Blue Jays GM Candidates [Tinnish? Peter Brand?]

[thatoneguy]

ya no way he[s getting fired after the public backlash of this f***fest

 

You've been reading Twitter too much.

[FrozenRopes]

There are a lot of good yes men out there.

[L54]

?? Is this true. Why is it mentioned so much?? It makes me think the following happened

 

It is true and she was like 30. Was my first cougar hunt.

[GeorgiaPeach]

Are also Cy Young contenders next season lol. Stroman is great but not on that level.

 

So why not give the kid some time?

 

When Kluber was Stroman's age he had himself a pretty meh year between AA & AAA and didn't turn the corner until he was 27.

[Boxcar]

I honestly think Stroman is getting bad advice and that's part of the reason I'm happy AA is gone. There seems to be a bit of a trend where pitchers in the minors are being taught to pitch to contact. Minor leaguers leaving the Jays instantly see an uptick in k rate, unless I just didn't go in depth enough. Sanchez has good stuff, rarely misses bats, and now Stroman too. It's all speculation but it does make sense. Rick Anderson did the same thing in Minnesota with disastrous results until Ryan came back and told him to cut that s*** out.

[THANOS]

I honestly think Stroman is getting bad advice and that's part of the reason I'm happy AA is gone. There seems to be a bit of a trend where pitchers in the minors are being taught to pitch to contact. Minor leaguers leaving the Jays instantly see an uptick in k rate, unless I just didn't go in depth enough. Sanchez has good stuff, rarely misses bats, and now Stroman too. It's all speculation but it does make sense. Rick Anderson did the same thing in Minnesota with disastrous results until Ryan came back and told him to cut that s*** out.

 

I think you're on to something. It seems to have begun a couple years ago and really became a thing this year. Every pitcher that was called up to AA/AAA/Jays saw their k-rate decline drastically, like Hoffman this year. I hope Shapiro rights that ship now.

[Frenchsoup]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with pitching to contact, you save pitches in game and throughout your career.

[Laika]

With Sanchez and Hoffman it was mechanical. The Blue Jays made them go to these kind of simple and less athletic "tall-and-fall" deliveries, which in Hoffman's case impacted his stuff. There was a lot of talk about that by some scouts, how Hoffman's delivery didn't look as electric with Toronto. Most saw it as a deliberate attempt by Toronto to reduce his injury risk.

 

Stroman's drop in K's doesn't bother me, since he's still been very effective. We should expect big drops in strikeouts from AAA/AA to the MLB level anyway. There is some level of K% for GB% tradeoff that would be good.

 

I'm not really sure who else there is. I guess Hutch's K rate tanked this year.

[Boxcar]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with pitching to contact, you save pitches in game and throughout your career.

 

There is absolutely nothing correct about this statement.

[Boxcar]

With Sanchez and Hoffman it was mechanical. The Blue Jays made them go to these kind of simple and less athletic "tall-and-fall" deliveries, which in Hoffman's case impacted his stuff. There was a lot of talk about that by some scouts, how Hoffman's delivery didn't look as electric with Toronto. Most saw it as a deliberate attempt by Toronto to reduce his injury risk.

 

Stroman's drop in K's doesn't bother me, since he's still been very effective. We should expect big drops in strikeouts from AAA/AA to the MLB level anyway. There is some level of K% for GB% tradeoff that would be good.

 

I'm not really sure who else there is. I guess Hutch's K rate tanked this year.

 

Chase Dejong, Jesus Tinoco, Jairo Labourt, Joe Musgrove, Kevin Comer are more names.

[burlingtonbandit]

With Sanchez and Hoffman it was mechanical. The Blue Jays made them go to these kind of simple and less athletic "tall-and-fall" deliveries, which in Hoffman's case impacted his stuff. There was a lot of talk about that by some scouts, how Hoffman's delivery didn't look as electric with Toronto. Most saw it as a deliberate attempt by Toronto to reduce his injury risk.

 

Stroman's drop in K's doesn't bother me, since he's still been very effective. We should expect big drops in strikeouts from AAA/AA to the MLB level anyway. There is some level of K% for GB% tradeoff that would be good.

 

I'm not really sure who else there is. I guess Hutch's K rate tanked this year.

 

Well stroman lost about 1 MPH this season and seems to have almost abandoned his 4 Seamer for the 2 seamer. I think that could partly explain the small drop in strikeouts. If he continues to get the grounball rate above 60% he doesn't necessarily need the strikeouts like you said. Low pitch count groundouts will help him go deeper into games so his value is probably around the same either way.

[glory]

Norris went from striking out 12 per 9 in the minors in 2014 to 7.7 per 9 this season. Whether that was due to a mechanical change, his health, or something else, who knows, but that was a pretty substantial drop as well.

 

I'm really glad AA is not in the organization anymore. Changes need to be made all over the org, from minors to the Majors.

[burlingtonbandit]

Norris went from striking out 12 per 9 in the minors in 2014 to 7.7 per 9 this season. Whether that was due to a mechanical change, his health, or something else, who knows, but that was a pretty substantial drop as well.

 

I'm really glad AA is not in the organization anymore. Changes need to be made all over the org, from minors to the Majors.

 

Have to remember transitioning to MLB is very difficult too lol. I think Norris will get a few more Ks his Swstr% indicates he should of struck out more batters. His stuff has been pretty inconsistent it seems too.

 

Really rooting for the guy though even if he isn't with the Jays. One of the best people in the game.

[Laika]

Really rooting for the guy though even if he isn't with the Jays. One of the best people in the game.

 

Why? Because he has instagram, a van, and loves Jesus?

[burlingtonbandit]

Why? Because he has instagram, a van, and loves Jesus?

 

ugh what?

 

He seems like a really genuine person, which can't be said for a lot of athletes. Not many people in the position he is would be hanging out with homeless people and helping them out the way he has.

 

I will say he has one of the best instagram accounts.

[Laika]

He seems like a hippy poser to me.

[glory]

Have to remember transitioning to MLB is very difficult too lol. I think Norris will get a few more Ks his Swstr% indicates he should of struck out more batters. His stuff has been pretty inconsistent it seems too.

 

Really rooting for the guy though even if he isn't with the Jays. One of the best people in the game.

 

His 7.7 K/9 was in AAA Buffalo, not the Majors. I could understand a drop in the Majors, especially for a rookie.

[Frenchsoup]

There is absolutely nothing correct about this statement.

 

K, do you want Stroman to start throwing more sliders to get those k's? Because that will bring his k's up but put tons of pressure on his arm.

[burlingtonbandit]

There is no way to justify strikeouts being bad for a pitcher. They're the most efficient way to record an out and rarely result in runner advancement. Also, ground ball pitchers do not have a health advantage.

 

With that said, Stroman is really good and we should be excited about his future outlook no matter what.

 

Isn't a 1 pitch groundout the most efficient way to record an out?

[Captain Adama]

Isn't a 1 pitch groundout the most efficient way to record an out?

 

Sure, but there's a MUCH greater chance of a pitcher getting a batter out by the K than a groundball.

[L54]

Isn't a 1 pitch groundout the most efficient way to record an out?

 

Better chance of getting on base via a ground ball vs a strikeout.

[Nafro]

Isn't a 1 pitch groundout the most efficient way to record an out?

 

With a runner on third base and less than two out, do you want a batter to hit a ground ball or strike out? If the ball is not put in play, it is no doubt better.

 

I think "pitching to contact" is a silly concept. The whole point of pitching is to create the least amount of contact possible. That's not to say a high ground ball rate is also not a positive. I think if you are "pitching to contact", you are giving the batter a better chance to square up a ball and hit it hard.

 

Weak contact, created by hard pitches with good late movement, or good off-speed pitches, is a different story. I would argue that happens by trying to miss bats though, as I think is what the point that is trying to be made.

[Nafro]

Why? Because he has instagram, a van, and loves Jesus?

 

Daniel Norris is a big fan of Jesus Tinoco?

[burlingtonbandit]

For a team, sure (although it's not much of an advantage to have a plate appearance end in fewer pitches). But not for a pitcher, since he can't really control whether the ground ball is converted into an out. Of his possible outcomes, strikeouts are outs most frequently so they are the most efficient method.

 

Oh for sure you would take a strikeout vs any other out. Maybe popout since you could do it on less pitches but not going to nitpick.

[Frenchsoup]

With a runner on third base and less than two out, do you want a batter to hit a ground ball or strike out? If the ball is not put in play, it is no doubt better.

 

I think "pitching to contact" is a silly concept. The whole point of pitching is to create the least amount of contact possible. That's not to say a high ground ball rate is also not a positive. I think if you are "pitching to contact", you are giving the batter a better chance to square up a ball and hit it hard.

 

Weak contact, created by hard pitches with good late movement, or good off-speed pitches, is a different story. I would argue that happens by trying to miss bats though, as I think is what the point that is trying to be made.

 

There are situations where a pitcher should not want contact yes.

[KingKat]

He seems like a hippy poser to me.

 

Seems like an interesting young man to me but one who doesn't seem to understand the extent of his privilege. It's pretty easy for a guy in his situation to live the life of a part time vagabond and I don't sense as much awareness of that fact as I would like to (though no less that what I expect from the average person his age).

[Boxcar]

K, do you want Stroman to start throwing more sliders to get those k's? Because that will bring his k's up but put tons of pressure on his arm.

 

4 seamer too.

 

Did you not watch the ALCS? I think if anyone could come to appreciate limiting contact, it should be Jays fans. Ned Yost even talks about it every chance he gets, team wide philosophy to put the ball in play. Why would the opposite viewpoint for pitchers not be just as beneficial?

[burlingtonbandit]

4 seamer too.

 

Did you not watch the ALCS? I think if anyone could come to appreciate limiting contact, it should be Jays fans. Ned Yost even talks about it every chance he gets, team wide philosophy to put the ball in play. Why would the opposite viewpoint for pitchers not be just as beneficial?

 

I'd like to see Stroman elevate the 4 seam just to give batters a different look. Also think he would get more Ks as well, although he might be a few more HRs too. I don't blame him and Martin using the 2 seam as much as they do since its such a good pitch but a few extra 4 seamers might not be so bad.

[Frenchsoup]

4 seamer too.

 

Did you not watch the ALCS? I think if anyone could come to appreciate limiting contact, it should be Jays fans. Ned Yost even talks about it every chance he gets, team wide philosophy to put the ball in play. Why would the opposite viewpoint for pitchers not be just as beneficial?

 

Im thinking more long term then you. I think your going to see Stroman eat a ton of innings up next year, Ala Keuchel. Strikeouts are obviously amazing, but weak groundballs are amazing as well. Gives you a chance to get 2 outs with 1 pitch.

[Nafro]

Im thinking more long term then you. I think your going to see Stroman eat a ton of innings up next year, Ala Keuchel. Strikeouts are obviously amazing, but weak groundballs are amazing as well. Gives you a chance to get 2 outs with 1 pitch.

 

The ability to get a ground ball with runners on for a double play is definitely a positive. That being said if you keep runners from reaching base, there is no need for a double play.