GDT (2/4): Royals @ Blue Jays [Cueto vs Hutchison] July 31 - 7:07 PM

[Maahfaace]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/did-drew-hutchison-really-change-his-slider/

 

This is a great article that sheds some light hutch's slider woes. Luck is overused around here.

[LTR]

The Stat(s) arent the issue, it's your propensity to use luck as such a significant imaginary metric

 

The stats are plainly indicative that it's luck, or lack there of. No person with an adequate baseball mind would disagree with this.

[LTR]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/did-drew-hutchison-really-change-his-slider/

 

This is a great article that sheds some light hutch's slider woes. Luck is overused around here.

 

Yes, Hutch's slider doesn't break as much but you're still choosing to ignore the plain and simple data.

 

xFIP and FIP (etc.) are much better indications of talent than ERA.

 

Hutch has the highest BABIP in the majors, it's not sustainable.

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=pit&lg=all&qual=y&type=8&season=2015&month=0&season1=2015&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&sort=12,d

[Spanky99]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/did-drew-hutchison-really-change-his-slider/

 

This is a great article that sheds some light hutch's slider woes. Luck is overused around here.

 

There was an article same time last year on how Hutch's slider was arguably the best in baseball?! He's been more erratic this year with the pitch. Last year in the second half it was labeled the sickest pitch in baseball related to starters, he's been inconsistent, it happens.

[Maahfaace]

Yes, Hutch's slider doesn't break as much but you're still choosing to ignore the plain and simple data.

 

xFIP and FIP (etc.) are much better indications of talent than ERA.

 

Hutch has the highest BABIP in the majors, it's not sustainable.

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=pit&lg=all&qual=y&type=8&season=2015&month=0&season1=2015&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&sort=12,d

 

I never said hutch didn't have talent, I said he's struggling and luck has a s*** ton less to do with it than you assume based off a limited evaluation process. It's narrow minded to assume the that the limited way these stats are measured is absolute, and then attach luck as a major deciding factor when evaluating. There is so much more to pitching that is currently not quantifiable, and as much as some on here feel the insatiable need to label as luck given these limitations, it just isn't fact.

 

Booze makes me want to pick apart broadstrokes

[Maahfaace]

There was an article same time last year on how Hutch's slider was arguably the best in baseball?! He's been more erratic this year with the pitch. Last year in the second half it was labeled the sickest pitch in baseball related to starters, he's been inconsistent, it happens.

 

I agree, but i dispute luck as this magnificent factor LTR makes it out to be

[Spanky99]

I agree, but i dispute luck as this magnificent factor LTR makes it out to be

 

He's outlining a very strong argument, I wouldn't ignore it, today for instance in the first there was two seeing eye basehits, that hurt him. Other than that he was good. Sure he wasn't sharp, but he was fairly decent. The line doesn't tell the story.

[nextyear]

Fortunately there are so many different stats available on fangraphs that it is possible to discern luck from explainable differences.

 

I think the telling factor is Hutchinson's line drive percentage. This year it is 25.6% versus 18.6 in 2014 - http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=10732&position=P . This seems to indicate that he is being hit harder this year than last year.

 

Here is an interesting article from fangraphs - http://www.fangraphs.com/library/pitching/batted-ball/ . In this article it states that Line drives are death to pitchers, while ground balls are the best for a pitcher. In numerical terms, line drives produce 1.26 runs/out, fly balls produce 0.13 R/O, and ground balls produce only 0.05 R/O.. The article also explains that if a pitcher is allowing more line drives then their BABIP will be higher.

 

I found this article to be very informative, however, it was also was very contradictive going by the following statement: We know that pitchers do not have complete control, or even much control at all, over what happens to a baseball once it’s put in play, but they do have some control over the type of batted ball they allow. If you allow ten ground balls, you can’t control if zero, three, or nine go for hits, but you did control the fact that none are leaving the park. On the other hand, fly ball pitchers can usually limit the number of hits they allow, but that also makes them more vulnerable to home runs.. There are contradictions within this one paragraph and it contradicts the entire point of the article. What maddens me is how authors want to make profound statements instead of sticking to the facts (example: If you allow ten ground balls, you can’t control if zero, three, or nine go for hits, but you did control the fact that none are leaving the park., which completely contradicts the point that the author was making in regards to line drives being death to a pitcher.

[nextyear]

There was an article same time last year on how Hutch's slider was arguably the best in baseball?! He's been more erratic this year with the pitch. Last year in the second half it was labeled the sickest pitch in baseball related to starters, he's been inconsistent, it happens.

 

 

This article seems to give proof that his slider isn't as good as last year (as you stated) - http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/did-drew-hutchison-really-change-his-slider/

[puphood]

Get off Hutch's back this is a team game and the jays now have a formable bull pen which can come in when he stumbles (I can't believe how they show cased them last night) combined with defence and bats we have a chance at this division. Hopefully we show the same effort in NY......

[Deadpool]

Reading this thread the day after was a wild ride. And I couldn't in good conscience not quote the post of the game, which clearly did not get the love and respect it deserved during the thread:

 

If Loup faces any right handers I will personally s*** on Gibbons' wife.

[puphood]

Why is Loup still on this team? Out of options? All the dude does is blow games.

I usually have to leave when Loup comes up to pitch but what he did last night was what we wanted a ground ball and he shattered the guys bat. That was on Donaldson as he almost put in the stands no big deal the bull pen came in and did there job........

[jays4life19]

No tulo in the lineup today?

[LTR]

I never said hutch didn't have talent, I said he's struggling and luck has a s*** ton less to do with it than you assume based off a limited evaluation process. It's narrow minded to assume the that the limited way these stats are measured is absolute, and then attach luck as a major deciding factor when evaluating. There is so much more to pitching that is currently not quantifiable, and as much as some on here feel the insatiable need to label as luck given these limitations, it just isn't fact.

 

Booze makes me want to pick apart broadstrokes

 

Talent = performance, this year

 

Pretty much all stats point to Hutch having a fine season outside ERA.

[Spanky99]

This article seems to give proof that his slider isn't as good as last year (as you stated) - http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/did-drew-hutchison-really-change-his-slider/

 

Yeah, read it, it was posted above.

[Maahfaace]

Talent = performance, this year

 

Pretty much all stats point to Hutch having a fine season outside ERA.

 

Talent = performance.........lol it most certainly does not. Its partly why our softball team is named" wasted talent".

[nextyear]

Yeah, read it, it was posted above.

 

oops. It was an interesting article anyway. Thanks to Maahfaace for posting it.

[LTR]

Talent = performance.........lol it most certainly does not. Its partly why our softball team is named" wasted talent".

 

You're getting off track now, I meant to indicate performance.

[Maahfaace]

You're getting off track now, I meant to indicate performance.

 

I'm also sober now so I won't further indulge this pointless debate any further friend

[Spanky99]

You're getting off track now, I meant to indicate performance.

 

Your point stands.

[Deadpool]

I'm also sober now so I won't further indulge this pointless debate any further friend

 

It's officially after noon on a Saturday, so rectify this, goddammit!

[Maahfaace]

It's officially after noon on a Saturday, so rectify this, goddammit!

 

Soon enough. Wifey is dragging me to a hipster wedding today.

[LTR]

I'm also sober now so I won't further indulge this pointless debate any further friend

 

This is cause for celebration, LET'S GO DRINKING