bautista/Edwin out is an awful idea.

-AJ Jimenez can't hit, he will not be the next yadier.

[Terminator]

He doesn't just pitch frame well. I would argue he does all catching duties well: game calling, throwing out runners, receiving, and pitch framing. I imagine he even has those intangible qualities too like good chemistry with the pitchers.

 

I can't speak to his game calling or chemistry with pitchers. Only those closer to the game can.

 

I don't think he's great at blocking pitches though. Like his older brother, he's fat and rather than moving his body he stabs at balls in the dirt with his glove. I could totally be wrong about that but it's what I remember from his days in TO. He does have a good arm though.

[Angrioter]

Yup. I'd be fine with trading Bautista but definitely not both he and Edwin. Plus Wong isn't going to be an impact player. Our offense would seriously suck next year since you'd have Reyes as the only proven good hitter.

 

Bautista out, Taveras+Wong or Jurickson "Alomar" Profar in is a christmas gift.

[Arkadium]

I can't speak to his game calling or chemistry with pitchers. Only those closer to the game can.

 

I don't think he's great at blocking pitches though. Like his older brother, he's fat and rather than moving his body he stabs at balls in the dirt with his glove. I could totally be wrong about that but it's what I remember from his days in TO. He does have a good arm though.

 

I know I'm speaking from my arse a bit but I just get the impression from his mannerisms behind the plate (i.e. how he encourages the pitcher) that he has a good camaraderie with his counter-part.

[KingKat]

I kind of get Molina. With his pitch framing you can live with his .280 wOBA. But with Ryan you are looking at a .230-.260 wOBA and that's just not going to cut it. He's more suited to be a backup.

 

I think the only way the Jays can hope to recoup the investment in prospects and salary that they made to improve the rotation is to sign a guy like Molina who can get some calls for them. I don't think there's any way to turn around this team withouth acquiring a good pitch framer. A guy who can both frame pitches and hit would be awesome but even a guy like Molina who can't hit much at all would be a godsend.

 

Unfortunately, I have zero faith that AA will bring in someone like that unless he values that player for another reason. If AA truly understood the importance of the catcher's position, he would have tried to protect his investment in pitching this offseason by making a run at Russell Martin.

[KingKat]

The Jays had four positions this year where they were near the worst in baseball offensively and defensively.

 

Catcher

Second baseman

Left Field

Third baseman

 

Hopefully third base takes care of itself with Brett Lawrie putting together something closer to a fully productive season (and yes I realize that there's a lot of optimism in that sentence but it doesn't make sense to pursue another option when the incumbent, at least potentially, has a lot of value). As for the other positions, If all the Jays did was to put no hit all glove players there would still get way more value than the no hit or glove production they got this year. That's the easiest way for this team to improve cheaply even if it unlike this year's moves, it's not something very sexy to sell to the fanbase.

 

Once again, I put zero faith in AA's ability to recognize value. I think he'll just put together a different but similar cast of lousy fielding veterans (heck, it might even be exact same cast).

[Captain Adama]

Well, if you're playing armchair GM you're losing. EE and Joey Bats on those contracts and you're only coming away with Taveras and Wong?!

 

Agreed, those guys are centrepieces to a deal involving either Bautista or EE, but not standalones.

[BarrysSyringe]

I'd be more on GP's and Barry'syringe plan, but that ship has sailed.

Not just them, definitely more. I wonder if we could pry miller away from them

[BarrysSyringe]

I would definitely do Bautista and Edwin for Taveras, Wong and Miller

[BarrysSyringe]

Yeah if Miller was in there sure. But the Cards don't have much use for Bautista and Edwin. Where would Adams and Craig play? All they need is a shortstop.

 

Forgot about Craig. They Definitely could have interest in Bautista if Beltran walks in free agency. Bautista for Taveras and Wong?

[BarrysSyringe]

I would do that anyday of the week and twice on Sunday but don't get your hopes up because the Chances of that happening are little to 0

Obviously the chances of that are slim to none. I couldn't even see AA doing that because he is so ignorant to the fact that Bautista will never put up the numbers he did in 2011 and will just decline

[Angrioter]

Yeah if Miller was in there sure. But the Cards don't have much use for Bautista and Edwin. Where would Adams and Craig play? All they need is a shortstop.

 

Forgot about Craig. They Definitely could have interest in Bautista if Beltran walks in free agency. Bautista for Taveras and Wong?

 

I would do that anyday of the week and twice on Sunday but don't get your hopes up because the Chances of that happening are little to 0

 

Criag isn't the big deal. Our little Guru FatCow traded Craig for Yunel Escobar.

 

Craig for Yunel and Cain for Melky?

[DuckDuckGose]

The Jays had four positions this year where they were near the worst in baseball offensively and defensively.

 

Catcher

Second baseman

Left Field

Third baseman

 

 

Current dream off-season;

 

1. Sign McCann

2. Trade Bautista for Wong + Miller

3. Sign Choo

4. Re-sign JJ a one year deal ~$8M-10M

[Angrioter]

roflmao!!!

 

FatCow is a true admirer of the work of AA, Amaro and Ned Colletti.

#f***ingDreamJob

[Angrioter]

Fatcow also got Pedro Alvarez for Craig, who is the NL leader in homers, so you can make a case that Fatcow won that deal.

 

Cain for Melky remains inexplicable though.

 

Brother,'re ruining my joke.

The point is/was that Craig is a Hijo-de-puta who can hit blindfolded.

[BarrysSyringe]

Current dream off-season;

 

1. Sign McCann

2. Trade Bautista for Wong + Miller

3. Sign Choo

4. Re-sign JJ a one year deal ~$8M-10M

Another offseason plan i would be up for:

 

Trade Melky, Arencibia, Dickey, Lind and Boni for what you can get

Trade Bautista for Wong and Taveras

Sign Halladay, Kuroda/Garza, Mclouth, McCann/Ruiz and Hart

 

That leaves you with:

C:McCann

1B:Encarnacion

2B:Wong

3B:Lawrie

SS:Reyes

LF:Mclouth

CF:Rasmus

RF:Taveras

DH:Hart

 

BN:Pillar

BN:Kawasaki

BN:Izturis

BN:Thole

 

SP:Morrow

SP:Kuroda

SP:Halladay

SP:Buehrle

SP:Hutchison

 

Same Bullpen

[Angrioter]

Another offseason plan i would be up for:

 

Trade Melky, Arencibia, Dickey, Lind and Boni for what you can get

Trade Bautista for Wong and Taveras

Sign Halladay, Kuroda/Garza, Mclouth, McCann/Ruiz and Hart

 

That leaves you with:

C:McCann

1B:Encarnacion

2B:Wong

3B:Lawrie

SS:Reyes

LF:Mclouth

CF:Rasmus

RF:Taveras

DH:Hart

 

BN:Pillar

BN:Kawasaki

BN:Izturis

BN:Thole

 

SP:Morrow

SP:Kuroda

SP:Halladay

SP:Buehrle

SP:Hutchison

 

Same Bullpen

 

MG's or magicians?

[DuckDuckGose]

Another offseason plan i would be up for:

 

Trade Melky, Arencibia, Dickey, Lind and Boni for what you can get

Trade Bautista for Wong and Taveras

Sign Halladay, Kuroda/Garza, Mclouth, McCann/Ruiz and Hart

 

That leaves you with:

C:McCann

1B:Encarnacion

2B:Wong

3B:Lawrie

SS:Reyes

LF:Mclouth

CF:Rasmus

RF:Taveras

DH:Hart

 

BN:Pillar

BN:Kawasaki

BN:Izturis

BN:Thole

 

SP:Morrow

SP:Kuroda

SP:Halladay

SP:Buehrle

SP:Hutchison

 

Same Bullpen

 

I'd rather AA keep Dickey. $12M for a reliable pitcher, even a back-end guy, isn't terrible. Those innings would be hard to replace and I have no confidence in Morrow's, Halladay's or Garza's ability to stay healthy in 2014.

 

DFA or trade JPA don't care which as C depth is always good to have.

 

Trade Melky if there is a decent trade to be made, only give him away if you need the payroll. If you keep him and Gose/Pillar continue to perform well ship him out, hopefully with a little more value.

 

Lind is great in this platoon role. I'd move him in a package for something bigger but, isn't a salary dump candidate IMO.

 

Boni move him for whatever you can get. If he is around in 2014 it has to be as a super utility player and pinch runner. He should not be starting very many MLB games, even if injuries hit.

[Angrioter]

Another offseason plan i would be up for:

 

Trade Melky, Arencibia, Dickey, Lind and Boni for what you can get

Trade Bautista for Wong and Taveras

Sign Halladay, Kuroda/Garza, Mclouth, McCann/Ruiz and Hart

 

Bwahahahaha............my sides are killing me amigo!!

 

This isn't MLB the Show, is real baseball. The real value of Melky, Arencibia and Boni is negative (Lind - Very low value), you could only save a few dollars trading Melky.

With one of the worst minor league systems of the industry, This team only can be improved, spending it money in free agency.

[BarrysSyringe]

This isn't MLB the Show, is real baseball. The real value of Melky, Arencibia and Boni is negative (Lind - Very low value), you could only save a few dollars trading Melky.

With one of the worst minor league systems of the industry, This team only can be improved, spending it money in free agency.

I think you misunderstood what i was trying to say. I would never expect for all that to happen i would just love to see that happen. If we could unload melkys and linds salaries, we could have alot more flexibility going forward into free agency.

[BarrysSyringe]

I'd rather AA keep Dickey. $12M for a reliable pitcher, even a back-end guy, isn't terrible. Those innings would be hard to replace and I have no confidence in Morrow's, Halladay's or Garza's ability to stay healthy in 2014.

 

DFA or trade JPA don't care which as C depth is always good to have.

 

Trade Melky if there is a decent trade to be made, only give him away if you need the payroll. If you keep him and Gose/Pillar continue to perform well ship him out, hopefully with a little more value.

 

Lind is great in this platoon role. I'd move him in a package for something bigger but, isn't a salary dump candidate IMO.

 

Boni move him for whatever you can get. If he is around in 2014 it has to be as a super utility player and pinch runner. He should not be starting very many MLB games, even if injuries hit.

Dickey has not been a reliable pitcher, he has been very inconsistent. If that 12 million could be freed up, it would be huge

[DuckDuckGose]

Dickey has not been a reliable pitcher, he has been very inconsistent. If that 12 million could be freed up, it would be huge

 

Averaged 190IP over the last 4 seasons and this one isn't done yet. He's been up and down this season but he's been better as of late. Still has performed as a decent back-end option. What is the $12M going to get you that is a better option than RA Dickey? JJ?

[DuckDuckGose]

Trade Bautista for Taveras and Rosenthal...........Trade EE for Profar and Holland.....Sign Choo and McCaan.......this is fun in fantasy land.

 

I'm confused. I thought this was fun because we were playing Fantasy Land. Kind of the whole point Spanky..

[BarrysSyringe]

I'm confused. I thought this was fun because we were playing Fantasy Land. Kind of the whole point Spanky..

Haha thank you