Brownie19

I don't really disagree, but his legacy was built on consistency, longevity, leadership and winning - and I'm OK with that. He had a flair for the dramatic and performed when the bright lights were on. He was really good at everything, but never THE BEST at anything. My 11 year old son was asking me last night if I thought Bo or Vlad, or both would be 'lifetime Jays' and I told him I thought there was a good chance both could - but for different reasons. I told him we might have the honor of watching Vlad become one of the best hitters of all time, while Bo is a different type of player. He's not going to be the best hitter in the league, or the best shortstop or the best defender or the best base stealer - but he's going to do all those things very well and there's a possibility he chases 3,000 hits. When you factor in his marketability and swag - he might end up being our version of Derek Jeter. He may not end up with 5 rings, but I'm hopeful for a few. Bo strikes me as someone who's going to give the Jays franchise some very memorable moments over this career. I think 15 years from now, we'll each have a couple moments etched in our brains forever (like the Jose HR) and I think Bo will provide at least 1 of them. I think he has a similar flair for the dramatics that Jeter did.

On a minor league deal with an invite to camp? Sure.

Sorry - I'm just responding to the notion that there was no way the club would even consider giving Matz a QO and that it was a complete no brainer. I suspect the evaluation was closer than some believe. I also don't think Thor's deal is any indication. I'll let it go.

I highly doubt the evaluation of whether to offer Matz a QO or not was as basic as you suggest and the Thor signing really doesn't impact that. I suspect there was a very real discussion and evaluation on whether or not to offer Matz a QO. Matz is VERY likely to get a multi year deal in this market. We all expected Thor would get a 1 year pillow deal to rebuild value and we all know that Thor has way more upside than Matz (and it's Thor @ $21M + 2nd rounder in your comparison). If Matz signs for 3 year $50M, or 4 years $60M or something like that, then there's probably an argument we should have offered him a QO so get the 2nd round compensation. If that's the market for him, then I don't think it's a guarantee he would have accepted the QO. If guys like DeSclafani, Gray and Wood start signing 1 year $10M or 2 year $20M deals, then sure, offering Matz a QO would have been a bad idea - if they sign 1 year $16M or 2 years $30M, then a QO for Matz was probably perfectly fine (as there's value in securing someone and not missing out) but it's yet to be seen how this will all play out. I trust this FO has done their due diligence and determined the market won't be hot enough this year to justify the risk/reward of a QO to Matz. That's good news for the Jays who look to be big players as they push to become elite. Now I'm almost certain that when Matz signs, you'll come back and say "see - I told you guys the QO for Matz was stupid - why would anyone suggest it was worth evaluating" - which just means the FO read the market correctly and made the right choice. It doesn't mean the evaluation wasn't worthwhile and necessary. I'd say there's probably a 25% chance the FO is wrong (if I were to guess).

Plus if he left for a multi-year deal, you get some compensation. This isn't a black or white situation, I'm sure there was a lot to evaluate before the Jays chose not to qualify him.

This is a HUGE piece of our offseason. This deal had to get done and they've done it nice and early in the offseason. Well done.

He was the 18th most valuable pitcher in baseball last year and has been the 13th most valuable pitcher in baseball since 2018. Please do not refer to him as a #3 pitcher.

Good news is Dillon is perfectly capable of carrying the load while he's out. Lots of questions about that draft pick, but the big horse is proving his worth (if only they didn't throw away their 1st and 3rd round picks that year - dumb asses).

I love that idea (although it probably means we're going into the year with Biggio/Espy at 3rd again). I think it's 'likely' the Martes out WAR the Seagers in 2022.

I don't know. Matz has averaged 2.2 WAR/year over the past 2 full seasons (I'll leave out 2020), while E-Rod has averaged 3.75 WAR/year. E-Rod is significantly better and 2 years younger. Based on this signing, I'd suggest Matz is more of a 2 year $20M guy - someone might dangle a 3rd year OR $12M AAV to get the deal done.

I would think (hope?) the Cain contract is a cautionary tail of giving out too many years and $$$'s to a good, but not great hitter who lacks power and relies on speed a lot. Cain gave the Brewers one solid season before he fell off a cliff. Someone might give him 4 years, but I think TL is right that Marte might be someone who falls under the radar a bit.

I think it depends on length and AAV (which, as I type it, is stupid to say because it always does). Heading into his Age 33 year, I think this Steamer projection is in line with what you would expect. 18 HR 85 R 73 RBI 32 SB 6.6% BB 18.5% K .276 AVG .339 OBP .437 SLG 110 wRC+ 2.9 BsR 11.0 OFF -1.2 DEF 3.1 WAR With that production, he'd be a great fit and would allow us to move Gurriel if we wanted. What do you think he'll get for a contract? 3 years $50M?

I would guess you're overstating the FA and trade market...teams rarely give up their top prospects anymore. It's not 2009

Those are some large assumptions. Apparently E-Rod is nearing a deal with the Tigers.

OBJ to the Rams and now it looks like Aaron Jones is hurt. Awesome.

This - his K% was dropping year after year until the labrum injury. Should teams be concerned about that injury?

I think we can safety answer that ourselves. Suggesting the SPer only gets 1 warm up at the start of an inning is really dumb.

sans Spider Tack and coming off TJ, I think fans need to temper there expectations of what Verlander can add. I mean the guys a f***ing legend and HOFer, but father time is undefeated.

Agents for some of the highest-profile free agents this winter, in the meantime, inverted the posture: If you want a player, step up financially, because the February stampede is going to be so different, so unfamiliar, that it's worth paying more for certainty now than having to overpay or be left empty-handed on the eve of the season. What a shocking position for the agents to take.

I don't disagree at all, but I suspect the concern is that Moreno and Kirk won't develop defensively if they are only catching once or twice a week. Is that still a thing? or is this an old school view?

This is 100% spot on. I'm not sure how anyone with any logical comes up with any other conclusion.

He's like a poor man's David Price...can't really spin the ball.

No - just rumoured.

Odell to the Packers??

You realize Biggio was a bat to ball, spray hitter early in his minor league career. He was s*** with this approach and change his bat path to hit more flyballs and hit for more power. I'm not saying he can't have success if he changes his approach back, but the odds are probably against him. The reality is he should probably use his great eye to simply lay off high fastballs and add a bit more bulk to improve his EV. I'm not sure Bellinger's struggles are necessarily related to his swing path....high fastballs were a thing in 2019 too eh? The league didn't just catch up to the guy (I could be wrong, but that seems stupid). Also - you don't roll the wrists more to hit line drives.