GDT(2/3): Your Toronto Blue Jays @ Tampa Bay Rays - Norris vs. Ramirez - 6:10 PM ET

[CJ-Freeway]

If they don't improve the pen soon, this will be another 81-83 win year, in 3rd place.

[CJ-Freeway]

Actually, officially, we only have 3 blown saves. Washington has 5 blown saves already.. and you wonder why that team is struggling.

 

FYI, according to ESPN:

 

Washington 5

Seattle 4

Chicago 4

Cincy 4

Boston and Toronto tied at 3

 

If you think our bullpen sucks, try being a Nats fan right now.. they'd be complaining more! Same goes in Boston, whose overworked pen, bad starters, and inconsistent offense are costing them games (and the reason they're only 10-7 (soon to be 10-8, as they are losing to the O's with Zach Britton coming for the 9th.)

 

I quoted some guy in the thread (can't remember who) who said that tonight was the 5th blown save. So was it the 4th or 5th tonight?

[jaysfan2014]

I quoted some guy in the thread (can't remember who) who said that tonight was the 5th blown save. So was it the 4th or 5th tonight?

 

3rd. We had 2 going into the game. Those results included today's game..

[jays4life19]

It's entirely possible our SP can cut it (considering our offense). But our bullpen is a mess.

 

At least that's probably the easiest thing to fix.

[BTS]

It's only the 3rd blown lead by the pen. Second for Castro, and Cecil has one.

[ElNik2013]

Good start from Norris. Is his changeup plus or what? Fastball seems to be topping out at 93MPH. Maybe the minor league reports were off on both his FB velocity and changeup quality.

 

Regardless, good to see him pitch well.

[ElNik2013]

Ok because you say so?

 

Did you think he was "not good" when he was making major leaguers look like little leaguers his first few appearances?

 

Talk about a massive over-reaction. You're better than this. Clean it up.

 

 

Except he wasn't making major leaguers look like little leaguers. Pitchers can get away with fat pitches for a period of time, but be sure it will catch up to them.

[BTS]

Ok because you say so?

 

Did you think he was "not good" when he was making major leaguers look like little leaguers his first few appearances?

 

Talk about a massive over-reaction. You're better than this. Clean it up.

 

This never happened. He's an extreme flyball pitcher who's not even striking out 7/9 and has command issues. Ernesto Frieri without the elite K-rate. BABIP luck in his first few appearances doesn't change that.

[CJ-Freeway]

3rd. We had 2 going into the game. Those results included today's game..

 

Damn, that's too much anyways IMO. I guess it's because most of our other losses were by 3+ runs

[flafson]

This never happened. He's an extreme flyball pitcher who's not even striking out 7/9 and has command issues. Ernesto Frieri without the elite K-rate. BABIP luck in his first few appearances doesn't change that.

 

If he had 4 runs to work with, we would have won the game. Blame the hitters

[ElNik2013]

Good thing for me, if there's one team I don't mind the Jays losing to, it's the Rays.

 

I love how efficient and value-conscious they are. Picking up guys like Souza Jr, for example, is just great.

 

Ok, come at me homerz...

[BTS]

Good thing for me, if there's one team I don't mind the Jays losing to, it's the Rays.

 

I love how efficient and value-conscious they are. Picking up guys like Souza Jr, for example, is just great.

 

Ok, come at me homerz...

 

http://www.midiajp.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/Star-Wars-7-Rumor-Emperor-Returning.jpg

[Governator]

Gibbons taught me tonight that Castro>Cecil>Osuna and Cecil went from closer to loogy in 3 weeks.

 

We're f***ed.

[frizzer1]

If you expect two 20 year old starters who have never pitched above A ball to be bullpen stalwarts then you are dreaming.....it's like lightening striking twice.. I just hope that neither of these outstanding prospects are ruined by this...and expecting 4 out saves from castro? Unbelievable.

[ElNik2013]

Plus, I also like how the 2 clowns on the SN broadcast keep praising the way they keep competing with a low payroll because, even though they don't have a clue, they're actually ripping the Jays (and other teams) for their inability to contend with a bigger budget.

 

Boy are these 2 clueless.

[L54]

I hate losing to teams like the Rays and A's because what they do isn't exactly proprietary.

[ScientificReason]

I'm sorry to break this to you, but you may be slightly retarded. Mentally retarded.

 

lol, that burn.

[Stangstag]

He was absolutely NAILS his first 4-5 appearances. Now with a couple of hard hits his last 2 times out you want him gone?

 

Don't be silly. You are massively over reacting. Soon you will realize.

 

He was never "nails". Even in that first series in NY, Arod nearly homered in his first at bat

[jaysfan2014]

Boston just moved ahead of us in the blown saves department (thanks to ****** Adam Jones.. and some bad D by Mookie Betts.)

[o2cui2i]

Can we not talking about batting averages in evaluating players? I would think that people would be a little more intelligent on a "baseball forum".

 

dude, it's a baseball fan forum, not an advanced stats discussion. people are allowed to discuss baseball at whatever level they want as long as it's not hateful, threatening, attacking or annoying to the mods.

 

if you want to talk advanced stats I'm sure you can get what you need in the off topic section.

[o2cui2i]

Boston just moved ahead of us in the blown saves department (thanks to ****** Adam Jones.. and some bad D by Mookie Betts.)

 

so you're sayin they suck more than us?

 

get em tomorrow

[o2cui2i]

I hate losing to teams like the Rays and A's because what they do isn't exactly proprietary.

 

I just wish we could make less mistakes like they do. Two games in a row against Tampa the Jays shot themselves in the foot as an organization.

 

getting more out of less is an art form that isn't on display in Toronto.

[o2cui2i]

He was absolutely NAILS his first 4-5 appearances. Now with a couple of hard hits his last 2 times out you want him gone?

 

Don't be silly. You are massively over reacting. Soon you will realize.

 

I think you are confusing results with actual performance. He had great results but has not had great command. the league has seen video and know it's fastball or not a strike. His fastball has been billiard table flat and guys at this level can hit it if it's on the same plane through the zone.

 

Castro needs to go down and work on his delivery and add a pitch.

[ElNik2013]

Whats going to happen when Devon Travis has the inevitable 0-20 slump? No doubt some of these same people harping about Castro will call for his demotion too.

 

No way. Travis sees pitches, doesn't strike out often and is hitting the ball hard.

 

When the opposite is true of a pitcher....

[Stangstag]

Whats going to happen when Devon Travis has the inevitable 0-20 slump? No doubt some of these same people harping about Castro will call for his demotion too.

 

If he has 20 strikeouts, then sure, we will be worried. But if he is putting the ball in play thats all you can ask for.

[LTR]

On the bright side Norris looked great today and he was facing 9 righties!

 

The Rays are not a push-over offensively anymore either... possibly above average offense.

[Stangstag]

On the bright side Norris looked great today and he was facing 9 righties!

 

The Rays are not a push-over offensively anymore either... above average offense.

 

Yeah Norris was great. Even the 1 run he gave up was due to a walk that should have been a K, and a bloop double

[havok24]

Whats going to happen when Devon Travis has the inevitable 0-20 slump? No doubt some of these same people harping about Castro will call for his demotion too.

 

Seriously? Travis has been one of the best players on the team in the early going, and has clearly demonstrated that he has major league skills right now. Castro on the other hand isn't a very good pitcher right now. Castro is a really good prospect, but it's more than evident that he isn't ready for the show right now.

[o2cui2i]

Whats going to happen when Devon Travis has the inevitable 0-20 slump? No doubt some of these same people harping about Castro will call for his demotion too.

 

he has a great swing. one of the most compact of the jays hitters. He's tracking the ball and using the whole field "literally." that makes him hard to defend as well. His offense was never a problem. He's always been thought of as a bat first guy, but his defense has been very good.

[Governator]

Whats going to happen when Devon Travis has the inevitable 0-20 slump? No doubt some of these same people harping about Castro will call for his demotion too.

 

Before tonight's game

 

Miguel Castro

1.93 ERA > You were being deceived

4.70 xFIP > Let reality set in

-0.2 WAR > Ouch

8.87 K/9

3.88 BB/9

 

Compare to Rays Substitute Closer

 

Brad Boxberger

2.45 ERA

2.28 xFIP

0.4 WAR

14.73 K/9

3.68 BB/9