Mistakes, Mistakes, Mistakes...Are They an AA Calling Card?

[SantosLHalper21]

I can't for the life of me figure out how he still has a job. Here's my list of mistakes AA has made as a GM for the Jays.

 

Misses

 

-Trading Aaron Hill and Johnny Mac for Kelly Johnson. Likely will go down as one of the worst deals in Jays history.

 

-Trading Noah Syndergaard and Travis D'Arnaud for "E"RA Dickey. Questioned the move when it was made, don't question it now. One of the worst deals in franchise history.

 

-Trading Mike Napoli for Frank Francisco. Napoli would go onto bat .320 and crush 30 home runs in 113 games that season for the Rangers while Francisco only lasted one season with the Jays.

 

-Trading Roy Halladay for Kyle Drabek, Anthony Gose and Travis D'Arnaud (albeit its still up in the air)

 

-Signing Maicer Izturis to a 3yr/10million dollar deal and playing Ryan Goins ahead of him.

 

-He traded away Francisco Cordero (high five!), but in turn had to trade away Asher Wojciechowski who looks legit, Carlos Perez (very good defensive catcher with good OBP), Joe Musgrove, Kevin Comer, and David Roillins. He took on the massive contract of JA Happ in a futile attempt to acquire another starter. Now stuck with the contract, Happ is the Jays' 6th starter. Lyon was probably the best part of the deal for Toronto and wasn't resigned by the team following the 2012 season. He managed to gouge the farm system in the process.

 

-Including almost every top prospect the organization had in the Winter of 2012 in an attempt to trade for a World Series. Jays turned around and got spanked by the MLB and went from a top 5 prospect system to a bottom 5 in the matter of one winter.

 

-Letting Rajai Davis go via Free Agency and replacing him with Moises Sierra, whom he has now lost via waivers to the Chi Sox. Davis brings an element of speed to the lineup, and currently leads the Tigers in AVG and SB.

 

-Letting David Carpenter go in the deal with John Farrell. After he was brutally assaulted in his time in Toronto to the tune of a 30.38 ERA, he went in the trade to the BoSox then to the Braves and has been an instant hit in that bullpen. Last season he finished the year with 65 IP and an ERA of 1.78, BAA .198, and a 0.99 WHIP, along with a 10.0K/9IP line. For a crashing Jays pen in need of a power arm, letting go of Carpenter too early looks like a dumb move.

 

-Mike Aviles and Yan Gomes for Esmil Rogers. Aviles is a decent 2B/SS backup, much cheaper than Izturis and a better defender. Meanwhile Gomes has stolen the starting C position away from Carlos "Black Magic Woman" Santana. SMH..all I can say.

 

-Alex Rios, a career .290+ hitter let go on waivers and acquired by the Chi Sox due to hitting under .200 to start out the 2009 campaign. Jays elect to not negotiate a trade and lose Rios for nothing. Rios has gone on to hit for AVG with the White Sox and a tidy 3.0+ WAR in 4 seasons with the Sox. Now hitting .327 this year with the Rangers.

 

- Emilio Bonifacio- Mr. Versatility, Mr. E4 on the Jays is currently hitting .343 with the Cubs with 10 SB. He was also pretty good with the Royals.

 

Break...

 

Some Hits

Trading Vernon Wells' Contract, The Marlins deal, Lawrie for Marcum, Getting Rajai Davis for Farquhar, and Magnuson, Signing Melky Cabrera, Rasmus Trade, and signing Dionar Novarro and letting JP walk, drafting Marcus Stroman, trading League for Morrow, Thames for Delabar.

 

Back to the negativity..

 

Drafting

-Taking Deck McGuire 11th overall in 2010, ahead of the likes of Chris Sale, Mike Foltyniwicz, Christian Yelich, Zach Cox, Jesse Biddle, and Zach Lee

-Taking Chad Jenkins 20th overall in 2009, ahead of Kyle Gibson, Mike Trout, James Paxton etc

-Taking James Paxton 37th overall in 2009 and not signing him.

-Taking Tyler Beede 21st overall in 2011 ahead of Kolten Wong, Alex Meyer, and Rob Stephenson. Beede elected to not sign with the Jays. Beede could be a top five pick in the 2014 Draft apparently.

-Taking DJ Davis 17th overall in 2012 ahead of Mike Wacha, Lucas Sims, Corey Seager and Marcus Stroman

-Taking Phil Bickford 10th overall in 2013 and not being able to sign him.

-That's THREE top 21 picks taken and not signed. Like all good teams do, you must draft well. Anthopolous hasn't hit the mark at the drafts yet.

 

-Saying and Not Doing. Expecting and Not Delivering.

 

"We need upgrades at starting pitching and second base"

 

-Ervin Santana fiasco this offseason. Players willing to defer salary just to bring him in. Elected to spurn Jays and sign with the Braves and has been lights out.

-Not signing one free agent starter available. Garza, Santana, Jimenez, Tanaka etc

-Yu Darvish and not really being in the race. See how that turned out?

 

-Almost forgot...hiring John Gibbons...again.. to manage this team.

 

All of this is off the top of my head, there's obviously more where that came from.

 

So Why? Why does this guy still have a job with the team?

 

There's mistakes and then there's glaring mistakes, and I'm sorry, but most of these are GLARING mistakes. They are directly responsible for the demise of the Jays team.

 

For the amount of good he has done, the mistakes clearly outweigh the hits he's had. Unless something changes soon, Anthopolous should be fired immediately. This is just getting old fast.

 

Any more I forgot for mistakes boys?

[Boxcar]

I made it through a few but so far you are being a major hindsight warrior. People like you were clamoring for Hill to be traded for anything.

 

Lmfao you criticized him for picking Jenkins ahead of a guy that was also picked by the Jays? Are you high? Not including the Yunel trade as a positive? Oh man, another one DAMN I can't believe the Jays picked DJ Davis instead of Stroman! It would be really nice to have that guy in our system now.

 

TLDR guys: casual bandwagon know-it-all looks back at all the moves he busted out the pom-poms for and now blasts them as if he was against them all along. You're welcome.

[Deadpool]

-Trading Aaron Hill and Johnny Mac for Kelly Johnson. Likely will go down as one of the worst deals in Jays history.

 

Bad trade, but Mike Sirotka does not approve of your hyperbole.

 

-Trading Noah Syndergaard and Travis D'Arnaud for "E"RA Dickey. Questioned the move when it was made, don't question it now. One of the worst deals in franchise history.

 

Awful at the time, awful in hindsight.

 

-Trading Mike Napoli for Frank Francisco. Napoli would go onto bat .320 and crush 30 home runs in 113 games that season for the Rangers while Francisco only lasted one season with the Jays.

 

Not a good trade, but Napoli exceeded expectations and didn't have a place on the team (also, he was basically free in the Wells deal)

 

-Trading Roy Halladay for Kyle Drabek, Anthony Gose and Travis D'Arnaud (albeit its still up in the air)

 

This was a fantastic trade at the time. Halladay had made it clear that he was leaving the team and getting 3 guys with that kind of upside was a steal.

 

-Signing Maicer Izturis to a 3yr/10million dollar deal and playing Ryan Goins ahead of him.

 

3yr/$10M is peanuts in baseball, and Izturis would have been a fine utility infielder at that price.

 

-He traded away Francisco Cordero (high five!), but in turn had to trade away Asher Wojciechowski who looks legit, Carlos Perez (very good defensive catcher with good OBP), Joe Musgrove, Kevin Comer, and David Roillins. He took on the massive contract of JA Happ in a futile attempt to acquire another starter. Now stuck with the contract, Happ is the Jays' 6th starter. Lyon was probably the best part of the deal for Toronto and wasn't resigned by the team following the 2012 season. He managed to gouge the farm system in the process.

 

There are almost no assets in the preceding that will make any sort of MLB impact. Yes, Happ is overpaid for what he is.

 

-Including almost every top prospect the organization had in the Winter of 2012 in an attempt to trade for a World Series. Jays turned around and got spanked by the MLB and went from a top 5 prospect system to a bottom 5 in the matter of one winter.

 

The Marlins deal was great for the Jays for the most part, I've already covered the Dickey move above.

 

-Letting Rajai Davis go via Free Agency and replacing him with Moises Sierra, whom he has now lost via waivers to the Chi Sox. Davis brings an element of speed to the lineup, and currently leads the Tigers in AVG and SB.

 

Davis is a fine bench piece, but $10M/2yr is a little more than I would personally have been comfortable paying him to pinch run, since our outfield is pretty solid and we have Gose as well.

 

-Letting David Carpenter go in the deal with John Farrell. After he was brutally assaulted in his time in Toronto to the tune of a 30.38 ERA, he went in the trade to the BoSox then to the Braves and has been an instant hit in that bullpen. Last season he finished the year with 65 IP and an ERA of 1.78, BAA .198, and a 0.99 WHIP, along with a 10.0K/9IP line. For a crashing Jays pen in need of a power arm, letting go of Carpenter too early looks like a dumb move.

 

Relief pitchers are so incredibly volatile that this was impossible to predict. This seems like a very small issue.

 

-Mike Aviles and Yan Gomes for Esmil Rogers. Aviles is a decent 2B/SS backup, much cheaper than Izturis and a better defender. Meanwhile Gomes has stolen the starting C position away from Carlos "Black Magic Woman" Santana. SMH..all I can say.

 

a) Aviles is making $3.5m/year, Izturis is making $3. Gomes wasn't really a guy who anyone saw being more than a fringe MLB backup guy with some positional versatility.

 

-Alex Rios, a career .290+ hitter let go on waivers and acquired by the Chi Sox due to hitting under .200 to start out the 2009 campaign. Jays elect to not negotiate a trade and lose Rios for nothing. Rios has gone on to hit for AVG with the White Sox and a tidy 3.0+ WAR in 4 seasons with the Sox. Now hitting .327 this year with the Rangers.

 

Just... No. You know who moving expensive/complaining/fan antagonizing Rios made room for in Right Field?

 

- Emilio Bonifacio- Mr. Versatility, Mr. E4 on the Jays is currently hitting .343 with the Cubs with 10 SB. He was also pretty good with the Royals.

 

He was terrible here, everyone wanted him gone. I certainly don't miss him.

 

Trading Vernon Wells' Contract, The Marlins deal, Lawrie for Marcum, Getting Rajai Davis for Farquhar, and Magnuson, Signing Melky Cabrera, Rasmus Trade, and signing Dionar Novarro and letting JP walk, drafting Marcus Stroman, trading League for Morrow, Thames for Delabar.

 

These are all pretty good things, I agree (though, you sort of shat on the Marlins deal earlier in your thread...)

 

Drafting

-Taking Deck McGuire 11th overall in 2010, ahead of the likes of Chris Sale, Mike Foltyniwicz, Christian Yelich, Zach Cox, Jesse Biddle, and Zach Lee

-Taking Chad Jenkins 20th overall in 2009, ahead of Kyle Gibson, Mike Trout, James Paxton etc

-Taking James Paxton 37th overall in 2009 and not signing him.

-Taking Tyler Beede 21st overall in 2011 ahead of Kolten Wong, Alex Meyer, and Rob Stephenson. Beede elected to not sign with the Jays. Beede could be a top five pick in the 2014 Draft apparently.

-Taking DJ Davis 17th overall in 2012 ahead of Mike Wacha, Lucas Sims, Corey Seager and Marcus Stroman

-Taking Phil Bickford 10th overall in 2013 and not being able to sign him.

-That's THREE top 21 picks taken and not signed. Like all good teams do, you must draft well. Anthopolous hasn't hit the mark at the drafts yet.

 

Drafting is a crapshoot. And I'm not really sure you can fault a guy for taking high upside pics and not signing them and also fault him for taking guys who would sign who are lower upside... *shrug* I'm also not sure you can say "he drafted this guy in front of a guy he also drafted" as though that's a bad thing, that's simply strategy.

 

When I used to follow drafts more closely, my board always looked far different from what any team drafted.

 

 

-Saying and Not Doing. Expecting and Not Delivering.

 

This is nonsense.

 

"We need upgrades at starting pitching and second base"

 

-Ervin Santana fiasco this offseason. Players willing to defer salary just to bring him in. Elected to spurn Jays and sign with the Braves and has been lights out.

-Not signing one free agent starter available. Garza, Santana, Jimenez, Tanaka etc

-Yu Darvish and not really being in the race. See how that turned out?

 

It takes two to tango, and I think the "we could have had Santana if we'd wanted him" myth has been tackled repeatedly. I do think the Darvish thing was quite dumb, as was not ponying up a bit more for Chapman...

 

-Almost forgot...hiring John Gibbons...again.. to manage this team.

 

Gibbons is a much better in game manager than the last 2 guys we've had... I'm not crazy about how he uses his bullpen, but he has limited tools with which to work.

 

All of this is off the top of my head, there's obviously more where that came from.

 

So Why? Why does this guy still have a job with the team?

 

There's mistakes and then there's glaring mistakes, and I'm sorry, but most of these are GLARING mistakes. They are directly responsible for the demise of the Jays team.

 

For the amount of good he has done, the mistakes clearly outweigh the hits he's had. Unless something changes soon, Anthopolous should be fired immediately. This is just getting old fast.

 

Any more I forgot for mistakes boys?

 

Anyway, I'd be totally indifferent with firing him, as long as he was replaced by an improvement... I can't really say for sure that is a thing that is likely to happen... Last time we all wanted a GM gone it was Ricciardi and when AA came in he was seen as a saviour etc.

 

It would have been really nice had he addressed the bench in the off season, perhaps if one of those rumoured trades involving Santos had actually happened we'd be in a better spot, but those fell through because of medical issues (or so the story goes...) so "trade your closer for a pitcher who failed his physical" is probably a worse move than "keep your closer" on paper...

 

Is he perfect? Not by a wide margin (I felt this past off season, in particular, was incredibly weak) but keep things in perspective, a lot of your points just don't jive with the way I see things (again, all opinion, but my opinion is the best one, dammit!)

[dineke]

Rios was let go by JP.

[Boxcar]

Also, correct me if I'm wrong but JPR was the one who dumped Rios.

[Deadpool]

Rios was let go by JP.

 

Also, correct me if I'm wrong but JPR was the one who dumped Rios.

 

I thought that sounded odd, timing wise, but what am I gunna do? google something?

[ElNik2013]

I don't fault JPR for letting go of Rios, I blame the way the organization is run. Same applies to AA on Yunel Escobar. These are public-relations decisions above the GM. Blame whomever the president was in 2009 for Rios.

 

Also, AA wasn't the GM in 2009 when Jenkins and Paxton were drafted. The Jays ended up getting Stroman for Beede, not too shabby.

 

Yes, fire the guy, but a fairer and more accurate case can be made. Nice try I guess.

[Slot Machine]

Its not like we don't already have a thread for ripping on AA. Edited May 3, 2014 by Slot Machine

[Stangstag]

"-Letting Rajai Davis go via Free Agency and replacing him with Moises Sierra, whom he has now lost via waivers to the Chi Sox. Davis brings an element of speed to the lineup, and currently leads the Tigers in AVG and SB."

 

 

Davis wanted to be a starter, he was never going to come here as a backup outfielder.

[Cooler Heads Prevail]

I don't fault JPR for letting go of Rios, I blame the way the organization is run. Same applies to AA on Yunel Escobar. These are public-relations decisions above the GM. Blame whomever the president was in 2009 for Rios.

 

Also, AA wasn't the GM in 2009 when Jenkins and Paxton were drafted. The Jays ended up getting Stroman for Beede, not too shabby.

 

Yes, fire the guy, but a fairer and more accurate case can be made. Nice try I guess.

 

Rios makes $12.5M a year and was on that fairly hefty contract with the Jays. He was no bargain, so dropping him was hardly a black mark on any GM's resume. I have a feeling Napoli might have been a budget related move too, they were paring dollars.

Edited May 3, 2014 by Cooler Heads Prevail

[Flashman]

Any more I forgot for mistakes boys?

 

The hiring of John Farrell, which I consider his biggest mistake.

 

There was a lot of talk about the hiring process - hundreds of candidates, a big board of names to be whittled down, second and third and fourth interviews, etc. And in the end he hired the wrong man. This was supposed to be the fellow who worked simpatico with AA and would help oversee the new Blue Jays dynasty in the years to come. His game management was unspectacular, he didn't seem to see eye to eye with AA, and then he wrangled his way out.

 

That AA then went to Gibbons - the safe, grateful, anti-Farrell candidate - says more about AA than Gibbon's abilities methinks.

[GNick]

I think he gave Happ his contract, don't think he inherited it. Halladay trade he also tossed in 6 million. But overall, yeah AA has to be on thin ice.

[Glock]

Who cares if Emilio f***face is hitting .343 and has 10 SB, he's going to regress (like others have said before) make 34 errors and be hitting .228 at the end of the year

[GD]

Merge please.

[Boxcar]

Merge please.

 

Or just delete this one altogether

[G-Snarls]

I think he gave Happ his contract, don't think he inherited it. Halladay trade he also tossed in 6 million. But overall, yeah AA has to be on thin ice.

 

Correct

 

Happ was in arb years

 

AA extended him

[Atothe]

James Paxton not signing was 100% Paul beeston's fault. Plus Jpr was the lame duck gm. Aaron hill played like s***, that was a challenge trade. Alex Rios had run his course here.