General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2021)

[BigCecil]

Another Ray start. Just reached 1fWAR. Another 6 inning very decent outing.

 

HR/FB is 23%. wow. But i dont know that its bad luck? 3rd time through the order OPS against him is over .1000

 

He is doing fine but it would be great if he had a more effective change to work in over start. He is throwing CB 13% and change 3.7. It seems like with so much hard stuff eventually he misses spot and they are on time so square it up. The HR last night was 94 down in zone. Little too much center of plate but not a horrible pitch.

 

No idea what an extension is worth with him? 10-15 AAV 3 year? He comes with some risk. Does he have any more upside?

[G-Snarls]

Gausman at 3/48 would have been looking so amazing right now

 

Oh well

 

That's life

[Deadpool]

Gausman at 3/48 would have been looking so amazing right now

 

Oh well

 

That's life

 

Taijuan Walker would have been a solid re-sign as well, but I'm generally comfortable w/ our rotation right now surprisingly...

[John Balkabella]

I know it is asking alot, but, man, if you could just get another inning a game out of those starters.

[Laika]

Another Ray start. Just reached 1fWAR. Another 6 inning very decent outing.

 

HR/FB is 23%. wow. But i dont know that its bad luck? 3rd time through the order OPS against him is over .1000

 

He is doing fine but it would be great if he had a more effective change to work in over start. He is throwing CB 13% and change 3.7. It seems like with so much hard stuff eventually he misses spot and they are on time so square it up. The HR last night was 94 down in zone. Little too much center of plate but not a horrible pitch.

 

No idea what an extension is worth with him? 10-15 AAV 3 year? He comes with some risk. Does he have any more upside?

 

I think he does have more upside. The foundation is so strong - a lefty who can sit 95+ and get by throwing fastballs like 60% of the time. The guy literally only needs one more wrinkle in his repertoire to start limiting home runs. Just something, anything, to get the hitters off his fastball just a bit. Doesn't even have to be a changeup. And he has so much experience, he has used curveballs, changeups, and sinkers more often at various points in his career, so it's not like he is starting from scratch on anything; he knows what works and what doesn't, for him. Just go back to the lab in the offseason and find one more wrinkle.

[G-Snarls]

Cimber on MLB Network radio now

 

He arrived in Buffalo during the 8th inning and got to meet everyone

 

He's excited

 

He's available to go tonight

 

As an aside the interviewers going on about how awesome Pete Walker and Charlie Montoyo are

[wilko]

What the hell is Ben Wagner getting paid to do these days?

 

Look like a crackhead.

[wilko]

Another Ray start. Just reached 1fWAR. Another 6 inning very decent outing.

 

HR/FB is 23%. wow. But i dont know that its bad luck? 3rd time through the order OPS against him is over .1000

 

He is doing fine but it would be great if he had a more effective change to work in over start. He is throwing CB 13% and change 3.7. It seems like with so much hard stuff eventually he misses spot and they are on time so square it up. The HR last night was 94 down in zone. Little too much center of plate but not a horrible pitch.

 

No idea what an extension is worth with him? 10-15 AAV 3 year? He comes with some risk. Does he have any more upside?

 

Those sliders? curves? he was throwing in the dirt were pretty nasty at times. If he can get something like that going to mix up the hitters you'll see even more K's and less HR potentially.

[Dick_Pole]

I'd say Bo's is glorious (like he's the next H&S spokesperson). Gurriel's is dumb (and this is coming from a bald guy)

 

You should say the exact same thing at work except replace the former with some random white guy and the latter with a person of colour, especially a woman. Let's see what happens!

[Dick_Pole]

If the Jays can dump Grichuk this season, they only have 54.7M locked up in guaranteed contracts next season:

 

- Springer: $29.7M

- Ryu: $20M

- Gurriel: $5M

 

There is $75M coming off the books, including $12M for Roark, $5.5M for Yates, $4M for Tulo and a combined $7M for Yamaguchi, Phelps, Panik and Milone. That's nearly $30M in completely dead money right now.

 

Guerrero probably gets a big Arb 1 number and Teoscar probably gets a big Arb 2 number but Bichette is still on a minimum contract and Biggio's Arb 1 is probably fairly cheap.

 

The Jays have already shown a willingness to spend by getting a top flight free agent in each of the past two offseasons with Ryu and Springer and they even made it to the final three with Bauer.

 

This is arguably the greatest baseball free agent class of all time coming up. I'm ridiculously excited to see what they do with all the flexibility.

 

Now think on top of this, an exciting team and an entire city/country just aching to get back to the ballpark. 2022 payroll could top $200 million and attendance figures could challenge the World Series years.

[Spanky99]

You should say the exact same thing at work except replace the former with some random white guy and the latter with a person of colour, especially a woman. Let's see what happens!

 

But why?

[Dick_Pole]

But why?

 

It's a backhanded commentary on how white people's hair looks good/presentable/professional and how POC look bad/ridiculous/unprofessional by general beauty standards. It's one of those beefs that POC have, especially black women, about institutional racism and I can see their beef when it comes to job interviews and such.

 

Let's be honest, 90% of the commentary of "wow that guy has really f***ing dumb hair" in baseball is reserved for black/latino players and the other 10% for Josh Donaldson and Tim Lincecum.

[Spanky99]

It's a backhanded commentary on how white people's hair looks good/presentable/professional and how POC look bad/ridiculous/unprofessional by general beauty standards. It's one of those beefs that POC have, especially black women, about institutional racism and I can see their beef when it comes to job interviews and such.

 

Let's be honest, 90% of the commentary of "wow that guy has really f***ing dumb hair" in baseball is reserved for black/latino players and the other 10% for Josh Donaldson and Tim Lincecum.

 

lol... commenting on guys hair in the show on a baseball forum, is a far cry from walking into your workplace and commenting on people's f***ing hairstyle, nice reach Dick, there's no rhyme or reason for anyone to do that. Who was on H@S commercials recently in the NFL, that's right, POC.

[Dick_Pole]

lol... commenting on guys hair in the show on a baseball forum, is a far cry from walking into your workplace and commenting on people's f***ing hairstyle, nice reach Dick, there's no rhyme or reason for anyone to do that. Who was on H@S commercials recently in the NFL, that's right, POC.

 

Yeah but...just because the loud part is said loud and the quiet part is kept quiet doesn't really fix the issue. That's why I'm just saying the quiet part should be said out loud too. Two famous NFL players getting featured in a virtue signaling ad campaign to try to make a multinational corporation more money isn't exactly changing things. Anyways I don't care enough to make this a long conversation on a baseball forum so I'm just gonna tap out.

[Scion]

It's a backhanded commentary on how white people's hair looks good/presentable/professional and how POC look bad/ridiculous/unprofessional by general beauty standards. It's one of those beefs that POC have, especially black women, about institutional racism and I can see their beef when it comes to job interviews and such.

 

Let's be honest, 90% of the commentary of "wow that guy has really f***ing dumb hair" in baseball is reserved for black/latino players and the other 10% for Josh Donaldson and Tim Lincecum.

 

This man is not wrong... It's similar to when people remark that a person is well spoken because they speak like a white person.

[Brownie19]

Jesus christ - I think Troy Polamalu has great hair too. Everyone happy?

[Scion]

lol... commenting on guys hair in the show on a baseball forum, is a far cry from walking into your workplace and commenting on people's f***ing hairstyle, nice reach Dick, there's no rhyme or reason for anyone to do that. Who was on H@S commercials recently in the NFL, that's right, POC.

 

It all plays into the same narrative. Truthfully these comments and thoughts are so institutionalized that they often occur on a subconscious level.

[Ray]

[Brownie19]

It all plays into the same narrative. Truthfully these comments and thoughts are so institutionalized that they often occur on a subconscious level.

 

There is truth to this - but there's also the reality some people prefer one thing over another regardless of race. I can tell a waitress I'd rather have the white chicken then the dark chicken at Swiss Chalet, but as soon as you suggest you prefer a feature of one person to the feature of another person - it must be racially driven? That's sad.

[Scion]

There is truth to this - but there's also the reality some people prefer one thing over another regardless of race. I can tell a waitress I'd rather have the white chicken then the dark chicken at Swiss Chalet, but as soon as you suggest you prefer a feature of one person to the feature of another person - it must be racially driven? That's sad.

 

Oh I agree, and to be clear I wasn't suggesting anyone on this board is being racist. I just thought it was an interesting comment and wanted to give my 2 cents.

Edited June 30, 2021 by Scion

[jaysfaithful8]

 

A closer in his best year with 2 and half seasons of control left and on a team friendly contract? Sure, but I'm afraid to ask what we would have to give up. Is it fair to say that the Pirates would be looking at one of Groshans or Kirk as a return?

[Krylian]

A closer in his best year with 2 and half seasons of control left and on a team friendly contract? Sure, but I'm afraid to ask what we would have to give up. Is it fair to say that the Pirates would be looking at one of Groshans or Kirk as a return?

 

I don't move Groshans for a closer. Kirk I would move, but in a bigger deal.

[Benito]

I agree. I don't think I'd move Groshans for a closer or a rental.

[Laika]

I don't move Groshans for a closer. Kirk I would move, but in a bigger deal.

 

Kirk > Groshans

 

Groshans hasn't done much in pro ball other than look handsome. Kirk, the opposite is true. I'll take the little meatball who demolished the entire minor league ladder over the Adonis who can't stay on the field, thanks.

[BCZ]

It is glorious.

 

Gloriously tragic.

[Scion]

Kirk > Groshans

 

Groshans hasn't done much in pro ball other than look handsome. Kirk, the opposite is true. I'll take the little meatball who demolished the entire minor league ladder over the Adonis who can't stay on the field, thanks.

 

Is it fair to say that you wouldn't trade either for Rodriguez though?

[Brownie19]

Is it fair to say that you wouldn't trade either for Rodriguez though?

 

I can't imagine they would. Most are rightfully down on Groshans right now, but he's still posting a 110 wRC+ in AA as a 21 year old. For someone who's missed a lot of time over the past 3 years including a season wiped out last year - I think there's still a ton of promise and I'd like to see what he can do over a full, healthy season.

 

I'm not sure I'd deal any of our top 10 prospects for a reliver - even if he has 2.5 years of control.

[Benito]

Kirk > Groshans

 

Groshans hasn't done much in pro ball other than look handsome. Kirk, the opposite is true. I'll take the little meatball who demolished the entire minor league ladder over the Adonis who can't stay on the field, thanks.

 

He's been good though when he has been on the field. 19 yr olds putting up .900+ ops in A ball (albeit in limited games) has done more than simply looking good in my books. We'll see how Kirk's body type holds up and ages over the long haul. I'm hoping well, because I am a Jays fan, but it's not like Kirk doesn't have his own durability questions.

[wilko]

I don't move Groshans for a closer. Kirk I would move, but in a bigger deal.

 

Like a fatter deal?

[Laika]

Is it fair to say that you wouldn't trade either for Rodriguez though?

 

Yeah I would not do that