Possible Trade and Free Agent Scenarios

[o2cui2i]

I agree that this is the route he'll take, and in general I think it's doable. The only problem is that it's still AA making the moves going forward.

 

I think the key for AA is trying to distinguish the unlucky (Reyes injury, maybe Dickey if he's more injured than we think, etc) from the bad (JPA as starting catcher, no depth).

 

throw Bumfiasco and Izturis in the s***** box with JPA. AA summed up his baseball IQ when he said that the Miami deal hinged on Bumfiasco. he's been just as oblivious and arrogant as JPA. add Lawrie's mental break down showing his lust for personal numbers, he's firmly shoved himself in the oblivious box as well.

 

AA/Beeston/scouting staff have shown themselves wanting.

[DuckDuckGose]

As has been said since the trades, there is no going back in this kind of way. Players that are under contract here until at least 2015 (Dickey, Reyes, Bautista, Lawrie, EE, Morrow & Buehrle) are not going to be moved this year IMO (the possible exception being Izturis who we might hand the $7M he is owed to leave). It will be a question of adding to that and moving the pieces that aren't under contract that will happen. He's got to stick with that core and try and prove that he wasn't wrong.

 

I couldn't agree more. AA will not tear down this core he will retool and try again next year. If the Jays are still way out of it at the deadline AA should trade off some vets and make space for Gose and the young pitchers to get playing time. There is no reason to lose 90 games this year and not know what your young talent can bring to the table next season.

 

AA has always said the goal was always 3 trips to the playoffs over the next 5 years (well basically 4 now). The Jays were always better primed to contend in 2014 when their pitching depth (Hutch, Drabek, Perez, Nolin, Stroman, Stilson, Jenkins) are actually ready to step in to MLB roles and young and AA has another offseason to add complementary pieces in FA. Obviously trying to go from a fringe .500 team to a WS contender didn't work, it's time for AA to take a step back and say, "My team needs changes to contend. What do I need to add to my team's core (EE, Jose, Dickey, Morrow, Reyes, Lawrie, Buehrle) to get there?"

[Angrioter]

As has been said since the trades, there is no going back in this kind of way. Players that are under contract here until at least 2015 (Dickey, Reyes, Bautista, Lawrie, EE, Morrow & Buehrle) are not going to be moved this year IMO (the possible exception being Izturis who we might hand the $7M he is owed to leave). It will be a question of adding to that and moving the pieces that aren't under contract that will happen. He's got to stick with that core and try and prove that he wasn't wrong.

 

I couldn't agree more. AA will not tear down this core he will retool and try again next year. If the Jays are still way out of it at the deadline AA should trade off some vets and make space for Gose and the young pitchers to get playing time. There is no reason to lose 90 games this year and not know what your young talent can bring to the table next season.

 

AA has always said the goal was always 3 trips to the playoffs over the next 5 years (well basically 4 now). The Jays were always better primed to contend in 2014 when their pitching depth (Hutch, Drabek, Perez, Nolin, Stroman, Stilson, Jenkins) are actually ready to step in to MLB roles and young and AA has another offseason to add complementary pieces in FA. Obviously trying to go from a fringe .500 team to a WS contender didn't work, it's time for AA to take a step back and say, "My team needs changes to contend. What do I need to add to my team's core (EE, Jose, Dickey, Morrow, Reyes, Lawrie, Buehrle) to get there?"

 

 

Modify the existing model is the best option.

 

C - JPA

1B - EE/Lind

2B - Alguien util

3B - Lawrie

SS - Reyes

OF - Bautista

OF - Rasmus

OF -Melky or Gose

4th OF - Rajai

 

SP

SP - Morrow

SP - Dicey

SP

SP - Happ

 

Depth SP: Hutchison, Drabek, Romero, Nolin, Tepera, McGuire and Jenkins

 

 

Trade Buehrle, JJ and Melky

[TheHurl]

I agree that this is the route he'll take, and in general I think it's doable. The only problem is that it's still AA making the moves going forward.

 

I think the key for AA is trying to distinguish the unlucky (Reyes injury, maybe Dickey if he's more injured than we think, etc) from the bad (JPA as starting catcher, no depth).

 

It's not going to be easy. I compared them to the 2008 Tigers in the off-season (made two big trades and fell apart completely). Unfortunately, I know we don't have a Verlander on the team and we didn't trade for Miggy but essentially it took them two seasons to decide to move Granderson, who was one of the contributing pieces (was set to be a free agent) and while it didn't work out of them right away, it ended up saving them the payroll, make the playoffs and then could resume spending stupidly. That's really the best case scenario for the Jays. They make minor moves, luck into a playoff spot and then can stupidly spend their way through this.

[GD]

- Rasmus plus Lind to KC for Hosmer at the deadline

- Jose Reyes to Detroit for Nick Castellanos

- Jose Bautista to Texas for Profar

- Bonifacio plus Buehrle to StL for Wong

Makes the team alot younger and alot CHEAPER. Gives us flexability to sign a power bat and decent pitcher in the offseason.

 

-for reasons listed above not happening

-not happening

-maybe, not sure if that's beneficial for both sides

-wat

 

 

We need to be buying low on struggling guys with potential like Dustin Ackley, Justin Smoak, Hosmer's a good bet but I don't think they'll trade him, Ike Davis, etc.

[DuckDuckGose]

Modify the existing model is the best option.

 

C - JPA

1B - EE/Lind

2B - Alguien util

3B - Lawrie

SS - Reyes

OF - Bautista

OF - Rasmus

OF -Melky or Gose

4th OF - Rajai

 

SP

SP - Morrow

SP - Dicey

SP

SP - Happ

 

Depth SP: Hutchison, Drabek, Romero, Nolin, Tepera, McGuire and Jenkins

 

 

Trade Buehrle, JJ and Melky

 

IMO the Jays will need to improve at C, SP and in the MIF which can be addressed in several ways. In FA the Jays should be able to address the MIF but, there doesn't look to be a top flight pitcher or C on the FA market. IMO they will have to look to make a trade to improve those areas.

 

I wouldn't mind targeting a Gallardo and Lucroy package from MIL. It would cost a ton of talent but, the Brewers are desperate for young talent and the Jays are desperate to win now. They could line up well for a deal.

[GD]

I wouldn't mind targeting a Gallardo and Lucroy package from MIL. It would cost a ton of talent but, the Brewers are desperate for young talent and the Jays are desperate to win now. They could line up well for a deal.

 

If Melvin isn't a complete idiot, Lucroy should be really, really hard to get. He's unbelievable defensively.

[DuckDuckGose]

If Melvin isn't a complete idiot, Lucroy should be really, really hard to get. He's unbelievable defensively.

 

I think he would be very hard to pry away. They would also have to commit to a full rebuild if they moved both of those guys. I can't see MIL going that route at this point but, it is the direction they should go IMO.

[Stangstag]

Im just tired of watching this team fail. I would rather see a brand new team of young guys.

However, I don't think that AA will admit defeat. We will have to ride this gong show for another couple years until AA is fired.

[GD]

I think he would be very hard to pry away. They would also have to commit to a full rebuild if they moved both of those guys. I can't see MIL going that route at this point but, it is the direction they should go IMO.

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2013/06/trade-candidate-yovani-gallardo.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook

 

I think they're gonna rebuild around Braun, Segura Gomez and Lucroy.

 

Lucroy is valuable enough to me that I'd consider an Osuna+ for Lucroy trade a pretty decent win for us.

[GD]

Milwaukee has some good players, I think they should trade for an ace (similar to the Greinke trade) and go for it again.

 

Not many teams can match the offensive foundation of Braun, Aramis, Gomez, Segura, Aoki, Lucroy. That's six really good players.

 

Their pitching is just so f***ing bad, though, didn't they have CHRIS NARVESON at some point?

[DustyBaker]

If Melvin isn't a complete idiot, Lucroy should be really, really hard to get. He's unbelievable defensively.

 

I doubt that would ever happen- Melvin likely values Lucroy much higher than AA does, purely because AA woudnt recognize his pitch framing/defensive abilities.

[DuckDuckGose]

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2013/06/trade-candidate-yovani-gallardo.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook

 

I think they're gonna rebuild around Braun, Segura Gomez and Lucroy.

 

Lucroy is valuable enough to me that I'd consider an Osuna+ for Lucroy trade a pretty decent win for us.

 

If Osuna and Gose was enough to start a package for Lucroy and Gallardo I wouldn't let Melvin hang up. Having a solid C would help this team more than any other position, they are just so involved in the game and JPA is terrible.

 

IMO MIL should look to move Hart, Lohse, Gallardo, Aramis, and Weeks sometime before the 2014 season. If that's the route they are going moving Lucroy while he is playing well and has a few years of control (FA in 2016 which would be before their window of contention) for a haul while they can makes some sense.

[Mike_Wilner]

2014 lineup

 

C - McCann/ JPA

1B - Morales

2B - Kinsler

3B - Lawrie

SS - Reyes

OF - Bautista

OF - Rasmus

OF - Melky

 

 

SP - Garza

SP - Morrow

SP - Dickey

SP - Buehrle

SP - Happ

[GD]

I doubt that would ever happen- Melvin likely values Lucroy much higher than AA does, purely because AA woudnt recognize his pitch framing/defensive abilities.

 

I'm not sure how smart Melvin is, that's the key here.

 

If Osuna and Gose was enough to start a package for Lucroy and Gallardo I wouldn't let Melvin hang up. Having a solid C would help this team more than any other position, they are just so involved in the game and JPA is terrible.

 

this. That would be a great trade.

 

They play in the NL. All they need is an ace, a #4 and another good reliever and huzzah they're in contention.

 

They don't have the ammo to trade for a Cliff Lee. That's why they need a rebuild, they can't really obtain any larger pieces, they're a bit stuck.

[Daniel Labude]

2014 lineup

 

C - McCann/ JPA

1B - Morales

2B - Kinsler

3B - Lawrie

SS - Reyes

OF - Bautista

OF - Rasmus

OF - Melky

 

 

SP - Garza

SP - Morrow

SP - Dickey

SP - Buehrle

SP - Happ

 

Replace Gose for one of the outfielders and that seems pretty good team. Id say Hutchison in place of Happ as well.

[Mike_Wilner]

Gose can be a 5 tool player one day, and he has all the potential in the world, but he hasn't hit over .200 in games that take place on a high holiday and that concerns me because there's a pretty big jewish fanbase in Toronto and don't forget the Yankees are in the AL East as well.

[Mike_Wilner]

1) Wrench

2) Hammer

3) Saw

4) Screwdriver

5) Shovel

[GD]

Gose can be a 5 tool player one day, and he has all the potential in the world, but he hasn't hit over .200 in games that take place on a high holiday and that concerns me because there's a pretty big jewish fanbase in Toronto and don't forget the Yankees are in the AL East as well.

 

You just made my day, lol.

[TheHurl]

Modify the existing model is the best option. Fine I'll play. I'm just not sure if I'm supposed to think like someone who knows baseball or am I supposed to think like AA:cool:

 

C - JPA (back up Thole, minor league Jimenez) 2 on 25, 3 on 40

1B/DH - EE/Lind For the $5M difference it's looking more and more like they should be picking up the Lind Option. Unless someone comes for him at the deadline. Don't care if anyone else on the 40 man 4, 5

2B - Izturis (sorry he's probably here), Kawasaki 6, 7

3B - Lawrie, youngish utility guy that can play 3B, 2B and maybe 1B perferably with options...I'll say trade some bullpen piece for Freddy Galvis but Negrych could be this choice too. 8, 9

SS - Reyes...Kawasaki backing him and Goins in Buffalo as the first choice if Reyes gets injured. 9, 11

RF - Bautista 10, 12

CF - Gose (Rasmus traded this year at the deadline makes so much sense for this team, hopefully the media can get behind it so AA ins't worried about the optics...Major league ready young pitcher in return). 11, 13

LF -Melky 12, 14

4th OF - While Rajai is a platoon option for Gose, I'd rather see a couple cheaper options who are better defensively but still kick ass against lefties. So many other teams have this guy (Gentry in Texas, Pollock in Arizona, Barnes in Houston, Denorfia in SD). Minor league options are more difficult. Sierra is out of options after this year and should only be offered a minor league deal which he might not get. Adding Pillar to the 40 man a year before he needs to be makes no sense to me but he's probably the best 4th OF option if they have an injury. 13, 16

 

SP1 - Dickey (pitching like a number 1 or not I don't see us going out looking for a true number 1)

SP - Morrow

SP - Buehrle (won't get anything in trade)

SP - Happ

SP - whoever we traded Rasmus for.

 

Depth SP on the 40 man - Hutchison, Drabek, Nolin, McGuire and Jenkins...would like to see at least one more name added to this list. 18, 27

Closer - Janssen

set up - Cecil, Santos (if Santos isn't healthy cut ties)

Middle - Delabar, McGowan, Loup,

Long - Rogers, Lincoln

Minors - 1 guy no more. If it's wagner that's fine you can seek guys somewhere along the way. I want to see relievers with options not vets. 25, 36 (that's 4 spots to play with but I'm sure I've missed guys and there must be someone other than just Deck that needs to be added this year)

 

Cut ties with Rasmus (trade), Bonifacio (trade), DeRosa (retire), Oliver (retire), Davis (let walk or if you can get anything for him at the deadline consider it), J. Perez (DFA, try and keep in the org), Storey, Redmond, Luis Perez (no options, no use), JJ (let walk, judge the market and consider giving him a qualifying offer), Weber, Gomez.

 

It's not any different of a team from this year, if anything it's worse but it's a better built team still just by getting rid of the guys that shouldn't be here.

[GD]

SP - whoever we traded Rasmus for.

 

Paxton plz.

[GD]

in an ideal world o' mine....

 

C - Brian McCann with Thole backing him up

1B - duh, EE

2B - Boni with Burns on the way

3B - Lawrie

LF - Melky

CF - Gose

RF - Bautista

DH - Corey Hart (obviously not full time)

 

SP1 - Dickey

SP 2 - Morrow

SP 3 - Buehrle

SP 4 - whoever we get for Arencibia

SP 5 - Hutchison

 

RP - Janssen

RP - Cecil

RP - Delabar

RP - McGowan

RP - Loup

RP - Lincoln

RP - Jesse Crain

 

Get rid of Boni (trade), Izzy (trade), Arencibia (trade), Lind (midseason trade), DeRosa (DFA), Blanco (cut), Rasmus (trade), etc. Don't know about the bench.

 

 

IF we're still trying to compete, that is.

[TheHurl]

Paxton plz.

 

Doesn't even have to be anyone with that much upside in my mind (and he's got a bad history with us). Justin Wilson from the Pirates is the kind of guy to target. Pirates know that his bad control will eventually catch up to him but his GB ability gets him out of some jams. He's almost guaranteed to be a great BP piece if he doesn't work out as a starter. Maybe JJ (can throw in Boni) would get him though. Pirates have a shot this year and have plenty of options coming through the pipe.

[GD]

Doesn't even have to be anyone with that much upside in my mind (and he's got a bad history with us). Justin Wilson from the Pirates is the kind of guy to target. Pirates know that his bad control will eventually catch up to him but his GB ability gets him out of some jams. He's almost guaranteed to be a great BP piece if he doesn't work out as a starter. Maybe JJ (can throw in Boni) would get him though. Pirates have a shot this year and have plenty of options coming through the pipe.

 

Pirates don't need Rasmus and if we're giving them JJ I want at Hansen.

[Abomination]

I think it's too early to really get a feel for a lot of this (for example whether Lind can maintain his new approach, whether Lawrie can pick it up again, whether Rasmus continues the recent trend of using the whole field or not, etc).

 

As of right now, the only really identifiable problem spots on the team are at C, 2b, and SP. Catcher can be solved with McCann (preferably) or possibly Ruiz. Assuming Zobrist's option is picked up, the 2b free agent market is terrible next year outside of Cano who will likely stay with the Yankees. I suppose we could gamble on Utley staying healthy too. The starter market is pretty slim, but Garza would be a nice fit. Resigning JJ would be a possibility too, and Halladay would look real nice if he returns from surgery in September with his normal velocity again. I don't think Kuroda would play outside of the Yankees, a west coast team, or Japan but Hudson could be interesting.

 

The way I see it, catcher should be filled on the FA market. 2B will probably have to be filled via trade, and pitcher may be fillable by either.

[GD]

Doesn't even have to be anyone with that much upside in my mind (and he's got a bad history with us). Justin Wilson from the Pirates is the kind of guy to target. Pirates know that his bad control will eventually catch up to him but his GB ability gets him out of some jams. He's almost guaranteed to be a great BP piece if he doesn't work out as a starter. Maybe JJ (can throw in Boni) would get him though. Pirates have a shot this year and have plenty of options coming through the pipe.

 

Just on the Wilson one, a couple ideas on Rasmus.

 

To the Phillies for Roman Quinn

To the Indians for Dillon Howard

To the White Sox for I don't even know what

To the Padres for Casey Kelly or something

[Angrioter]

Pirates don't need Rasmus and if we're giving them JJ I want at Hansen.

 

 

Alen Hanson and G- Polanco are gold

[DuckDuckGose]

Milwaukee has some good players, I think they should trade for an ace (similar to the Greinke trade) and go for it again.

 

Not many teams can match the offensive foundation of Braun, Aramis, Gomez, Segura, Aoki, Lucroy. That's six really good players.

 

What could they trade for an ace though? They don't have anything of real value outside of the 6 players you mentioned, Lohse and Gallardo.

[Stangstag]

2014 lineup

 

C - McCann/ JPA

1B - Morales

2B - Kinsler

3B - Lawrie

SS - Reyes

OF - Bautista

OF - Rasmus

OF - Melky

 

 

SP - Garza

SP - Morrow

SP - Dickey

SP - Buehrle

SP - Happ

 

LOL. I'll have whatever you're smoking, it must be some good s***. That is like a 160 million dollar payroll.

[GD]

Alen Hanson and G- Polanco are gold

 

I would take one of them for JJ.