BlueJays fielders have saved runs compared to an average defense each year since 2004

[Angrioter]

 

BlueJays fielders have saved runs compared to an average defense each year since 2004

[Angrioter]

JPA, Boni, Izturis contributed positively!!!

[G-Snarls]

JPA, Boni, Izturis contributed positively!!!

 

Obvs not. MacDonald, Buck, Hill, Escobar, Rasmus, Lawrie, et al have helped cover up for them and those like them in mean stats.

 

(P.S. I know you were kidding)

[G-Snarls]

Difficult to believe. Our defense was so bad last year. They didn't get to anything.

 

Lawrie (and Rajai LOL) did

[Atothe]

Difficult to believe. Our defense was so bad last year. They didn't get to anything.

 

You're telling no one on that team got to anything?

[G-Snarls]

You're telling no one on that team got to anything?

 

I guess every ball got through

 

(Joking aside, we are skewed by how bad Melky, JPA and Bonifacio were. We had several plus defenders last year)

 

Edit: Oh, and we're not the only team with some bad defenders.

[flafson]

Where is the full link for that?

[BabbaGanoush]

2013 = -25.1 UZR

2012 = -17.3 UZR

2011 = -14.5 UZR

2010 = -0.9 UZR

2009 = -40.8 UZR

 

Weird that it disagrees so consistently with DRS.

 

The fielding bible guys don't use numbers do they? Don't they just watch all the plays and determine if the play was below average, average or above average?

[jaysfan2014]

Cardinals were even worse than the Jays in UZR at -49.4.. part of the reason the Cards traded Freese away for Bourjos, moved Carpenter back to 3rd and installed Wong/Ellis at 2nd for 2014.

[jaysfan2014]

Royals had the best UZR.. yet they couldn't make the playoffs. Out of the 10 best by UZR, only Tampa, LA and Boston made the playoffs. Cardinals were 27th.. yet made it to the World Series.

[fatcowxlive]

Going by what I saw, only JPA/Melky/2B was s***. Reyes, Bautista, Lind/EE were average and Rasmus + Lawrie were above average.

 

I think I might be blind or bad at knowing what's good from bad (I can only compare what I see to previous Jays seasons) because only Rasmus was above average defensively, Boni + Bautista + Lawrie are all about average and everyone else is s*** according to Fangraphs.

 

Then again I'm starting to question UZR because JP's 3rd best (though I know it doesn't take some parts of catching into account) and our worst fielders are EE and Lind (which cannot be true)

[Olerud363]

Royals had the best UZR.. yet they couldn't make the playoffs. Out of the 10 best by UZR, only Tampa, LA and Boston made the playoffs. Cardinals were 27th.. yet made it to the World Series.

 

If that is accurate it just goes to show you how stupid the Jays front office is and how smart the Cardinals are.

 

Cards were almost last in homeruns, apparently close to last in defense yet scored 783 runs and only gave up 596. If you are a perfect team (which no one ever has been) you win 120. Otherwise it is a task of accepting the lesser imperfection.

 

The cardinals just try to solve the puzzle. It is a puzzle that cannot be solved perfectly but the goal is to maximize runs scored - runs against.

 

Take Matt Carpenter. Never played a game at second in the minors. But the cards configure their talent to optimize wins. Carpenter goes to 2nd. Mediocre (though not horrible) on D. Cards stick with him. He produces 5 or 6 WAR based on O alone and standing his own on D.

 

Jays talk "track team". Decide to move Lawrie to second, then move him off second after a sample size of 10 or less plays, and now are apparently going with Ryan Goins because the drunk scouts (that didn't like Chapman after 1 bullpen session) think Goins looks like a second basemen.

 

Cards - complicated multi parameter formulation designed to solve the ultimate equation - runs scored vs. runs against.

 

Jays - Track Team!!!!

[jaysfan2014]

Well, Goins had a 6.2 UZR at 2B last year. He's a significant upgrade defensively at 2B as is.. with the bat, not so much, depending what Seitzer does with him. Sierra and Pillar, amazingly, are better than Cabrera defensively in the outfield right now, depending on Cabrera's recovery from surgery. Gose stinks anywhere in the outfield as it stands.. he needs a lot of work in CF..

[jaysfan2014]

Good thing the Cardinals pitching and their offense led them to a World Series.. they had several bad outfielders defensively in Carlos Beltran, Matt Holliday and Jon Jay. And David Freese was so awful defensively that the Cards did the right thing by trading him to the Angels for Peter Bourjos.

[Olerud363]

Good thing the Cardinals pitching and their offense led them to a World Series.. they had several bad outfielders defensively in Carlos Beltran, Matt Holliday and Jon Jay. And David Freese was so awful defensively that the Cards did the right thing by trading him to the Angels for Peter Bourjos.

 

My frustration is with this organization that seems to care only about their preconcieved notions of what a "baseball" player should be and do not care about winning.

 

We have a president who is weirdly obsessed with a track team. The team is set to go with Ryan Goins at second, admittedly good on D, but the total package is not good. Absolutely no creative solutions for this.

 

Then we have the example of the Cardinals. A team with horrible D, but who are great anyway because of creative positional flexibility, good offense, good pitching. More than one way to skin a cat.

[Olerud363]

Well, Goins had a 6.2 UZR at 2B last year. He's a significant upgrade defensively at 2B as is.. with the bat, not so much, depending what Seitzer does with him. Sierra and Pillar, amazingly, are better than Cabrera defensively in the outfield right now, depending on Cabrera's recovery from surgery. Gose stinks anywhere in the outfield as it stands.. he needs a lot of work in CF..

 

This is all still small sample size. The trends may bear out but Gose has always been heralded as a top shelf defensive center fielder, while Goins hasn't been on the radar either way.

 

1 year ago no one was saying Ryan Goins would be the type of player who's D can carry him, while Gose not only won't hit, but won't have the D to make up for it.

 

This might all be true. Time will tell.