GDT: Chicago Cubs vs. Toronto Blue Jays (2/3)

[EdwinsParrot]

Nice, finally hit one in the air lol:cool:

[Omar]

Vladdy the baddy!

[Omar]

Great hustle Bo!....even if you're out, good to see.

[Solaxys]

Vlad at 99 career HRs

[Jimcanuck]

The Silver Fox

[jaysguy44]

Really not comfortable with Richards in this spot.

[Omar]

The bottom just drops out of that circle-change from Richards. Great pitch.

[Kordesi]

Just love this dude! So much confidence!

[Kordesi]

Finish it off Rambo!

[Spanky99]

Yeah... LETS f***IN GO JAYS GO!!!

[Kordesi]

Great win! Congrats guys!

[EdwinsParrot]

GG boys

[Omar]

Another win for the good guys!

 

[Ehjays]

Anybody gonna be blowing their load in the 500 section tonight I wonder.

 

You called it!!!

 

[Stangstag]

Why is Franmil Reyes wearing eyeblack during a night game as the dh?

 

For the aesthetic

[jaysblue]

Guess what Kordesi?

 

We are allowed to have different opinions on

players/humans. I strongly dislike Stroman, that doesn't mean you have to as well.

 

I dislike Stroman as a person as well. He comes off as a huge beta and whines about everything.

 

Though I do appreciate and recognize his role with the Jays in 2015 and 2016. He pitched in some big games at a young age: came back in 2015 from a torn ACL to pitch down the stretch and pitched in the 2016 Wildcard game against Baltimore. He had a solid tenure during his time with the Blue Jays, so if I ever saw him pitch again at the Rogers Centre, I would give him a standing applause at the beginning of the game. Seems like he's great with young fans as well, signing autographs and chatting with some fans in the stands before the game. Definitely give him props for that.

[jaysblue]

Another win for the good guys!

 

 

Picked up a win during my first GDT of the season and on my birthday. Can't complain haha!

[jaysblue]

Stroman has been pretty meh this year

 

$25M this season and next. Cubs gave him some huge money over 3 years - can total $71 million. I was going to say, he would be a nice fit on this Jays team as a No. 3/4 starter, though not at $25M haha.

[Laika]

Maybe there is some type of salary dump/swap trade that would work

 

like if they think they can fix Berrios lol

[Stangstag]

$25M this season and next. Cubs gave him some huge money over 3 years - can total $71 million. I was going to say, he would be a nice fit on this Jays team as a No. 3/4 starter, though not at $25M haha.

 

The Berrios contract blows his out of the water in terms of value… as long as Berrios returns to career norms.

Starting pitching is expensive unless you develop internally

[glory]

Maybe there is some type of salary dump/swap trade that would work

 

like if they think they can fix Berrios lol

 

Kikuchi for Stroman is the only one I can think of based on the roster. Berrios may end up being a bad contract, but track record suggests we should expect better things. I like Stro's chances of being a league average innings eater more than Kikuchi turning into whatever the hell it is that compelled Atkins to give him 3 guaranteed years. Just a matter of how much payroll you'd be comfortable adding as the difference between 2 years of Kooch and 2 years of Stroman is going to be anywhere from $26-28m over those 2 years.

[G-Snarls]

The Berrios contract blows his out of the water in terms of value… as long as Berrios returns to career norms.

Starting pitching is expensive unless you develop internally

 

Thank you Alek Manoah

[Laika]

Kikuchi for Stroman is the only one I can think of based on the roster. Berrios may end up being a bad contract, but track record suggests we should expect better things. I like Stro's chances of being a league average innings eater more than Kikuchi turning into whatever the hell it is that compelled Atkins to give him 3 guaranteed years. Just a matter of how much payroll you'd be comfortable adding as the difference between 2 years of Kooch and 2 years of Stroman is going to be anywhere from $26-28m over those 2 years.

 

but why would the Cubs even want Kikuchi

 

Stroman for Berrios has appeal to both teams (well, probably not but you could squint and see it) if you assume the Cubs think Berrios is fine and want to control him that long

 

Cubs get a younger pitcher to lead them through a rebuild. And he has been better historically.

 

Jays get someone who was better in 2022 and has less total financial commitment so their SP payroll long term is less bloated. Maybe they get better in 2023 slightly and limit the downside on a potential albatross contract?

[glory]

but why would the Cubs even want Kikuchi

 

Stroman for Berrios has appeal to both teams (well, probably not but you could squint and see it) if you assume the Cubs think Berrios is fine and want to control him that long

 

Cubs get a younger pitcher to lead them through a rebuild. And he has been better historically.

 

Jays get someone who was better in 2022 and has less total financial commitment so their SP payroll long term is less bloated. Maybe they get better in 2023 slightly and limit the downside on a potential albatross contract?

 

I'm not saying the Cubs would do it, just that it's the only realistic contract swap I could see the Jays doing. Unless they soured on Berrios and don't want him for 6 more years, in which case it would make sense to lessen the contract length and get a similar SP, but I think the Jays (at least the current FO) are still high on Berrios. If Atkins is fired and someone else comes in, then maybe that changes things.

[Laika]

I'm not saying the Cubs would do it, just that it's the only realistic contract swap I could see the Jays doing. Unless they soured on Berrios and don't want him for 6 more years, in which case it would make sense to lessen the contract length and get a similar SP, but I think the Jays (at least the current FO) are still high on Berrios. If Atkins is fired and someone else comes in, then maybe that changes things.

 

I think if they could give Berrios away to wiggle out of the contract they would absolutely do it.

 

When you sign a 3-4 WAR pitcher and he is replacement level in year 1 of a seven year contract you start to s*** bricks.

[Brownie19]

but why would the Cubs even want Kikuchi

 

Stroman for Berrios has appeal to both teams (well, probably not but you could squint and see it) if you assume the Cubs think Berrios is fine and want to control him that long

 

Cubs get a younger pitcher to lead them through a rebuild. And he has been better historically.

 

Jays get someone who was better in 2022 and has less total financial commitment so their SP payroll long term is less bloated. Maybe they get better in 2023 slightly and limit the downside on a potential albatross contract?

 

They obviously wouldn't. We'd have to include a legit prospect in the deal.

[Spanky99]

They obviously wouldn't. We'd have to include a legit prospect in the deal.

 

And you certainly won't be getting Stroman back.

[Brownie19]

And you certainly won't be getting Stroman back.

 

I think you could. The Cubs aren't ready to win, Stroman hasn't been great or worth the deal. If they could free up some more money and land a quality prospect - I think they'd certainly consider that. Assuming the FO believes Kikuchi is 100% sunk cost, would this team want to give up a solid prospect and pay Stroman $12M/year? Maybe if the price for Stripling is too high - that's not a bad short term option. Stro as an opt-out after '23 or you have him until the end of the 2024 season.

 

Really depends who that prospect is. Would it take Orelvis?

[Spanky99]

I think you could. The Cubs aren't ready to win, Stroman hasn't been great or worth the deal. If they could free up some more money and land a quality prospect - I think they'd certainly consider that. Assuming the FO believes Kikuchi is 100% sunk cost, would this team want to give up a solid prospect and pay Stroman $12M/year? Maybe if the price for Stripling is too high - that's not a bad short term option. Stro as an opt-out after '23 or you have him until the end of the 2024 season.

 

Really depends who that prospect is. Would it take Orelvis?

 

Yes, maybe plus. I'd imagine.

[Laika]

I think you could. The Cubs aren't ready to win, Stroman hasn't been great or worth the deal. If they could free up some more money and land a quality prospect - I think they'd certainly consider that. Assuming the FO believes Kikuchi is 100% sunk cost, would this team want to give up a solid prospect and pay Stroman $12M/year? Maybe if the price for Stripling is too high - that's not a bad short term option. Stro as an opt-out after '23 or you have him until the end of the 2024 season.

 

Really depends who that prospect is. Would it take Orelvis?

 

Yeah it all depends on internal projections.

Kikuchi as a replacement level projection is worth negative 20M

Stroman is owed $50M so I guess even if you project him to be worth $30M over two years (3-4 WAR total), him and Kooch are a wash; equal value.

 

Actually looking at the salaries now I just can't see it happening.

 

I forgot Kikuchi was front loaded.

 

I guess you can still argue for it though if you:

 

- assume Kikuchi is dead and replacement level or worse

- think adding $15M AAV in payroll is worth going from Kikuchi to Stroman

 

But nah never happening haha.

 

I think if the Jays are spending an extra $15M they are targeting a one year free agent or maybe an RP + SP5 in free agency.

Edited August 31, 2022 by Laika