GDT - World Series Game 3: Boston Red Sox @ St. Louis Cardinals (Peavy vs Kelly)

[Stangstag]

Well the bar I was at was filled with Boston Haters..fun times. But that loss is all on Salty..imagine what would have been the reaction had JP chucked that ball into left field during the playoffs

 

Not really fair. Salty made a decent throw, it just happened to hit Craig's arm.

[Caper]

It could have gone either way IMO. Middlebrooks did have a good reason for lying on the basepath (fielding the throw), his placement there was inadvertent. It's then about the leg raise Middlebrooks made, and I'm not sure if that's enough. There's not much in terms of precedent.

 

Edit: Yeah it now seems clearer after watching a few more times. Middlebrooks took up the whole baseline with his legs raised. Craig had nowhere to go.

 

 

Actually, I didn't think he took up any of the baseline at all. He was in his path... but that wasn't the baseline. I really don't know enough about the rule to be able to say for sure if that was the right call or not... seems a bit subjective.. So I guess it's the right call.

[John_Havok]

The MLB rulebook mentions one example in the obstruction section it states

 

OBSTRUCTION is the act of a fielder who, while not in possession of the ball and not in the act of fielding the ball, impedes the progress of any runner. If a fielder is about to receive a thrown ball and if the ball is in flight directly toward and near enough to the fielder so he must occupy his position to receive the ball he may be considered "in the act of fielding a ball." It is entirely up to the judgment of the umpire as to whether a fielder is in the act of fielding a ball. After a fielder has made an attempt to field a ball and missed, he can no longer be in the "act of fielding" the ball. For example: an infielder dives at a ground ball and the ball passes him and he continues to lie on the ground and delays the progress of the runner, he very likely has obstructed the runner.

 

The last part of it though, the umpire has to use his discretion and judge whether or not the runner would have advanced safely if the play had gone on without obstruction.

 

For example, if that play had happened the exact same way but the throw home beat the runner by 20 feet, the umpire could have called him out, even with obstruction. IN this case, since it was a semi-close play at home, the home plate ump ruled that the runner would have scored if he had not been obstructed.

[ace3113]

Just think over all of our last few 1st rounders besides 2012. Jenkins, McGuire, Cooper, Snider, JPA, Beede, Bickford. Ugh

 

If you could change one pick in AA's tenure at GM which would it be and would it make a difference?

 

Ironically, his first pick (Deck) may end up being his worst. McGuire over Sale was a questionable call from the moment it was made. I remember almost everyone on the forum I was on at the time losing it. That's probably the pick that would have made all the difference. Then again if he was a Jay we probably would have tried to tweak his delivery, baby his innings, and eventually schedule him former Tommy John. Sigh.

[Abomination]

If you could change one pick in AA's tenure at GM which would it be and would it make a difference?

 

Ironically, his first pick (Deck) may end up being his worst. McGuire over Sale was a questionable call from the moment it was made. I remember almost everyone on the forum I was on at the time losing it. That's probably the pick that would have made all the difference. Then again if he was a Jay we probably would have tried to tweak his delivery, baby his innings, and eventually schedule him former Tommy John. Sigh.

 

The forum was pretty split between wanting Josh Sale and Chris Sale though if I remember right. Josh would have been a bigger error than Deck was (I actually still think Deck may end up a major league caliber starter, although probably back of the rotation).

[Abomination]

The last part of it though, the umpire has to use his discretion and judge whether or not the runner would have advanced safely if the play had gone on without obstruction.

 

For example, if that play had happened the exact same way but the throw home beat the runner by 20 feet, the umpire could have called him out, even with obstruction. IN this case, since it was a semi-close play at home, the home plate ump ruled that the runner would have scored if he had not been obstructed.

 

The part that was quoted says that it's up to the ump's judgement on whether the fielder obstructed the runner, not on whether the runner would have been safe without the obstruction. I didn't read it from the rulebook though, so maybe it says more about that elsewhere.

[BlueJayWay]

Clearly obstruction. Intent doesn't matter.

 

Although of course if the Jays lost a game on a play like that, it would suck.

[GD]

Although of course if the Jays lost a game on a play like that, it would suck.

 

And you just know we totally would have.

[GeorgiaPeach]

This is probably the best night of Grant's life.

 

Whatever happened to that f***ing tool?

[GeorgiaPeach]

Obvious obstruction. f*** the cheating Red Sox - first Lester's doctoring of the ball in Game 1, now this. And f*** Farrell for encouraging cheap tactics like that. So glad Jim Joyce actually had the balls to make a crucial call against the Sox.

 

I guess you missed it where a couple currently playing and a non-playing analyst, besides Harold Reynolds agreed that pretty much every pitcher in baseball uses something.

[G-Snarls]

Man.. Kolten Wong, that's incredible. That's insane. Janssen+ please. Get him here Rosenthal.

 

Yes yes

[G-Snarls]

Damnit Kozma you terminally useless f***

 

He may be the reason they won't trade Wong though

[G-Snarls]

I'm actually kind of surprised Craig even advanced to third much less home.

 

#TrueCardinal bro

[G-Snarls]

What a tool. Craig tripping on Middlebrooks is undeniable.

 

Also, Middlebrooks is terrible. Not because of this bad luck play obviously. But I'm continuously surprised by how many balls he fails to get to that many other third basemen would. Oh, and the .271 OBP doesn't help his cause much.

Edited October 27, 2013 by G-Snarls

[jays_fever]

Also, Middlebrooks is terrible. Not because of this bad luck play obviously. But I'm continuously surprised by how many balls he fails to get to that many other third basemen would. Oh, and the .271 OBP doesn't help his cause much.

 

Honestly I dont know why people are blaming that on him. Salty pulled a JP..chucked that ball down the line for the loss. Even a perfect throw has no shot at beating him and he threw it into the runner

[ElNik2013]

If I were Matheny, I'd rip into my team after this game, including myself and Oquendo. They almost blew this game, it really shouldn't have been as close as it was.

 

Molina should've been sent home in the 4th, Ellsbury had no shot to throw him out and Kozma and Kelly were up next. They should've added a run in the 7th, but blew it. Siegrist should've pitched to at least Ellsbury in the 8th.

[HERPDERP]

What a first - Keith Law admitting he's wrong.

 

Of course, he insults other twitterers first.

[G-Snarls]

Honestly I dont know why people are blaming that on him. Salty pulled a JP..chucked that ball down the line for the loss. Even a perfect throw has no shot at beating him and he threw it into the runner

 

I'm not blaming Middlebrooks one bit for what happened in the 9th inning last night. I agree, Salty should not have made that throw.

 

I just don't think Middlebrooks looks like a legit major league 3B.

[G-Snarls]

If I were Matheny, I'd rip into my team after this game, including myself and Oquendo. They almost blew this game, it really shouldn't have been as close as it was.

 

Molina should've been sent home in the 4th, Ellsbury had no shot to throw him out and Kozma and Kelly were up next. They should've added a run in the 7th, but blew it. Siegrist should've pitched to at least Ellsbury in the 8th.

 

Yep. They were crazy lucky to win this game. So many times they failed to pad their lead (where's that BA with RISP now?!?!?!) and they almost gave up several extra runs to Boston.

[KingKat]

I'm not blaming Middlebrooks one bit for what happened in the 9th inning last night. I agree, Salty should not have made that throw.

 

I just don't think Middlebrooks looks like a legit major league 3B.

 

Think Cecchini takes over next year? If not they can always trade for David Freese.

[KingKat]

Great, uncharacteristically short, column by Joe Posnanski on the whole Red Sox fiasco:

 

http://joeposnanski.com/joeblogs/let-the-players-decide/

[jays_fever]

Great, uncharacteristically short, column by Joe Posnanski on the whole Red Sox fiasco:

 

http://joeposnanski.com/joeblogs/let-the-players-decide/

 

"It is not often that you see a manager make a move, especially in the World Series, that is inarguably stupid.

 

It’s hard to believe that somebody, anybody, didn’t stop him from doing it."

 

Referencing letting Wokrman hit during the 9th

[G-Snarls]

Think Cecchini takes over next year? If not they can always trade for David Freese.

 

Naw. Trade Lawrie for Farrell!

 

#BringBackFarrell

[G-Snarls]

[G-Snarls]

[G-Snarls]

[ElNik2013]

Great, uncharacteristically short, column by Joe Posnanski on the whole Red Sox fiasco:

 

http://joeposnanski.com/joeblogs/let-the-players-decide/

 

 

 

He made some good points, including the one about NOT walking Jay to load the bases. I remember I was typing a post here about it, but forgot the reasoning as to why Jay should've been walked to load the bases, lol, I had gone to bed believing the freakin' red sox had been gift-wrapped another game.

[ElNik2013]

 

 

 

I expect the Red Sox to pummel Lynn tonight, they have nothing to lose, they know the Tigers should've swept and the Cards have played like crap in 2 of the first 3 games.

[Boxcar]

Well the bar I was at was filled with Boston Haters..fun times. But that loss is all on Salty..imagine what would have been the reaction had JP chucked that ball into left field during the playoffs

 

"And I'd do it again because that's how I play"