Can Ryan Goins stick?

[Smokey]

Other than last year,his minor league stats aren't that bad, so i don't know wtf you are talking about. Also the situation could be different this year with Seitzer. I'm not saying he will succeed, but he has to be given a few months. The only reason he's getting a shot is because of the shut down defense he brings and AA's unwillingness to spend on an upgrade. Just sit back and let it play out.

 

 

So the same guy who wrote off Yu Darvish after just 4 ST innings now thinks Goins' struggles aren't indicative of anything and that he "has to be" handed a starting job. lol

[Smokey]

Link?

 

http://www.forums.mlb.com/n/pfx/forum.aspx?tsn=25&nav=messages&webtag=ml-bluejays&tid=80266

[G-Snarls]

Dinger using Wins.

 

Yet still wins the debate:

 

Dr_Dinger

Posts:18086

Nibbles too much = Ks Tulo and Cargo three times each in the same game

 

Nibble away. He's going to K 200+, probably have an ERA around 3 with a solid K/BB and 15+ wins.

[flafson]

Lol that too.

 

Please create a formula to show how awesome Goins is.

[flafson]

STFU meat........it's been thrown in your face since last September, get a f***ing clue. Goins is a lighter hitting J-Mac, you tards need to f*** off already.

 

Wow, talk about insecurity issues...

Goins forever or go home.

[theblujay]

This thread is the best

[theblujay]

I shudder to think of the terrible offseason that would lead to Ryan f***ing Goins being "the best option" at any position.

 

Lol

[gruber92]

So the same guy who wrote off Yu Darvish after just 4 ST innings now thinks Goins' struggles aren't indicative of anything and that he "has to be" handed a starting job. lol

 

Not that it matters but it was after 4 ST games,not innings. Secondly, Goins will provide the best internal value at 2B, regardless on how he hits. Lastly..

 

"Three times this spring. I'm not saying i'm a genie,but from what i see,his pitch count will be up for the most part. I'll gladly eat my words if he proves me wrong,just stating my opinion. No point arguing at this point. Let's get at least 10 of his starts to digest first."

 

So whats the problem here?

[flafson]

Not that it matters but it was after 4 ST games,not innings. Secondly, Goins will provide the best internal value at 2B, regardless on how he hits. Lastly..

 

"Three times this spring. I'm not saying i'm a genie,but from what i see,his pitch count will be up for the most part. I'll gladly eat my words if he proves me wrong,just stating my opinion. No point arguing at this point. Let's get at least 10 of his starts to digest first."

 

So whats the problem here?

 

The problem is, you're anti main stream and they hate you for it.

[Smokey]

Not that it matters but it was after 4 ST games,not innings.

"For the record,it wasn't his first outing(second or third)and it was after 4 innings. Lol.."

 

 

Secondly, Goins will provide the best internal value at 2B, regardless on how he hits.

 

It's absolutely pathetic that he's the best option on a team with a $140M payroll and only an idiot would support such incompetence!

 

 

So whats the problem here?

 

Apparently 4 innings is enough of a sample size for you to claim Darvish "will eventually turn into Dice K" but when it comes to a s***** hitter like Goins, "he has to be given a few months" to prove himself despite not having shown any signs of being able to handle the bat.

[GD]

The problem is, you're anti main stream and they hate you for it.

 

The problem is, you're both wrong and we hate you for it.

[Olerud363]

The problem is, you're anti main stream and they hate you for it.

 

?? Gruber is not anti-mainstream. Gruber is mainstream. He is anti the "mainststeam" for this board. But the board in general is anti-mainstream.

 

Mainstream is still that joe scout can anounce how wonderful Goins' D is, and how his swing is actually good, and john hitting coach can tweak it a bit, and Goins is all of a sudden a scrappy wonderful defensive whiz who does the little things at the plate... or something like that.

 

At first I supported Gruber. Mainly because there is a grain of truth to the view that Goins could be a good player. His defense could hold up and he could hit a bit better then we think. But that is only a possibilty, not a probability. I figured Gruber was looking at some of the defensive stats and looking at more complex projection data like the 75th percentile projections, and things like that. But after reading his posts it seems he gets his info from Howarth and Buck Martinez.

[gruber92]

"For the record,it wasn't his first outing(second or third)and it was after 4 innings. Lol.."

 

 

 

 

It's absolutely pathetic that he's the best option on a team with a $140M payroll and only an idiot would support such incompetence!

 

 

 

 

Apparently 4 innings is enough of a sample size for you to claim Darvish "will eventually turn into Dice K" but when it comes to a s***** hitter like Goins, "he has to be given a few months" to prove himself despite not having shown any signs of being able to handle the bat.

 

Where did i say i support AA's incompetence? I just stated that if there is only an x amount of dollars available to spend, i'd rather spend it on two starting pitchers than spend it on a second baseman. We have a decent enough offense to carry an all defensive position while adding to starting pitching.

 

As far as Darvish is concerned, i provided a quote i made, with great thanks btw for digging that up. What more do i have to say? I WAS WRONG ABOUT DARVISH. Do you think it bothers me to admit when i'm wrong? Maybe that's the difference between yourself and many others here. I view and project the game different from most of you on here, mainly because of the age difference. So i have to be hated for having an opinion? Hate Goins all you want, i don't give a f***. Can't i state that i think Goins has a shot at developing into an average bat and not get crucified for it?

[gruber92]

Gruber...........you've been raped here. Poor soul just admit you're wrong, and bias.

 

Bro, i could give a f***. How old are you again?

[Sammy225]

So the f***tards thinking Ricky was fixed are now shut up for the time being how can we shut this f*** wagon down now.

[KingKat]

So i have to be hated for having an opinion? Hate Goins all you want, i don't give a f***. Can't i state that i think Goins has a shot at developing into an average bat and not get crucified for it?

 

You can state whatever opinion you want but don't rage when people bring you evidence to the contrary. You're the source of 90% of the antagonism ITT but you talk as if you're being crussified. You want out of your hole? Stop digging.

[Jays]

You want out of your hole?

 

I thought you were going somewhere completely else with this one. LOL!

[flafson]

So have we decided yet if Ryan Goins can stick?

 

Depends who you ask.

[gruber92]

You can state whatever opinion you want but don't rage when people bring you evidence to the contrary. You're the source of 90% of the antagonism ITT but you talk as if you're being crussified. You want out of your hole? Stop digging.

 

Evidence to the contrary? How about we wait a few months into the season so this evidence becomes valid. Yeah, yeah "but his milb numbers". How about we just f***ing wait. How about the over / under 1 WAR that BTS set? What do you think? Put your money where your mouth is.

[KingKat]

Evidence to the contrary? How about we wait a few months into the season so this evidence becomes valid. Yeah, yeah "but his milb numbers". How about we just f***ing wait. How about the over / under 1 WAR that BTS set? What do you think? Put your money where your mouth is.

 

See this kind of a man up talk is exactly what I'm talking about when I say you're talking out both sides of your mouth. You get all aggressive until you move the goal posts and suddenly decide that you're a victim and everyone's being unfair to you and that all you ever did was emit an opinion.

 

I feel like the idea that you have to put your money where your mouth is to have an opinion rather childish. I'd rather judge an opinion based on its factual basis. That being said I like my odds on under 1 WAR. If there's no playing time clause, I'd take you up on that.

[Sammy225]

I had hope, but I am a f***tard!!

 

No you were just praying lol

[KingKat]

He couldn't give a f***, how old are you again?

 

Thirty-eight.

[gruber92]

See this kind of a man up talk is exactly what I'm talking about when I say you're talking out both sides of your mouth. You get all aggressive until you move the goal posts and suddenly decide that you're a victim and everyone's being unfair to you and that all you ever did was emit an opinion.

 

I feel like the idea that you have to put your money where your mouth is to have an opinion rather childish. I'd rather judge an opinion based on its factual basis. That being said I like my odds on under 1 WAR. If there's no playing time clause, I'd take you up on that.

 

Done. If he gets hurt and is under 1 WAR at the time, we'll just use a reliable projection system to come up with his final numbers.

[KingKat]

Done. If he gets hurt and is under 1 WAR at the time, we'll just use a reliable projection system to come up with his final numbers.

 

What are we betting?

[KingKat]

Who's dick is bigger, obviously?!?!

 

What do I win?

[gruber92]

Found this right on the first page. And to my surprise you two have been arguing about this since August, lol. Glad its settled now.

 

You see? If people didn't have such short memories, all this could of been avoided. Too many small people using this board to be big.

[gruber92]

What are we betting?

 

Whatever you feel is sufficient. I'm easy.

[Sammy225]

I did that back here somehwere lol

 

in the 138pages worth of anarchy

[gruber92]

PLEASE...that's your opinion.

 

Nah. It's in black and white, first page.

[Sammy225]

I have to laugh at NJHs response on the front page:

 

"I shudder to think of the terrible offseason that would lead to Ryan f***ing Goins being "the best option" at any position."

 

And here we are!