Peter O'Brien? Hear Me Out.

[JaysFan4Ever]

According to Rotoworld: (http://www.rotoworld.com/player/mlb/7794/peter-obrien) Peter O'Brien, who was DFA, is attracting trade interest from both NL & AL teams. I know, he does strike out a lot, but does hit for some power, is only 26, isn't eligible for arbitration for a couple of years, has an OK OBP in the minors (full stats: http://www.milb.com/player/index.jsp?player_id=598284#/career/R/hitting/2016/ALL), depending on the asking price, maybe the Jays (who just signed a few guys last week to minor league deals who range from 16-19), could part with a lower level or two prospect, or players like they did in the Grilli trade, and see if he might be worth some insurance in the OF, might catch lightning in a bottle, and was originally a catcher, according to Rotoworld in 2015 entering ST, so, maybe he could be a 3rd, or 4th/emergency catcher if needed. He was a September call up in 2015, so he still has options left (2 years if I'm correct), so if the price is right, maybe worth a shot at him, seeing him in ST both as an OF and catcher, if he doesn't make the team out of ST, option him down, see how he plays out down there, in either or both positions, either try slipping him through waivers, or including him in a deal at the deadline if he's doing well and there isn't a spot for him. There's a few guys who might be removed from the 40 man roster depending on any signings, trades, or just not good enough come ST, so if he can be had for the right (cheap/spare parts) price, could give some depth in the OF and catcher, would be inexpensive, still young, has some pop, might be worth a shot. He didn't do well in his cup of coffee in the bigs, but maybe a change of scenery could help. I know it'll put the roster to 40, but there are some guys who might be moved as throw ins, or placed on waivers at some point, either between now or ST, so could make room should they make a trade or sign someone. He could take Darrell Ceciliani spot since he's likely to go unclaimed, and didn't do much. Just a suggestion on an otherwise no news day.

 

May your crucifying of me commence!

[ChrisS]

He sported a .130 BA when Arizona visited this year. Was getting chirped big time by the outfield fans then proceeded to homer lol

[jays4life19]

This is just my personal feeling/speculation(s), but I have a feeling (not quite 50-50% but close to it), that Peter O Brian suxx

[JaysFan4Ever]

To be fair he's only played in 36 games and had 74 AB in the bigs. He spent the past two years in the PCL, which we know benefits hitters, so maybe the 50 HR were part of that.

 

I was just thinking, if it was a cheap price, he could be a fairly low risk, maybe a decent player in the bigs. If he can still catch, play at lest LF if not LF & RF, could be a kind of multi position player. He'd obviously would have to have a great spring, carry over some good hitting into the season.

 

Might just wind up a AAAA guy, or could be a surprise. I was just suggesting him if the price is right, and he actually showed he could hit in the bigs.

[Spanky99]

He sported a .130 BA when Arizona visited this year. Was getting chirped big time by the outfield fans then proceeded to homer lol

 

Hah... I was at that game, too.

[bendera3]

To be fair he's only played in 36 games and had 74 AB in the bigs. He spent the past two years in the PCL, which we know benefits hitters, so maybe the 50 HR were part of that.

 

I was just thinking, if it was a cheap price, he could be a fairly low risk, maybe a decent player in the bigs. If he can still catch, play at lest LF if not LF & RF, could be a kind of multi position player. He'd obviously would have to have a great spring, carry over some good hitting into the season.

 

Might just wind up a AAAA guy, or could be a surprise. I was just suggesting him if the price is right, and he actually showed he could hit in the bigs.

 

If I remember correctly he is pretty bad at every position he plays.

[FrozenRopes]

To be fair he's only played in 36 games and had 74 AB in the bigs. He spent the past two years in the PCL, which we know benefits hitters, so maybe the 50 HR were part of that.

 

I was just thinking, if it was a cheap price, he could be a fairly low risk, maybe a decent player in the bigs. If he can still catch, play at lest LF if not LF & RF, could be a kind of multi position player. He'd obviously would have to have a great spring, carry over some good hitting into the season.

 

Might just wind up a AAAA guy, or could be a surprise. I was just suggesting him if the price is right, and he actually showed he could hit in the bigs.

To be fair, I have only played 0 big league games and a handful at AA. Does that mean I deserve a shot again? I mean, I am 40 now but using your methodology.

 

In other news, he sucks.

[jays4life19]

To be fair, I have only played 0 big league games and a handful at AA. Does that mean I deserve a shot again? I mean, I am 40 now but using your methodology.

 

In other news, he sucks.

 

You played AA ball? Cool!

[FrozenRopes]

Texas League for the good ole Tulsa Drillers, before anyone asks.

[jays4life19]

Texas League for the good ole Tulsa Drillers, before anyone asks.

 

What position?

[FrozenRopes]

What position?

 

RF (poorly) and 1B (less poorly)

[FrozenRopes]

What position?

 

Now I live north of the border, selling things and coaching some ball.

[jays4life19]

Fascinating.

[Spanky99]

Texas League for the good ole Tulsa Drillers, before anyone asks.

 

lol

[Abomination]

According to Rotoworld: (http://www.rotoworld.com/player/mlb/7794/peter-obrien) Peter O'Brien, who was DFA, is attracting trade interest from both NL & AL teams. I know, he does strike out a lot, but does hit for some power, is only 26, isn't eligible for arbitration for a couple of years, has an OK OBP in the minors (full stats: http://www.milb.com/player/index.jsp?player_id=598284#/career/R/hitting/2016/ALL), depending on the asking price, maybe the Jays (who just signed a few guys last week to minor league deals who range from 16-19), could part with a lower level or two prospect, or players like they did in the Grilli trade, and see if he might be worth some insurance in the OF, might catch lightning in a bottle, and was originally a catcher, according to Rotoworld in 2015 entering ST, so, maybe he could be a 3rd, or 4th/emergency catcher if needed. He was a September call up in 2015, so he still has options left (2 years if I'm correct), so if the price is right, maybe worth a shot at him, seeing him in ST both as an OF and catcher, if he doesn't make the team out of ST, option him down, see how he plays out down there, in either or both positions, either try slipping him through waivers, or including him in a deal at the deadline if he's doing well and there isn't a spot for him. There's a few guys who might be removed from the 40 man roster depending on any signings, trades, or just not good enough come ST, so if he can be had for the right (cheap/spare parts) price, could give some depth in the OF and catcher, would be inexpensive, still young, has some pop, might be worth a shot. He didn't do well in his cup of coffee in the bigs, but maybe a change of scenery could help. I know it'll put the roster to 40, but there are some guys who might be moved as throw ins, or placed on waivers at some point, either between now or ST, so could make room should they make a trade or sign someone. He could take Darrell Ceciliani spot since he's likely to go unclaimed, and didn't do much. Just a suggestion on an otherwise no news day.

 

May your crucifying of me commence!

 

Yes, I'd like to see this happen (I suggested it in one of the other threads). Use him as the backup catcher, and if he can't be fixed and you have to cut him you haven't really lost much. He has good power, maybe he can start to tap into it. I'd rather go that route than pay a few million for a backup guy who can't hit to save his life.

[Spanky99]

Yes, I'd like to see this happen (I suggested it in one of the other threads). Use him as the backup catcher, and if he can't be fixed and you have to cut him you haven't really lost much. He has good power, maybe he can start to tap into it. I'd rather go that route than pay a few million for a backup guy who can't hit to save his life.

 

Owns O'Brien^^^

[Brownie19]

JPA 2.0

 

Pass

[P2F]

According to Rotoworld: (http://www.rotoworld.com/player/mlb/7794/peter-obrien) Peter O'Brien, who was DFA, is attracting trade interest from both NL & AL teams. I know, he does strike out a lot, but does hit for some power, is only 26, isn't eligible for arbitration for a couple of years, has an OK OBP in the minors (full stats: http://www.milb.com/player/index.jsp?player_id=598284#/career/R/hitting/2016/ALL), depending on the asking price, maybe the Jays (who just signed a few guys last week to minor league deals who range from 16-19), could part with a lower level or two prospect, or players like they did in the Grilli trade, and see if he might be worth some insurance in the OF, might catch lightning in a bottle, and was originally a catcher, according to Rotoworld in 2015 entering ST, so, maybe he could be a 3rd, or 4th/emergency catcher if needed. He was a September call up in 2015, so he still has options left (2 years if I'm correct), so if the price is right, maybe worth a shot at him, seeing him in ST both as an OF and catcher, if he doesn't make the team out of ST, option him down, see how he plays out down there, in either or both positions, either try slipping him through waivers, or including him in a deal at the deadline if he's doing well and there isn't a spot for him. There's a few guys who might be removed from the 40 man roster depending on any signings, trades, or just not good enough come ST, so if he can be had for the right (cheap/spare parts) price, could give some depth in the OF and catcher, would be inexpensive, still young, has some pop, might be worth a shot. He didn't do well in his cup of coffee in the bigs, but maybe a change of scenery could help. I know it'll put the roster to 40, but there are some guys who might be moved as throw ins, or placed on waivers at some point, either between now or ST, so could make room should they make a trade or sign someone. He could take Darrell Ceciliani spot since he's likely to go unclaimed, and didn't do much. Just a suggestion on an otherwise no news day.

 

May your crucifying of me commence!

 

This is just my opinion, and might be shared by some, but some guys it might be a bit early to tell, and don't want to jump the gun on (see Hinske and Wells, though Wells, wasn't as bad, especially since AA somehow unloaded that contract) since you don't know if the player will regress or the league figure them out. I do like the idea of trying to get guys locked into fair, but team friendly deals, so it helps you know your budget with a bit more certainty years down the line, and if the player continues at their performance, wonderful, if they get even better, then it's a steal. On the other hand, you could wind up playing for a player who winds up injury plagued (sometimes that can't be helped, either it's just their body, or freak accidents, like JB getting his cleat stuck in the seem of the OF turn and straining his knee), or someone who doesn't live up to what they did before, or gets worse. But for sake of argument, and for the purposes of this thread, I'll throw out some names on who I would try to lock up, at least through arbitration, or a deal that includes team options for those years, so if the player doesn't have a good year, is injured, the team can decline the option, and either non-tender them, or go to arbitration/avoid it by signing them to a cheaper deal (Saunders this year received a very small, relative to arbitration, salary increase due to him being injured, and didn't have a leg to stand on to fight for a larger payday, and no that wasn't meant to be a s***** pun). So, here's my list:

 

Osuna. Relief pitchers are notoriously unstable, with the exception of a few, and they're usually closers, or set-up men. Roberto has been our closer the past two years (his first two in the bigs, and I believe the first time above A ball, correct me if I'm wrong). He seems to have had essentially a similar year to his first, minus some hiccups here and there, which, he's human, it's to be expected, but in the playoffs, he was even better than last year, going 9.0 IP giving up 0, as in zero, runs, walked no one, and struck out 10, better than last post season. He pitched about as many innings and games this year as last, so it's fair to compare them. Of course we don't know how he'll be next year, no one can predict how a player will be, but if he remains as is, he could get expensive in arbitration, and quickly, especially if he keeps racking up saves, and making big leaguers look foolish. He's also young, very young for his success, by MLB standards, (I think he'll be 23), and some guys don't break into the bigs until around 25 give or take. So, he still has some pretty good years ahead of him. Even if his velocity begins to drop, as it does with many pitchers just due to age, he seems to know how to pitch, already has two good off speed pitches in his slider, and change-up, so he could adjust a bit more easily, since he can locate the ball pretty well. He's only entering his 3rd year, and unless he gets sent down, which I don't see happening, he'll be eligible for arbitration next off season. They could try to go with a one-year deal, and talk extension, or if he has another solid year, or even better now that he's had more experience around, I wouldn't mind seeing them buyout his arbitration years, and maybe a year of FA, or just the arbitration years, and some team options. To keep the AAV lower, and maybe have him accept, offer larger buyouts on the options, or give him signing bonuses that would be paid, say first day of April of each year, when they're in Florida, so he doesn't lose income tax. Worse case, I would go one year of arbitration (hopefully avoiding it) to see what he does in 2017, and then maybe a 3-4 year deal with 1-2 options on it depending on the guaranteed years and money, and maybe some signing bonuses or larger buyouts than the typical $250-500K ones.

 

Sanchez. If Cot's is correct, this is his last year before he'll be eligible for arbitration in the offseason. So, similar deal with Osuna. I would let him play this season out, see how it goes, and if he pitches like he did this year, or better yet, improves on it, showing no signs of fatigue, or regression, or injury, make a similar offer where his arbitration years are bought out, with possibly a year or two of FA, either guaranteed or via option(s). He's still young, and if he can reproduce what he did last year, and better yet improve, he's a force to lead the rotation, and could get expensive, so offering up some guaranteed years, with some options, and/or higher buyouts, might be worth it.

 

Stroman. He qualified as a Super Two and will be eligible for arbitration this offseason with a projection of about $3-3.5M depending on your source. Keep in mind, many of them have predicted big contracts for JB and EE, and well, yeah. He still has 3 arbitration years ahead of him, so his price will only go up. Since he does have the stuff to be successful, even at the top of the rotation, I would let this year play out and see if he can rebound from a back and forth kind of year last year. He's another guy I would offer a similar contract to like Osuna and Sanchez, buying out arbitration for guaranteed money, maybe a FA year or two, and/or some team or vesting option(s) (forgot to mention those before).

 

Pillar: Believe it or not, I would be tempted to give him a contract to lock him in. He'll be arbitration eligible for the first time this offseason, so it could be a see what happens, then see what he does next year before talking about buying out the last of his arbitration and a FA year or two. My method for this madness is, he'll only be 28 come ST, so he should have a few good years left, so why not try to get them for the Jays at a team friendly, but fair contract, to one of the games best defensive CFs, a guy with some speed, who's hit 66 2B since taking over full time, and if he can be a bit more patient, might be able to draw some more walks, hit for a little more power, and get on base just a bit more. Career OBP of .303 isn't horrible, especially since he'll likely hit lower in the lineup, and his defense is more of what the team wants, and anything offensively is a bonus. Again, maybe a 3-4 year contract that's team friendly, maybe some options, maybe higher buyouts on the options, maybe signing bonuses paid in ST, so less income tax taken out, and if we get someone else who comes up through the farm, or signed, or traded for, if he's on a team friendly contract, much like anyone on one, trading them will be easier. If he starts to decline and is forced into one of the corner OF spots, or a team wants a CF, they can have a cheaper alternative, and maybe some options on the contract.

 

Donaldson. OK technically he's not "young" in the sense of this thread being he just turned 31, and is under contract this year, with one more year of arbitration, but I wouldn't mind giving him another 2-3 year deal, with vesting or team options, especially since the team will need a new "face of the franchise" with EE gone, and who knows with Bautista, but rumours are he's only looking for a one year deal. 3 years makes him 34. EE had a pretty good year at 33, and if the team rotates guys, like Donaldson and others, to have some off days, or DH duties, he could still be a strong bat at 33 maybe 34. At worse he gets a contract that might be movable in a trade, and the Jays can get something of value back. I don't personally seeing him dropping off a cliff in the next few years, but his all out play might be a problem, so a few days at DH, or a schedule day off might be good, and could always come off the bench if needed.

 

Travis. He's a bit hard to get a grasp on. He was almost a lock for ROY before shoulder issues ended his season, and kept him out early this season. Good thing is they found out the problem and fixed it. He enjoyed a solid year, and exceeded expectation of some, and made the trade look like a complete steal by the Jays. in only 101 games and 410 ABs he hit 28 2B, 1 3B, 11HR, 50 RBI, hit an even .300 with a .332 OBP, while doing a pretty good job in the field. Then the knee issue started which was originally a bone bruise, then it was a bone bruise with cartilage being stuck in between the knee joint. This could be chalked up to a freak accident, or making a double play where he had to pivot on the leg, causing a tear. Hell, I tore a meniscus getting into my car. So, I would give him at least this year to see what he can bring. We know he's capable of being a solid offensive player at his position, and play at least average, if not above average defense, and either play out the first year of arbitration, or like the above, try to buyout the years, with an option or two, signing bonuses, combination thereof.

 

Just from what I've seen during the past couple of years, the players' work ethic, their ages, they're the ones I'd try to lock in for the core, and try to keep their contracts low, but fair, I know hard balancing act at times. We know we have some players who for the next 2-3 seasons will make $20M a year, we have some guys who might be lost on waivers, and a few FA next year, so if the Jays can lock them in at inexpensive rates, they can then have more money to go out on the FA market, resign other players, take on money in trades, know what the players are going to make for the next few years, giving them an advantage. If someone comes up through the system, and winds up being a better player, or via trade, or via FA, the contracts could make them easier to trade since it wouldn't be a large sum of money. We've seen some contracts that are getting handed out, so if we can keep some of the young core players in the fold, at cheaper prices, why not? Worse case the players regress, or start to slow down a bit, but then it's not a huge investment (depending on what the figures are), especially when compared to some contracts that players get, especially later in their careers (right side of 30, or some case 35), and then start to fade, and are shells of themselves, who are all but unmovable, and you're stuck.

 

Overall, I think it's a gamble no matter how you look at it. Most of the younger players are either under contract (Lourdes Gurriel if he pans out) for a low amount, or aren't FA eligible yet for a few more years, so there isn't a real sense of urgency. Well, maybe with Donaldson, if the team isn't competitive, or he enters the final year of arbitration without talk of an extension, or even if they start talking, he might want to test the waters like EE and JB, so he's the only question mark. The others, even Stroman who is arbitration eligible now, are either this season removed, and will hit arbitration for their first time and either way, even Stroman is under team control for years to come. They could wait a year or two of arbitration before talking contract extensions, but if they can land them for team friendly deals, that won't handcuff the team, and the players take it, and it gives us some of, if not, the best years of those players careers, I say go for it. No one knows what will happen, so that's a gamble, but even if there's a regression, injury, player can't live up to what they've done before, and are average or worse, then it's not like signing a FA to a high AAV and stuck with them for a few years, where if the contracts are fair on both sides, we might get a nice core, for a relatively fair amount of money, all entering their primes, while allowing the team to have money to use elsewhere to try and sustain a potential contender for a few years, or at least take a step back, regroup with some acquisitions, and still have a number of players there, so you're shopping list is smaller. It's almost a Catch-22 since you might get a great deal with some of that players best years, for an inexpensive rate (relative to some of the market values), or at worse, it winds up like a Hinske deal, where the player is average, or subaverage, and you have to just eat the money, which isn't nearly as much as market value could be.

 

I'd say start talking to their reps and the players to get an idea, and take it from there. See what you have in house for replacements, or who you could get as a replacement without gutting the farm or having to overpay (well, more so) on the market.

 

Going year by year is another option, like some have said, because an injury could make that year's salary lesser, but it could rise, and then you could be stuck with trying to sign the player before or when they hit FA if you don't have another replacement. Or like I said before, give them a deal, with options on the last one or two option years, and/or FA year and see.

 

Just my opinions. We don't need O'Brien.

[FrozenRopes]

This is just my opinion, and might be shared by some, but some guys it might be a bit early to tell, and don't want to jump the gun on (see Hinske and Wells, though Wells, wasn't as bad, especially since AA somehow unloaded that contract) since you don't know if the player will regress or the league figure them out. I do like the idea of trying to get guys locked into fair, but team friendly deals, so it helps you know your budget with a bit more certainty years down the line, and if the player continues at their performance, wonderful, if they get even better, then it's a steal. On the other hand, you could wind up playing for a player who winds up injury plagued (sometimes that can't be helped, either it's just their body, or freak accidents, like JB getting his cleat stuck in the seem of the OF turn and straining his knee), or someone who doesn't live up to what they did before, or gets worse. But for sake of argument, and for the purposes of this thread, I'll throw out some names on who I would try to lock up, at least through arbitration, or a deal that includes team options for those years, so if the player doesn't have a good year, is injured, the team can decline the option, and either non-tender them, or go to arbitration/avoid it by signing them to a cheaper deal (Saunders this year received a very small, relative to arbitration, salary increase due to him being injured, and didn't have a leg to stand on to fight for a larger payday, and no that wasn't meant to be a s***** pun). So, here's my list:

 

Osuna. Relief pitchers are notoriously unstable, with the exception of a few, and they're usually closers, or set-up men. Roberto has been our closer the past two years (his first two in the bigs, and I believe the first time above A ball, correct me if I'm wrong). He seems to have had essentially a similar year to his first, minus some hiccups here and there, which, he's human, it's to be expected, but in the playoffs, he was even better than last year, going 9.0 IP giving up 0, as in zero, runs, walked no one, and struck out 10, better than last post season. He pitched about as many innings and games this year as last, so it's fair to compare them. Of course we don't know how he'll be next year, no one can predict how a player will be, but if he remains as is, he could get expensive in arbitration, and quickly, especially if he keeps racking up saves, and making big leaguers look foolish. He's also young, very young for his success, by MLB standards, (I think he'll be 23), and some guys don't break into the bigs until around 25 give or take. So, he still has some pretty good years ahead of him. Even if his velocity begins to drop, as it does with many pitchers just due to age, he seems to know how to pitch, already has two good off speed pitches in his slider, and change-up, so he could adjust a bit more easily, since he can locate the ball pretty well. He's only entering his 3rd year, and unless he gets sent down, which I don't see happening, he'll be eligible for arbitration next off season. They could try to go with a one-year deal, and talk extension, or if he has another solid year, or even better now that he's had more experience around, I wouldn't mind seeing them buyout his arbitration years, and maybe a year of FA, or just the arbitration years, and some team options. To keep the AAV lower, and maybe have him accept, offer larger buyouts on the options, or give him signing bonuses that would be paid, say first day of April of each year, when they're in Florida, so he doesn't lose income tax. Worse case, I would go one year of arbitration (hopefully avoiding it) to see what he does in 2017, and then maybe a 3-4 year deal with 1-2 options on it depending on the guaranteed years and money, and maybe some signing bonuses or larger buyouts than the typical $250-500K ones.

 

Sanchez. If Cot's is correct, this is his last year before he'll be eligible for arbitration in the offseason. So, similar deal with Osuna. I would let him play this season out, see how it goes, and if he pitches like he did this year, or better yet, improves on it, showing no signs of fatigue, or regression, or injury, make a similar offer where his arbitration years are bought out, with possibly a year or two of FA, either guaranteed or via option(s). He's still young, and if he can reproduce what he did last year, and better yet improve, he's a force to lead the rotation, and could get expensive, so offering up some guaranteed years, with some options, and/or higher buyouts, might be worth it.

 

Stroman. He qualified as a Super Two and will be eligible for arbitration this offseason with a projection of about $3-3.5M depending on your source. Keep in mind, many of them have predicted big contracts for JB and EE, and well, yeah. He still has 3 arbitration years ahead of him, so his price will only go up. Since he does have the stuff to be successful, even at the top of the rotation, I would let this year play out and see if he can rebound from a back and forth kind of year last year. He's another guy I would offer a similar contract to like Osuna and Sanchez, buying out arbitration for guaranteed money, maybe a FA year or two, and/or some team or vesting option(s) (forgot to mention those before).

 

Pillar: Believe it or not, I would be tempted to give him a contract to lock him in. He'll be arbitration eligible for the first time this offseason, so it could be a see what happens, then see what he does next year before talking about buying out the last of his arbitration and a FA year or two. My method for this madness is, he'll only be 28 come ST, so he should have a few good years left, so why not try to get them for the Jays at a team friendly, but fair contract, to one of the games best defensive CFs, a guy with some speed, who's hit 66 2B since taking over full time, and if he can be a bit more patient, might be able to draw some more walks, hit for a little more power, and get on base just a bit more. Career OBP of .303 isn't horrible, especially since he'll likely hit lower in the lineup, and his defense is more of what the team wants, and anything offensively is a bonus. Again, maybe a 3-4 year contract that's team friendly, maybe some options, maybe higher buyouts on the options, maybe signing bonuses paid in ST, so less income tax taken out, and if we get someone else who comes up through the farm, or signed, or traded for, if he's on a team friendly contract, much like anyone on one, trading them will be easier. If he starts to decline and is forced into one of the corner OF spots, or a team wants a CF, they can have a cheaper alternative, and maybe some options on the contract.

 

Donaldson. OK technically he's not "young" in the sense of this thread being he just turned 31, and is under contract this year, with one more year of arbitration, but I wouldn't mind giving him another 2-3 year deal, with vesting or team options, especially since the team will need a new "face of the franchise" with EE gone, and who knows with Bautista, but rumours are he's only looking for a one year deal. 3 years makes him 34. EE had a pretty good year at 33, and if the team rotates guys, like Donaldson and others, to have some off days, or DH duties, he could still be a strong bat at 33 maybe 34. At worse he gets a contract that might be movable in a trade, and the Jays can get something of value back. I don't personally seeing him dropping off a cliff in the next few years, but his all out play might be a problem, so a few days at DH, or a schedule day off might be good, and could always come off the bench if needed.

 

Travis. He's a bit hard to get a grasp on. He was almost a lock for ROY before shoulder issues ended his season, and kept him out early this season. Good thing is they found out the problem and fixed it. He enjoyed a solid year, and exceeded expectation of some, and made the trade look like a complete steal by the Jays. in only 101 games and 410 ABs he hit 28 2B, 1 3B, 11HR, 50 RBI, hit an even .300 with a .332 OBP, while doing a pretty good job in the field. Then the knee issue started which was originally a bone bruise, then it was a bone bruise with cartilage being stuck in between the knee joint. This could be chalked up to a freak accident, or making a double play where he had to pivot on the leg, causing a tear. Hell, I tore a meniscus getting into my car. So, I would give him at least this year to see what he can bring. We know he's capable of being a solid offensive player at his position, and play at least average, if not above average defense, and either play out the first year of arbitration, or like the above, try to buyout the years, with an option or two, signing bonuses, combination thereof.

 

Just from what I've seen during the past couple of years, the players' work ethic, their ages, they're the ones I'd try to lock in for the core, and try to keep their contracts low, but fair, I know hard balancing act at times. We know we have some players who for the next 2-3 seasons will make $20M a year, we have some guys who might be lost on waivers, and a few FA next year, so if the Jays can lock them in at inexpensive rates, they can then have more money to go out on the FA market, resign other players, take on money in trades, know what the players are going to make for the next few years, giving them an advantage. If someone comes up through the system, and winds up being a better player, or via trade, or via FA, the contracts could make them easier to trade since it wouldn't be a large sum of money. We've seen some contracts that are getting handed out, so if we can keep some of the young core players in the fold, at cheaper prices, why not? Worse case the players regress, or start to slow down a bit, but then it's not a huge investment (depending on what the figures are), especially when compared to some contracts that players get, especially later in their careers (right side of 30, or some case 35), and then start to fade, and are shells of themselves, who are all but unmovable, and you're stuck.

 

Overall, I think it's a gamble no matter how you look at it. Most of the younger players are either under contract (Lourdes Gurriel if he pans out) for a low amount, or aren't FA eligible yet for a few more years, so there isn't a real sense of urgency. Well, maybe with Donaldson, if the team isn't competitive, or he enters the final year of arbitration without talk of an extension, or even if they start talking, he might want to test the waters like EE and JB, so he's the only question mark. The others, even Stroman who is arbitration eligible now, are either this season removed, and will hit arbitration for their first time and either way, even Stroman is under team control for years to come. They could wait a year or two of arbitration before talking contract extensions, but if they can land them for team friendly deals, that won't handcuff the team, and the players take it, and it gives us some of, if not, the best years of those players careers, I say go for it. No one knows what will happen, so that's a gamble, but even if there's a regression, injury, player can't live up to what they've done before, and are average or worse, then it's not like signing a FA to a high AAV and stuck with them for a few years, where if the contracts are fair on both sides, we might get a nice core, for a relatively fair amount of money, all entering their primes, while allowing the team to have money to use elsewhere to try and sustain a potential contender for a few years, or at least take a step back, regroup with some acquisitions, and still have a number of players there, so you're shopping list is smaller. It's almost a Catch-22 since you might get a great deal with some of that players best years, for an inexpensive rate (relative to some of the market values), or at worse, it winds up like a Hinske deal, where the player is average, or subaverage, and you have to just eat the money, which isn't nearly as much as market value could be.

 

I'd say start talking to their reps and the players to get an idea, and take it from there. See what you have in house for replacements, or who you could get as a replacement without gutting the farm or having to overpay (well, more so) on the market.

 

Going year by year is another option, like some have said, because an injury could make that year's salary lesser, but it could rise, and then you could be stuck with trying to sign the player before or when they hit FA if you don't have another replacement. Or like I said before, give them a deal, with options on the last one or two option years, and/or FA year and see.

 

Just my opinions. We don't need O'Brien.

 

Some good points. I think one of our younger MLB arms gets dealt for outfield help. Blackmon or McCutcheon coming back. Stro to the Pirates?

[Boxcar]

This is just my opinion, and might be shared by some, but some guys it might be a bit early to tell, and don't want to jump the gun on (see Hinske and Wells, though Wells, wasn't as bad, especially since AA somehow unloaded that contract) since you don't know if the player will regress or the league figure them out. I do like the idea of trying to get guys locked into fair, but team friendly deals, so it helps you know your budget with a bit more certainty years down the line, and if the player continues at their performance, wonderful, if they get even better, then it's a steal. On the other hand, you could wind up playing for a player who winds up injury plagued (sometimes that can't be helped, either it's just their body, or freak accidents, like JB getting his cleat stuck in the seem of the OF turn and straining his knee), or someone who doesn't live up to what they did before, or gets worse. But for sake of argument, and for the purposes of this thread, I'll throw out some names on who I would try to lock up, at least through arbitration, or a deal that includes team options for those years, so if the player doesn't have a good year, is injured, the team can decline the option, and either non-tender them, or go to arbitration/avoid it by signing them to a cheaper deal (Saunders this year received a very small, relative to arbitration, salary increase due to him being injured, and didn't have a leg to stand on to fight for a larger payday, and no that wasn't meant to be a s***** pun). So, here's my list:

 

Osuna. Relief pitchers are notoriously unstable, with the exception of a few, and they're usually closers, or set-up men. Roberto has been our closer the past two years (his first two in the bigs, and I believe the first time above A ball, correct me if I'm wrong). He seems to have had essentially a similar year to his first, minus some hiccups here and there, which, he's human, it's to be expected, but in the playoffs, he was even better than last year, going 9.0 IP giving up 0, as in zero, runs, walked no one, and struck out 10, better than last post season. He pitched about as many innings and games this year as last, so it's fair to compare them. Of course we don't know how he'll be next year, no one can predict how a player will be, but if he remains as is, he could get expensive in arbitration, and quickly, especially if he keeps racking up saves, and making big leaguers look foolish. He's also young, very young for his success, by MLB standards, (I think he'll be 23), and some guys don't break into the bigs until around 25 give or take. So, he still has some pretty good years ahead of him. Even if his velocity begins to drop, as it does with many pitchers just due to age, he seems to know how to pitch, already has two good off speed pitches in his slider, and change-up, so he could adjust a bit more easily, since he can locate the ball pretty well. He's only entering his 3rd year, and unless he gets sent down, which I don't see happening, he'll be eligible for arbitration next off season. They could try to go with a one-year deal, and talk extension, or if he has another solid year, or even better now that he's had more experience around, I wouldn't mind seeing them buyout his arbitration years, and maybe a year of FA, or just the arbitration years, and some team options. To keep the AAV lower, and maybe have him accept, offer larger buyouts on the options, or give him signing bonuses that would be paid, say first day of April of each year, when they're in Florida, so he doesn't lose income tax. Worse case, I would go one year of arbitration (hopefully avoiding it) to see what he does in 2017, and then maybe a 3-4 year deal with 1-2 options on it depending on the guaranteed years and money, and maybe some signing bonuses or larger buyouts than the typical $250-500K ones.

 

Sanchez. If Cot's is correct, this is his last year before he'll be eligible for arbitration in the offseason. So, similar deal with Osuna. I would let him play this season out, see how it goes, and if he pitches like he did this year, or better yet, improves on it, showing no signs of fatigue, or regression, or injury, make a similar offer where his arbitration years are bought out, with possibly a year or two of FA, either guaranteed or via option(s). He's still young, and if he can reproduce what he did last year, and better yet improve, he's a force to lead the rotation, and could get expensive, so offering up some guaranteed years, with some options, and/or higher buyouts, might be worth it.

 

Stroman. He qualified as a Super Two and will be eligible for arbitration this offseason with a projection of about $3-3.5M depending on your source. Keep in mind, many of them have predicted big contracts for JB and EE, and well, yeah. He still has 3 arbitration years ahead of him, so his price will only go up. Since he does have the stuff to be successful, even at the top of the rotation, I would let this year play out and see if he can rebound from a back and forth kind of year last year. He's another guy I would offer a similar contract to like Osuna and Sanchez, buying out arbitration for guaranteed money, maybe a FA year or two, and/or some team or vesting option(s) (forgot to mention those before).

 

Pillar: Believe it or not, I would be tempted to give him a contract to lock him in. He'll be arbitration eligible for the first time this offseason, so it could be a see what happens, then see what he does next year before talking about buying out the last of his arbitration and a FA year or two. My method for this madness is, he'll only be 28 come ST, so he should have a few good years left, so why not try to get them for the Jays at a team friendly, but fair contract, to one of the games best defensive CFs, a guy with some speed, who's hit 66 2B since taking over full time, and if he can be a bit more patient, might be able to draw some more walks, hit for a little more power, and get on base just a bit more. Career OBP of .303 isn't horrible, especially since he'll likely hit lower in the lineup, and his defense is more of what the team wants, and anything offensively is a bonus. Again, maybe a 3-4 year contract that's team friendly, maybe some options, maybe higher buyouts on the options, maybe signing bonuses paid in ST, so less income tax taken out, and if we get someone else who comes up through the farm, or signed, or traded for, if he's on a team friendly contract, much like anyone on one, trading them will be easier. If he starts to decline and is forced into one of the corner OF spots, or a team wants a CF, they can have a cheaper alternative, and maybe some options on the contract.

 

Donaldson. OK technically he's not "young" in the sense of this thread being he just turned 31, and is under contract this year, with one more year of arbitration, but I wouldn't mind giving him another 2-3 year deal, with vesting or team options, especially since the team will need a new "face of the franchise" with EE gone, and who knows with Bautista, but rumours are he's only looking for a one year deal. 3 years makes him 34. EE had a pretty good year at 33, and if the team rotates guys, like Donaldson and others, to have some off days, or DH duties, he could still be a strong bat at 33 maybe 34. At worse he gets a contract that might be movable in a trade, and the Jays can get something of value back. I don't personally seeing him dropping off a cliff in the next few years, but his all out play might be a problem, so a few days at DH, or a schedule day off might be good, and could always come off the bench if needed.

 

Travis. He's a bit hard to get a grasp on. He was almost a lock for ROY before shoulder issues ended his season, and kept him out early this season. Good thing is they found out the problem and fixed it. He enjoyed a solid year, and exceeded expectation of some, and made the trade look like a complete steal by the Jays. in only 101 games and 410 ABs he hit 28 2B, 1 3B, 11HR, 50 RBI, hit an even .300 with a .332 OBP, while doing a pretty good job in the field. Then the knee issue started which was originally a bone bruise, then it was a bone bruise with cartilage being stuck in between the knee joint. This could be chalked up to a freak accident, or making a double play where he had to pivot on the leg, causing a tear. Hell, I tore a meniscus getting into my car. So, I would give him at least this year to see what he can bring. We know he's capable of being a solid offensive player at his position, and play at least average, if not above average defense, and either play out the first year of arbitration, or like the above, try to buyout the years, with an option or two, signing bonuses, combination thereof.

 

Just from what I've seen during the past couple of years, the players' work ethic, their ages, they're the ones I'd try to lock in for the core, and try to keep their contracts low, but fair, I know hard balancing act at times. We know we have some players who for the next 2-3 seasons will make $20M a year, we have some guys who might be lost on waivers, and a few FA next year, so if the Jays can lock them in at inexpensive rates, they can then have more money to go out on the FA market, resign other players, take on money in trades, know what the players are going to make for the next few years, giving them an advantage. If someone comes up through the system, and winds up being a better player, or via trade, or via FA, the contracts could make them easier to trade since it wouldn't be a large sum of money. We've seen some contracts that are getting handed out, so if we can keep some of the young core players in the fold, at cheaper prices, why not? Worse case the players regress, or start to slow down a bit, but then it's not a huge investment (depending on what the figures are), especially when compared to some contracts that players get, especially later in their careers (right side of 30, or some case 35), and then start to fade, and are shells of themselves, who are all but unmovable, and you're stuck.

 

Overall, I think it's a gamble no matter how you look at it. Most of the younger players are either under contract (Lourdes Gurriel if he pans out) for a low amount, or aren't FA eligible yet for a few more years, so there isn't a real sense of urgency. Well, maybe with Donaldson, if the team isn't competitive, or he enters the final year of arbitration without talk of an extension, or even if they start talking, he might want to test the waters like EE and JB, so he's the only question mark. The others, even Stroman who is arbitration eligible now, are either this season removed, and will hit arbitration for their first time and either way, even Stroman is under team control for years to come. They could wait a year or two of arbitration before talking contract extensions, but if they can land them for team friendly deals, that won't handcuff the team, and the players take it, and it gives us some of, if not, the best years of those players careers, I say go for it. No one knows what will happen, so that's a gamble, but even if there's a regression, injury, player can't live up to what they've done before, and are average or worse, then it's not like signing a FA to a high AAV and stuck with them for a few years, where if the contracts are fair on both sides, we might get a nice core, for a relatively fair amount of money, all entering their primes, while allowing the team to have money to use elsewhere to try and sustain a potential contender for a few years, or at least take a step back, regroup with some acquisitions, and still have a number of players there, so you're shopping list is smaller. It's almost a Catch-22 since you might get a great deal with some of that players best years, for an inexpensive rate (relative to some of the market values), or at worse, it winds up like a Hinske deal, where the player is average, or subaverage, and you have to just eat the money, which isn't nearly as much as market value could be.

 

I'd say start talking to their reps and the players to get an idea, and take it from there. See what you have in house for replacements, or who you could get as a replacement without gutting the farm or having to overpay (well, more so) on the market.

 

Going year by year is another option, like some have said, because an injury could make that year's salary lesser, but it could rise, and then you could be stuck with trying to sign the player before or when they hit FA if you don't have another replacement. Or like I said before, give them a deal, with options on the last one or two option years, and/or FA year and see.

 

Just my opinions. We don't need O'Brien.

 

Wow!

[TheHurl]

Now I live north of the border, selling things and coaching some ball.

 

Cool. I had a chance to show a guy from up your way to my Alma Mater. Did you coach Hunter Cunningham? Good kid

[vdartanian]

This is just my opinion, and might be shared by some, but some guys it might be a bit early to tell, and don't want to jump the gun on (see Hinske and Wells, though Wells, wasn't as bad, especially since AA somehow unloaded that contract) since you don't know if the player will regress or the league figure them out. I do like the idea of trying to get guys locked into fair, but team friendly deals, so it helps you know your budget with a bit more certainty years down the line, and if the player continues at their performance, wonderful, if they get even better, then it's a steal. On the other hand, you could wind up playing for a player who winds up injury plagued (sometimes that can't be helped, either it's just their body, or freak accidents, like JB getting his cleat stuck in the seem of the OF turn and straining his knee), or someone who doesn't live up to what they did before, or gets worse. But for sake of argument, and for the purposes of this thread, I'll throw out some names on who I would try to lock up, at least through arbitration, or a deal that includes team options for those years, so if the player doesn't have a good year, is injured, the team can decline the option, and either non-tender them, or go to arbitration/avoid it by signing them to a cheaper deal (Saunders this year received a very small, relative to arbitration, salary increase due to him being injured, and didn't have a leg to stand on to fight for a larger payday, and no that wasn't meant to be a s***** pun). So, here's my list:

 

Osuna. Relief pitchers are notoriously unstable, with the exception of a few, and they're usually closers, or set-up men. Roberto has been our closer the past two years (his first two in the bigs, and I believe the first time above A ball, correct me if I'm wrong). He seems to have had essentially a similar year to his first, minus some hiccups here and there, which, he's human, it's to be expected, but in the playoffs, he was even better than last year, going 9.0 IP giving up 0, as in zero, runs, walked no one, and struck out 10, better than last post season. He pitched about as many innings and games this year as last, so it's fair to compare them. Of course we don't know how he'll be next year, no one can predict how a player will be, but if he remains as is, he could get expensive in arbitration, and quickly, especially if he keeps racking up saves, and making big leaguers look foolish. He's also young, very young for his success, by MLB standards, (I think he'll be 23), and some guys don't break into the bigs until around 25 give or take. So, he still has some pretty good years ahead of him. Even if his velocity begins to drop, as it does with many pitchers just due to age, he seems to know how to pitch, already has two good off speed pitches in his slider, and change-up, so he could adjust a bit more easily, since he can locate the ball pretty well. He's only entering his 3rd year, and unless he gets sent down, which I don't see happening, he'll be eligible for arbitration next off season. They could try to go with a one-year deal, and talk extension, or if he has another solid year, or even better now that he's had more experience around, I wouldn't mind seeing them buyout his arbitration years, and maybe a year of FA, or just the arbitration years, and some team options. To keep the AAV lower, and maybe have him accept, offer larger buyouts on the options, or give him signing bonuses that would be paid, say first day of April of each year, when they're in Florida, so he doesn't lose income tax. Worse case, I would go one year of arbitration (hopefully avoiding it) to see what he does in 2017, and then maybe a 3-4 year deal with 1-2 options on it depending on the guaranteed years and money, and maybe some signing bonuses or larger buyouts than the typical $250-500K ones.

 

Sanchez. If Cot's is correct, this is his last year before he'll be eligible for arbitration in the offseason. So, similar deal with Osuna. I would let him play this season out, see how it goes, and if he pitches like he did this year, or better yet, improves on it, showing no signs of fatigue, or regression, or injury, make a similar offer where his arbitration years are bought out, with possibly a year or two of FA, either guaranteed or via option(s). He's still young, and if he can reproduce what he did last year, and better yet improve, he's a force to lead the rotation, and could get expensive, so offering up some guaranteed years, with some options, and/or higher buyouts, might be worth it.

 

Stroman. He qualified as a Super Two and will be eligible for arbitration this offseason with a projection of about $3-3.5M depending on your source. Keep in mind, many of them have predicted big contracts for JB and EE, and well, yeah. He still has 3 arbitration years ahead of him, so his price will only go up. Since he does have the stuff to be successful, even at the top of the rotation, I would let this year play out and see if he can rebound from a back and forth kind of year last year. He's another guy I would offer a similar contract to like Osuna and Sanchez, buying out arbitration for guaranteed money, maybe a FA year or two, and/or some team or vesting option(s) (forgot to mention those before).

 

Pillar: Believe it or not, I would be tempted to give him a contract to lock him in. He'll be arbitration eligible for the first time this offseason, so it could be a see what happens, then see what he does next year before talking about buying out the last of his arbitration and a FA year or two. My method for this madness is, he'll only be 28 come ST, so he should have a few good years left, so why not try to get them for the Jays at a team friendly, but fair contract, to one of the games best defensive CFs, a guy with some speed, who's hit 66 2B since taking over full time, and if he can be a bit more patient, might be able to draw some more walks, hit for a little more power, and get on base just a bit more. Career OBP of .303 isn't horrible, especially since he'll likely hit lower in the lineup, and his defense is more of what the team wants, and anything offensively is a bonus. Again, maybe a 3-4 year contract that's team friendly, maybe some options, maybe higher buyouts on the options, maybe signing bonuses paid in ST, so less income tax taken out, and if we get someone else who comes up through the farm, or signed, or traded for, if he's on a team friendly contract, much like anyone on one, trading them will be easier. If he starts to decline and is forced into one of the corner OF spots, or a team wants a CF, they can have a cheaper alternative, and maybe some options on the contract.

 

Donaldson. OK technically he's not "young" in the sense of this thread being he just turned 31, and is under contract this year, with one more year of arbitration, but I wouldn't mind giving him another 2-3 year deal, with vesting or team options, especially since the team will need a new "face of the franchise" with EE gone, and who knows with Bautista, but rumours are he's only looking for a one year deal. 3 years makes him 34. EE had a pretty good year at 33, and if the team rotates guys, like Donaldson and others, to have some off days, or DH duties, he could still be a strong bat at 33 maybe 34. At worse he gets a contract that might be movable in a trade, and the Jays can get something of value back. I don't personally seeing him dropping off a cliff in the next few years, but his all out play might be a problem, so a few days at DH, or a schedule day off might be good, and could always come off the bench if needed.

 

Travis. He's a bit hard to get a grasp on. He was almost a lock for ROY before shoulder issues ended his season, and kept him out early this season. Good thing is they found out the problem and fixed it. He enjoyed a solid year, and exceeded expectation of some, and made the trade look like a complete steal by the Jays. in only 101 games and 410 ABs he hit 28 2B, 1 3B, 11HR, 50 RBI, hit an even .300 with a .332 OBP, while doing a pretty good job in the field. Then the knee issue started which was originally a bone bruise, then it was a bone bruise with cartilage being stuck in between the knee joint. This could be chalked up to a freak accident, or making a double play where he had to pivot on the leg, causing a tear. Hell, I tore a meniscus getting into my car. So, I would give him at least this year to see what he can bring. We know he's capable of being a solid offensive player at his position, and play at least average, if not above average defense, and either play out the first year of arbitration, or like the above, try to buyout the years, with an option or two, signing bonuses, combination thereof.

 

Just from what I've seen during the past couple of years, the players' work ethic, their ages, they're the ones I'd try to lock in for the core, and try to keep their contracts low, but fair, I know hard balancing act at times. We know we have some players who for the next 2-3 seasons will make $20M a year, we have some guys who might be lost on waivers, and a few FA next year, so if the Jays can lock them in at inexpensive rates, they can then have more money to go out on the FA market, resign other players, take on money in trades, know what the players are going to make for the next few years, giving them an advantage. If someone comes up through the system, and winds up being a better player, or via trade, or via FA, the contracts could make them easier to trade since it wouldn't be a large sum of money. We've seen some contracts that are getting handed out, so if we can keep some of the young core players in the fold, at cheaper prices, why not? Worse case the players regress, or start to slow down a bit, but then it's not a huge investment (depending on what the figures are), especially when compared to some contracts that players get, especially later in their careers (right side of 30, or some case 35), and then start to fade, and are shells of themselves, who are all but unmovable, and you're stuck.

 

Overall, I think it's a gamble no matter how you look at it. Most of the younger players are either under contract (Lourdes Gurriel if he pans out) for a low amount, or aren't FA eligible yet for a few more years, so there isn't a real sense of urgency. Well, maybe with Donaldson, if the team isn't competitive, or he enters the final year of arbitration without talk of an extension, or even if they start talking, he might want to test the waters like EE and JB, so he's the only question mark. The others, even Stroman who is arbitration eligible now, are either this season removed, and will hit arbitration for their first time and either way, even Stroman is under team control for years to come. They could wait a year or two of arbitration before talking contract extensions, but if they can land them for team friendly deals, that won't handcuff the team, and the players take it, and it gives us some of, if not, the best years of those players careers, I say go for it. No one knows what will happen, so that's a gamble, but even if there's a regression, injury, player can't live up to what they've done before, and are average or worse, then it's not like signing a FA to a high AAV and stuck with them for a few years, where if the contracts are fair on both sides, we might get a nice core, for a relatively fair amount of money, all entering their primes, while allowing the team to have money to use elsewhere to try and sustain a potential contender for a few years, or at least take a step back, regroup with some acquisitions, and still have a number of players there, so you're shopping list is smaller. It's almost a Catch-22 since you might get a great deal with some of that players best years, for an inexpensive rate (relative to some of the market values), or at worse, it winds up like a Hinske deal, where the player is average, or subaverage, and you have to just eat the money, which isn't nearly as much as market value could be.

 

I'd say start talking to their reps and the players to get an idea, and take it from there. See what you have in house for replacements, or who you could get as a replacement without gutting the farm or having to overpay (well, more so) on the market.

 

Going year by year is another option, like some have said, because an injury could make that year's salary lesser, but it could rise, and then you could be stuck with trying to sign the player before or when they hit FA if you don't have another replacement. Or like I said before, give them a deal, with options on the last one or two option years, and/or FA year and see.

 

Just my opinions. We don't need O'Brien.

 

That's quite the catharsis to be having over Pete O'Brien, anyways...

 

[jays4life19]

That's quite the catharsis to be having over Pete O'Brien, anyways...

 

 

 

Haha that gif is awesome but you missed the joke.