second half hopes

[o2cui2i]

I'd be curious to know what people are hoping for going forward in 2017

[Dick_Pole]

Wild card is within reach, make shrewd moves to help this year's club and the future. Not buy as in AA's version of buying.

[Daniel Labude]

There should be an "all of the above" option

[o2cui2i]

There should be an "all of the above" option

 

my fault for not taking into account that people here might suffer from a multiply personality disorder

 

 

I'll try to be more inclusive next time

[Jonn]

-Mega Blowup

Donaldson, Happ, Estrada, Liriano, Osuna, Montero, Barney, Smoak, Bautista all traded.

 

-Martin Tulo, and Morales finish 2017 strong.

 

-Alford get everyday at-bats when healthy

 

That's pretty much it. This team won't sniff the playoffs

[bones10]

Wouldn't mind if they start winning and have another deadline like they did last year... Pineda had TJS wouldn't be surprised if Yankees continue to struggle

[JFD]

I hope Pillar gets traded for anything.

[glory]

Either go on a huge run and make the playoffs or crash so hard that they finish last in the league. No in between.

[Jimcanuck]

oldest team in mlb, start the rebuild already

[TheHurl]

Top 3 offense in the AL.

[Maine Jays]

Either take on bad contracts to gain assets like last year (Yelich, even if it means Prado and Volquez) and go for the WC or trade everyone who isn't going to be a part of the 2020 team.

[Dick_Pole]

-Mega Blowup

Donaldson, Happ, Estrada, Liriano, Osuna, Montero, Barney, Smoak, Bautista all traded.

 

-Martin Tulo, and Morales finish 2017 strong.

 

-Alford get everyday at-bats when healthy

 

That's pretty much it. This team won't sniff the playoffs

 

Either go on a huge run and make the playoffs or crash so hard that they finish last in the league. No in between.

 

Either take on bad contracts to gain assets like last year (Yelich, even if it means Prado and Volquez) and go for the WC or trade everyone who isn't going to be a part of the 2020 team.

 

And this is why baseball fans aren't execs. Even the so called "smart" fans of this board.

 

Do any of you have any idea how hard it would be to blow it up to this extent? And what kind of reaction there would be from the bosses who are trying to protect the franchise value both long term AND right now?

 

LOL @ trading Montero. Yes, the Jays are going to get so much for a guy who they just acquired basically for free. This isn't Esmil Rogers and AA isn't on the receiving end of any trades out there.

[tazsub3]

And this is why baseball fans aren't execs. Even the so called "smart" fans of this board.

 

Do any of you have any idea how hard it would be to blow it up to this extent? And what kind of reaction there would be from the bosses who are trying to protect the franchise value both long term AND right now?

 

LOL @ trading Montero. Yes, the Jays are going to get so much for a guy who they just acquired basically for free. This isn't Esmil Rogers and AA isn't on the receiving end of any trades out there.

 

But dick, what do you and Shap-kins know, jonn tried it on MLB the show and it worked

[glory]

And this is why baseball fans aren't execs. Even the so called "smart" fans of this board.

 

Do any of you have any idea how hard it would be to blow it up to this extent? And what kind of reaction there would be from the bosses who are trying to protect the franchise value both long term AND right now?

 

LOL @ trading Montero. Yes, the Jays are going to get so much for a guy who they just acquired basically for free. This isn't Esmil Rogers and AA isn't on the receiving end of any trades out there.

 

Rogers will get their wish when the Jays keep plugging along, miss the playoffs and completely bottom out when Donaldson leaves anyway. This old roster is not going to get any better or younger next year so let them suck again in 2018 and force ownership's hand. Either way we know where this ship is headed. I like Shapiro and Atkins but they aren't miracle workers.

[Bobthe4th]

Rogers will get their wish when the Jays keep plugging along, miss the playoffs and completely bottom out when Donaldson leaves anyway. This old roster is not going to get any better or younger next year so let them suck again in 2018 and force ownership's hand. Either way we know where this ship is headed. I like Shapiro and Atkins but they aren't miracle workers.

 

You can make an argument that we won't be any better (I'd disagree, but you can still argue it).

 

But we're virtually guaranteed to get younger.

 

Grilli has already gone, Bautista is unlikely to be back. Estrada and Liriano probably won't be. It's quite possible one or more of Happ, Smoak and Pearce will be traded. All of those players are in their 30's with Smoak by far the youngest.

 

There's at least one outfield job up for grabs with Smith Jr and Alford first in line to win it. A few other prospects are likely to get calls up next year (led by Gurriel IMO).

[Angrioter]

Wild card is within reach, make shrewd moves to help this year's club and the future. Not buy as in AA's version of buying.

 

and lose 2018 free agents for nothing?

 

WC is just one game. Time to sell

[wk680]

and lose 2018 free agents for nothing?

 

WC is just one game. Time to sell

 

Do you mean FAs entering 2018 or FAs following 2018 season? Either way, the only ones of much significance are Donaldson and Happ (maybe Smith this year if he can come back soon and show he is effective). So they can still trade Happ and Donaldson during the coming offseason or during 2018 season if it isn't shaping up well by July.

[Dick_Pole]

and lose 2018 free agents for nothing?

 

WC is just one game. Time to sell

 

Are you morons all so brain damaged that your mind can only function in two either/or states like an on-off switch?

 

The two free agents in 2018 are Happ and Donaldson. Liriano and Estrada are the big ones in 2017. First off, there is nothing to suggest they will lose them for nothing. They could always re-sign them. Or if they don't they can use the salary freed up for signing similar players.

 

Ok, let's say they trade Happ. Does that mean they throw in the towel on the season? No, they put Biagini back in the rotation and the team continues to play hard and the FO looks for other opportunistic trades to add to the roster.

 

Even if the Jays traded Donaldson, as long as they got MLB ready talent back so that they're not throwing out the Three Stooges of Goins, Barney and Coghlan out there on the left side of the infield, they can still field a competitive team.

 

No wonder the Philadelphia 76ers managed to get away with their "process" of four years of record-setting futility being a piece of s***. To finally be maybe a playoff team in a weak Eastern Conference this year. With a team that might one day be as good as the Raptors are now at their peak if they're lucky. Because there are so many beta male sports fans with a loser mentality who actually eat this s*** up and think that losing is the secret to future winning. Meanwhile teams like the Yankees, Spurs, Patriots and the 1983-1993 Blue Jays keep on chugging along winning year after winning year with a seemingly endless supply of good players.

 

The Blue Jays are not in a situation that is THAT bad. One guy is signed beyond 2019. On a team expected to be in the top half of the league in payroll. That is a lot of payroll flexibility to work with. This is not the 2012 Phillies.

[glory]

Dick, going for it next year and still trading JD, Happ, etc, would be fine with me. They'll fall way short in all likelihood but at least they would have maximized the value of their biggest veteran assets. It's keeping everyone, making bandaid signings to fill holes, and still coming up short that will bug most of this forum. Aka the Jays from about 1995-2014.

[Dick_Pole]

Dick, going for it next year and still trading JD, Happ, etc, would be fine with me. They'll fall way short in all likelihood but at least they would have maximized the value of their biggest veteran assets. It's keeping everyone, making bandaid signings to fill holes, and still coming up short that will bug most of this forum. Aka the Jays from about 1995-2014.

 

Yes, if that's how the front office chooses to go, then I'm ok with that.

 

But the issues of this team from 1995-2014 weren't as you described. It was incompetence of the buffoons running the team that led it to be so mediocre. Ricciardi dumped everyone he could at the beginning of his regime. None of those trades panned out. And the root cause of his failings was a complete inability to draft and develop players, not his MLB roster moves. Hill, Lind and Romero don't build championships. Ash netted the team Jose Cruz Jr. for two relief pitchers. He was useless otherwise. Only AA did what you described in 2013 and it backfired miserably.

[KingKat]

Yes, if that's how the front office chooses to go, then I'm ok with that.

 

But the issues of this team from 1995-2014 weren't as you described. It was incompetence of the buffoons running the team that led it to be so mediocre. Ricciardi dumped everyone he could at the beginning of his regime. None of those trades panned out. And the root cause of his failings was a complete inability to draft and develop players, not his MLB roster moves. Hill, Lind and Romero don't build championships. Ash netted the team Jose Cruz Jr. for two relief pitchers. He was useless otherwise. Only AA did what you described in 2013 and it backfired miserably.

 

Ash in 1997 was fairly similar to AA's 2013. They signed Benny Santiago and Roger Clemens and made a big trade with Pittsburgh. All this was supposed to throw them back into contention after going 74-88 in 1996. They only won two more games in 1997.

[Dick_Pole]

Ash in 1997 was fairly similar to AA's 2013. They signed Benny Santiago and Roger Clemens and made a big trade with Pittsburgh. All this was supposed to throw them back into contention after going 74-88 in 1996. They only won two more games in 1997.

 

Yeah but the Jays also had a hell of a young core coming up, none of which were touched in that Pittsburgh trade - Delgado, Green, Stewart, Gonzalez, Cruz Jr., Carpenter, Escobar, Halladay. Add Clemens to Cy Young award winning Hentgen and the young pitchers. Add Canseco, Stanley, Fernandez and Santiago to those young hitters. It was the right idea, just that the Yankees were inhumane at that time and Clemens wanted out too soon and somehow it didn't click at the right time. Nobody today would have questioned Ash's moves back then. Yeah ok, Pett was moved and he was a big prospect back then but I don't think anyone would have complained that much given the nearer term talent coming up.

 

Imagine an equivalent talent level team to the 97-98 squad today. This forum would be down constantly from all the people salivating over it. You gotta take a look at that roster around the late 90's and figure out how the f*** did that team top out at only 88 wins.