Rumour: More Cheating?

[TheHurl]

Without any hard data, I'm pretty sure that there is a high correlation between players who perform well using nerd stats (as well as counting stats) and them being enjoyable to watch.

 

Which brings us full circle to a recent Trevor Bauer quote. One of the biggest issues in baseball are the announcers.

[FrozenRopes]

I struggle with this, too.

 

This is true of many intelligent baseball fans. Nothing wrong with it. Just an adaptation to things.

 

I coach my kids baseball to get the 'love of the game' with no WAR etc (even though it is there)

[dineke]

That's a great point, supposedly the average NFL game has only 11 minutes of actual action in it. A quick look on google says an MLB game has about 18 minutes of action. Why MLB gets so much grief for slow pace of play buy NFL gets none of this grief just doesn't make sense.

 

Because there's like a million different things happening within each play and every play has a high level of importance. It's like chess with live human beings.

[Bobthe4th]

That's a great point, supposedly the average NFL game has only 11 minutes of actual action in it. A quick look on google says an MLB game has about 18 minutes of action. Why MLB gets so much grief for slow pace of play buy NFL gets none of this grief just doesn't make sense.

 

Because the NFL is widely popular in the US - if it didn't dominate sports coverage it'd get more criticism. NFL is boring as s***, but it gets hyped up, has a short season, and is very patriotic.

[Brownie19]

Which brings us full circle to a recent Trevor Bauer quote. One of the biggest issues in baseball are the announcers.

 

We've had discussions about that on here and lots claim they want their announcers to tell mildly entertaining stories, tell you what they 'think' players are actually talking about on the bench, how country strong a player is and how nice the weather is. They don't want them cluttering the broadcast with a more modern take on how the game is played and the stats to support it.

 

I'm with Bauer on this.

[Brownie19]

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/how-much-did-the-red-sox-benefit-from-their-sign-stealing-scheme/

 

There's an article summarizing the sign stealing system that the Red Sox "apparently" used in 2018. Sounds like they used the video room to identify the catchers signals in game and then with runners on 2nd, the runners would us that information to signal the hitters. Based on the stats, this seemed to give them an advantage.

 

Just to be clear - if a team evaluates video tape prior to the game to figure out what signals the catcher is using - and they use those in the game to steal signs from 2nd...that's OK. But, if they look at video during the game to either confirm they are indeed using the signals they saw on video prior to the game - or to figure out a new sequence of signals and the runners on 2nd relays that to the hitter...that's not OK.

 

 

 

Isn't the obvious fix for all of this for catchers to mix up their signs a lot more frequently?

[tombsy]

The solution would be to allow the catcher to send an electronic signal to the pitcher.

[TheHurl]

We've had discussions about that on here and lots claim they want their announcers to tell mildly entertaining stories, tell you what they 'think' players are actually talking about on the bench, how country strong a player is and how nice the weather is. They don't want them cluttering the broadcast with a more modern take on how the game is played and the stats to support it.

 

I'm with Bauer on this.

 

They also don't want anything changed. That is the biggest issue. Negativity from announcers is what has to go. The "this is the way it was in my day", and "all this shifting stuff is ruining the game".

 

Basketball is changing huge. The announcers are changing with the game, they leave the past to the guys on the internet to tell why Lebron would have never made it in 1988.

[Dick_Pole]

What's funny about this is:

 

Working out and taking substances that aren't banned = okay

Video replay outside the confines of the game = okay

Using video during games = kill 'em all

 

They need to have a baseball game played exactly the way it was played in the 1800's. The makeshift gloves, the underhand pitching, the 5 ball 4 strikes, the calling random dudes off the streets to play OF when your regular guy has too much of a hangover. Maybe they should make one all-star game like that, just for fun. Then people will understand how much this game changes with time.

 

In summary, I agree with tombsy's idea.

[Jimcanuck]

Encryted signals between catcher and pitcher does make sense.

[Brownie19]

They also don't want anything changed. That is the biggest issue. Negativity from announcers is what has to go. The "this is the way it was in my day", and "all this shifting stuff is ruining the game".

 

Basketball is changing huge. The announcers are changing with the game, they leave the past to the guys on the internet to tell why Lebron would have never made it in 1988.

 

Agreed. Fire Buck and start the trend!

[Beans]

Agreed. Fire Buck and start the trend!

Would have been funny if you phrased it as 'Buck the trend!'

[Grant77]

They also don't want anything changed. That is the biggest issue. Negativity from announcers is what has to go. The "this is the way it was in my day", and "all this shifting stuff is ruining the game".

 

Basketball is changing huge. The announcers are changing with the game, they leave the past to the guys on the internet to tell why Lebron would have never made it in 1988.

 

Basketball's top show, Inside the NBA, is constantly referencing how much better basketball used to be and how modern players couldn't cut it back then. Literally every show, multiple times. Regardless, it's very entertaining due to the great personalities.

[Bobthe4th]

Basketball's top show, Inside the NBA, is constantly referencing how much better basketball used to be and how modern players couldn't cut it back then. Literally every show, multiple times. Regardless, it's very entertaining due to the great personalities.

 

Yeah, in pretty much every sport, when commentators and analysts are ex players, they'll often use "back in my day" cliches. When they are media people, they tend to do it much less.

[Deadpool]

Encryted signals between catcher and pitcher does make sense.

 

The new market inefficiency: Hackers...

Edited January 24, 2020 by Deadpool

[Laika]

Encryted signals between catcher and pitcher does make sense.

 

On the surface it does but I've yet to see an actual proposal that doesn't have flaws.

[KevinGregg]

On the surface it does but I've yet to see an actual proposal that doesn't have flaws.

 

hows this: pitcher and catcher have a little smartwatch-like device with a polarized screen that can only be viewed from head on so no one can see it except the person looking right at it. It can be set up before-hand for all the pitches the pitcher has available. The catcher presses a button for the pitch type, then the interface changes to a picture of the strike zone and he selects a location either on the plate or off it. So I guess there would be 25 possible locations - the standard 9 quadrants of the strike zone, as well as a square in each area around the zone to indicate you want a ball in that area.

The pitch and location show up on the pitcher's watch and he either shakes or nods to confirm like always. Could easily be reversed to let pitchers call their own game.

[Dick_Pole]

On the surface it does but I've yet to see an actual proposal that doesn't have flaws.

 

Telepathy.

[Dick_Pole]

Imagine those poor aliens who have telepathic powers when they try to play space baseball. How do they deal with this? Are there "unwritten, gentlemanly" rules about opposing players not entering into the minds of the opposing pitcher and catcher?

[The Cats Ass]

Imagine those poor aliens who have telepathic powers when they try to play space baseball. How do they deal with this? Are there "unwritten, gentlemanly" rules about opposing players not entering into the minds of the opposing pitcher and catcher?

 

You're dumn.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The catcher helmet and pitcher's hat are obviously made of tinfoil.

[Laika]

hows this: pitcher and catcher have a little smartwatch-like device with a polarized screen that can only be viewed from head on so no one can see it except the person looking right at it. It can be set up before-hand for all the pitches the pitcher has available. The catcher presses a button for the pitch type, then the interface changes to a picture of the strike zone and he selects a location either on the plate or off it. So I guess there would be 25 possible locations - the standard 9 quadrants of the strike zone, as well as a square in each area around the zone to indicate you want a ball in that area.

The pitch and location show up on the pitcher's watch and he either shakes or nods to confirm like always. Could easily be reversed to let pitchers call their own game.

 

Anything with wearable technology, or any new technology for that matter, has potential issues both obvious and unpredictable.

[Beans]

hows this: pitcher and catcher have a little smartwatch-like device with a polarized screen that can only be viewed from head on so no one can see it except the person looking right at it. It can be set up before-hand for all the pitches the pitcher has available. The catcher presses a button for the pitch type, then the interface changes to a picture of the strike zone and he selects a location either on the plate or off it. So I guess there would be 25 possible locations - the standard 9 quadrants of the strike zone, as well as a square in each area around the zone to indicate you want a ball in that area.

The pitch and location show up on the pitcher's watch and he either shakes or nods to confirm like always. Could easily be reversed to let pitchers call their own game.

Funny thing is MLB is actually looking into stuff like this:

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/mlb-discussing-on-field-wearable-technology-to-prevent-sign-stealing-185641614.html

[max silver]

hows this: pitcher and catcher have a little smartwatch-like device with a polarized screen that can only be viewed from head on so no one can see it except the person looking right at it. It can be set up before-hand for all the pitches the pitcher has available. The catcher presses a button for the pitch type, then the interface changes to a picture of the strike zone and he selects a location either on the plate or off it. So I guess there would be 25 possible locations - the standard 9 quadrants of the strike zone, as well as a square in each area around the zone to indicate you want a ball in that area.

The pitch and location show up on the pitcher's watch and he either shakes or nods to confirm like always. Could easily be reversed to let pitchers call their own game.

 

Something like that could work nicely. My only concern with the catcher wearing a device is the high likelihood of it being destroyed by foul tips eventually. I guess they would need to have backup devices available in that case.

[Abomination]

Something like that could work nicely. My only concern with the catcher wearing a device is the high likelihood of it being destroyed by foul tips eventually. I guess they would need to have backup devices available in that case.

 

I think it's more likely that calling the game will shift to the dugout, and the pitcher (and/or possibly catcher) will use a tap system to modify the call if they want to change it.

[max silver]

I think it's more likely that calling the game will shift to the dugout, and the pitcher (and/or possibly catcher) will use a tap system to modify the call if they want to change it.

 

That seems to be the general consensus from the articles I've read on the subject. Between the pitching coach taking over game calling, and the likely future implementation of an electronic strike zone, the catching position is going to become far less demanding. Framing will essentially become a useless skill at that point, and much of the implementation of strategy will be removed from the catcher as well.

[Deadpool]

hows this: pitcher and catcher have a little smartwatch-like device with a polarized screen that can only be viewed from head on so no one can see it except the person looking right at it. It can be set up before-hand for all the pitches the pitcher has available. The catcher presses a button for the pitch type, then the interface changes to a picture of the strike zone and he selects a location either on the plate or off it. So I guess there would be 25 possible locations - the standard 9 quadrants of the strike zone, as well as a square in each area around the zone to indicate you want a ball in that area.

The pitch and location show up on the pitcher's watch and he either shakes or nods to confirm like always. Could easily be reversed to let pitchers call their own game.

 

2 minutes between pitches would become the norm with this.

[Bobthe4th]

That seems to be the general consensus from the articles I've read on the subject. Between the pitching coach taking over game calling, and the likely future implementation of an electronic strike zone, the catching position is going to become far less demanding. Framing will essentially become a useless skill at that point, and much of the implementation of strategy will be removed from the catcher as well.

 

Yeah robo umps will change the value of catchers significantly. And if pitch calling goes to the dugout too then we'll see many more bat first catchers.

[max silver]

Yeah robo umps will change the value of catchers significantly. And if pitch calling goes to the dugout too then we'll see many more bat first catchers.

 

Maybe there is hope for ultra beefcake catcher Alejandro Kirk to remain at the position. If all he needs to do is be agile enough to flop to his knees to block the odd pitch (should be easy with his ample girth) then on the field sexy time with Captain Kirk is coming soon.

[Boxcar]

Maybe there is hope for ultra beefcake catcher Alejandro Kirk to remain at the position. If all he needs to do is be agile enough to flop to his knees to block the odd pitch (should be easy with his ample girth) then on the field sexy time with Captain Kirk is coming soon.

 

Kirk isn't a bad defensive catcher.

[max silver]

Kirk isn't a bad defensive catcher.

 

Yeah my post was more in jest than anything given Kirk's ultrimate man physique. Some scouts apparently question his ability to remain at catcher due to his terrible build, but he actually made improvements to his physique in the offseason recently, and has a great throwing arm and decent catching skills already.