Jays in on CarGos

[bones10]

Report: Giants, Blue Jays among teams eyeing CarGo

https://www.thescore.com/mlb/news/1444771

[BTS]

Dammit

[Terminator]

Just reading the tea leaves here but I think we are dumpster diving this offseason and are looking to tread water until 2020 when Vlad is up.

[bones10]

Just reading the tea leaves here but I think we are dumpster diving this offseason and are looking to tread water until 2020 when Vlad is up.

 

You'd think they would have traded Donaldson by now if that's the case, what's the point of 'treading water' exactly.

[BTS]

Just reading the tea leaves here but I think we are dumpster diving this offseason and are looking to tread water until 2020 when Vlad is up.

 

Yeah, I'm getting that impression too. I think it's the right move, but I'm hoping we don't lose JD via free agency just keep up appearances.

[Terminator]

You'd think they would have traded Donaldson by now if that's the case, what's the point of 'treading water' exactly.

 

Fielding semi-competitive teams right now is highly enticing to ownership.

[jays4life19]

f*** no

[Terminator]

Yeah, I'm getting that impression too. I think it's the right move, but I'm hoping we don't lose JD via free agency just keep up appearances.

 

That's the only issue is what to do with him. The Smoak's and the Happ's of the world aren't going to hurt us if we hang on to them and just let them play their contracts out. The return for JD could make a big difference. The problem is if we get rid of him you can kiss being semi-competitive goodbye and it also just sends a message that we aren't even trying to compete.

[bones10]

How much cash is CarGo getting do we think? Hes not getting more than a one year flyer is he?

[Ray]

CarGo would be Jose Bautista 2017 v2.

[Krylian]

You'd think they would have traded Donaldson by now if that's the case, what's the point of 'treading water' exactly.

 

Creating the illusion of competitive baseball for the fairweather fans.

[Krylian]

The Jays are 'in on' 75% of FA's every offseason.

[Dr. Dinger]

You guys need to accept that we are going to sign either Jay Bruce or Cargo, hopefully at a reasonable cost. Just cross your fingers and hope they put up a couple WAR.

[BTS]

That's the only issue is what to do with him. The Smoak's and the Happ's of the world aren't going to hurt us if we hang on to them and just let them play their contracts out. The return for JD could make a big difference. The problem is if we get rid of him you can kiss being semi-competitive goodbye and it also just sends a message that we aren't even trying to compete.

 

This is the first offseason in three years where the 'talk about winning, and field the best team you can while making no long-term commitments' strategy could actually hurt the future. It hasn't yet cost them anything to make a fake effort to compete while really looking at 2019 and beyond, but JD's looming free agency is a situation where the sooner decisive action is taken, the better things will look for the future. I don't really care whether it's a trade or extension, but his trade value is going to drop by a lot between now and July, and it would be a shame to waste an opportunity at a big haul because you're putting on a dog and pony show for the casual fans.

[Dick_Pole]

Am I the only one who thinks this isn't reaching that far into the dumpster and could be an adept move? He isn't like Bautista v2.0 he's several years younger. And the Jays have a pattern of much bigger turnips than him turning it around in their late-20's to early-30's with the team.

 

The two things going against this move would be 1. The Jays don't really need another should-be DH defensive liability on this roster and 2. The team hasn't had very good recent luck when acquiring a player away from Coors.

[Dr. Dinger]

This is the first offseason in three years where the 'talk about winning, and field the best team you can while making no long-term commitments' strategy could actually hurt the future. It hasn't yet cost them anything to make a fake effort to compete while really looking at 2019 and beyond, but JD's looming free agency is a situation where the sooner decisive action is taken, the better things will look for the future. I don't really care whether it's a trade or extension, but his trade value is going to drop by a lot between now and July, and it would be a shame to waste an opportunity at a big haul because you're putting on a dog and pony show for the casual fans.

 

I don't see this front office cutting themselves off at the knees with their most valuable player to assuage a fanbase, they are too shrewd for that. They are weighing all options, I don't see this reactionary need to rush to judgement. Pretty much everything they've done with this organization has been prudent, and I'm sure whatever course of action they choose with Donaldson will be the best option in light of all the information they have at their disposal (i.e. his willingness to sign an extension, what kind of trade offers they are getting for him, etc.)... information that we do not and will not have.

[Captain Adama]

I don't see this front office cutting themselves off at the knees with their most valuable player to assuage a fanbase, they are too shrewd for that. They are weighing all options, I don't see this reactionary need to rush to judgement. Pretty much everything they've done with this organization has been prudent, and I'm sure whatever course of action they choose with Donaldson will be the best option in light of all the information they have at their disposal (i.e. his willingness to sign an extension, what kind of trade offers they are getting for him, etc.)... information that we do not and will not have.

 

If the trade offer(s) the Jays received for Donaldson have been so bad, do the Jays just go ahead and keep him through the season and take their chances in July? That's probably the case.

 

Also, in terms of potential extensions, we haven't heard anything regarding dollar figures how much Donaldson wants to stay in Toronto.

[Abomination]

Am I the only one who thinks this isn't reaching that far into the dumpster and could be an adept move? He isn't like Bautista v2.0 he's several years younger. And the Jays have a pattern of much bigger turnips than him turning it around in their late-20's to early-30's with the team.

 

The two things going against this move would be 1. The Jays don't really need another should-be DH defensive liability on this roster and 2. The team hasn't had very good recent luck when acquiring a player away from Coors.

 

Cargo is a 95 wRC+ player in his career away from Coors and a significantly negative defender. I guess if he came cheap enough it could be worth taking a flier, but this really IS dumpster diving. I'd be just as happy signing Ethier I think.

[glory]

Just reading the tea leaves here but I think we are dumpster diving this offseason and are looking to tread water until 2020 when Vlad is up.

 

Yep. Appease Rogers by trying to stay around .500 every year, but rebuilding the system at the same time.

 

Not the way I'd do it, but I guess there's no other way with this ownership group.

[Terminator]

I don't see this front office cutting themselves off at the knees with their most valuable player to assuage a fanbase, they are too shrewd for that.

 

Agreed but the only way I could see it happening is if Rogers is directing them to do so.

[Dr. Dinger]

If the trade offer(s) the Jays received for Donaldson have been so bad, do the Jays just go ahead and keep him through the season and take their chances in July? That's probably the case.

 

Also, in terms of potential extensions, we haven't heard anything regarding dollar figures how much Donaldson wants to stay in Toronto.

 

I think Jays fans would be pretty disappointed by the trade return, whether it's now or in July. Teams just aren't going to give up multiple Top 100 prospects for a rental player in this era. IMO the best course of action is a reasonable market value extension, something like 6 years, $160M. On that deal he'd need to average about 2.7 WAR per year to provide surplus value (not factoring in inflation), so it provides a reasonable middle ground considering how good he is now vs. the considerable risk of playing out this season and having a down/injured year heading into FA at age 33. I think he'd be open to something like that. And really, I think we can all give up on Vladdy as a 3B. That's just window dressing.

[Terminator]

Am I the only one who thinks this isn't reaching that far into the dumpster and could be an adept move? He isn't like Bautista v2.0 he's several years younger. And the Jays have a pattern of much bigger turnips than him turning it around in their late-20's to early-30's with the team.

 

The two things going against this move would be 1. The Jays don't really need another should-be DH defensive liability on this roster and 2. The team hasn't had very good recent luck when acquiring a player away from Coors.

 

He's bargain bin material but he could have something left in the tank. His defense according to the metrics is below average but not terrible as well. It wouldn't be a horrible move if it allows the to redirect their resources toward the rotation.

[Dick_Pole]

Cargo is a 95 wRC+ player in his career away from Coors and a significantly negative defender. I guess if he came cheap enough it could be worth taking a flier, but this really IS dumpster diving. I'd be just as happy signing Ethier I think.

 

Yeah I'm thinking significant pay cut for him. Smoak range type of deal plus team option where people lose their s*** at first but in retrospect turns out fine. If Atkins signs this guy I wouldn't worry. I would assume they see a worthwhile reclamation project. They aren't just going to sign players for the sake of signing them. I'd rather they gift the position to Hernandez or Alford in the spring in that case.

[Dick_Pole]

Yep. Appease Rogers by trying to stay around .500 every year, but rebuilding the system at the same time.

 

Not the way I'd do it, but I guess there's no other way that a competent and competitive front office should wish to operate.

 

Fixed.

[Spanky99]

That's the only issue is what to do with him. The Smoak's and the Happ's of the world aren't going to hurt us if we hang on to them and just let them play their contracts out. The return for JD could make a big difference. The problem is if we get rid of him you can kiss being semi-competitive goodbye and it also just sends a message that we aren't even trying to compete.

 

Plus our FO said it again last night, that JD's not going anywhere... it is what it is.

 

Even without Stanton, New York finished 15 games ahead of division-rival Toronto in 2017. Nevertheless, Blue Jays GM Ross Atkins iterated Monday that they’re aiming to rebound, not rebuild, next season. Atkins told reporters, including Ben Nicholson-Smith of Sportsnet, that he’s focused on putting together the “best possible team.” That would likely mean retaining star third baseman Josh Donaldson as he enters a contract year, which the Jays seem inclined to do. “It’s hard to imagine making (the Jays) better without Josh,” Atkins noted

 

Ozuna or Yelich would be sweet, preferably the latter.

[Terminator]

Plus our FO said it again last night, that JD's not going anywhere...

 

They should just re-sign him and patch the roster with one and two year deals until 2020. Then Vlad and Bo are up with an old, but still productive JD. Tulo and Martin and Morales are all off the books by that point and with .500 finishes in 2018 and 2019 the fanbase is still active and engaged which will support a top 10 payroll moving forward. This is a realistic plan. Of course, maybe the patchwork leads to some surprises and they sneak in as a WC one of the two years. That would be nice.

[Bobthe4th]

They should just re-sign him and patch the roster with one and two year deals until 2020. Then Vlad and Bo are up with an old, but still productive JD. Tulo and Martin and Morales are all off the books by that point and with .500 finishes in 2018 and 2019 the fanbase is still active and engaged which will support a top 10 payroll moving forward. This is a realistic plan. Of course, maybe the patchwork leads to some surprises and they sneak in as a WC one of the two years. That would be nice.

 

Yup, plus hopefully at least 2 or 3 of Gurriel, Alford, Hernandez, Urena, Smith Jr, Tellez et al have established themselves.

[Terminator]

Yup, plus hopefully at least 2 or 3 of Gurriel, Alford, Hernandez, Urena, Smith Jr, Tellez et al have established themselves.

 

Yes exactly, just need to get the drafting and player development up and running. If they can become a Top 5-10 franchise in doing that they will have enough resources to put together really good teams most seasons.

[Bobthe4th]

One factor could be does JD want to stay. If I was him, I'd be reluctant to sign an extension this offseason without knowing how good the team is going to be.

 

However, he may prioritise money instead, and an extension now insures against him having another injury marred season, and his free agent earning potential being reduced.

[Terminator]

One factor could be does JD want to stay. If I was him, I'd be reluctant to sign an extension this offseason without knowing how good the team is going to be.

 

However, he may prioritise money instead, and an extension now insures against him having another injury marred season, and his free agent earning potential being reduced.

 

Yeah it all comes down to numbers. If JD wants 200 mil and the Cardinals back the truck up for him it's a no brainer to move him. If the offers are pretty tepid and JD is willing to sign for close to 150 mil then it makes sense to bring him back.