Official MiLB/Prospects Thread

[Bobthe4th]

The end result was fine short-term, but it was a pretty big hail mary. Then the team needed Sanchez to go from "is he a reliever or starter long-term??" to Cy Young contender, plus Happ and Estrada having career seasons to barely get to the playoffs the following season.

You're conveniently ignoring the offense being worse than anticipated last year, it's not like the starters being better than expected meant it was a shock to make the playoffs. Nothing is guaranteed of course, but we had a good chance of making the playoffs.

 

Will people really remember the Bat Flip three years from now when the team is potentially in the middle of a rebuild and possibly coming off 3-4 seasons without making the playoffs?

 

Any Jays fan who watched that game will remember the bat flip for the rest of their life. I know I will!

 

When you make moves for one season, some times that's all you're going to get. Luckily some smart moves and Sanchez breaking out prolonged the success for another season, but it was about as short sighted a trade deadline....hell, short sighted over a three year period (2013-15) that I have seen.

 

Let's see how sustainable attendance is if/when the team falls back. Short-term it was a boom.

 

Yes it was short term, yes it was a gamble, yes it would never have happened if AA's contract wasn't expiring. But it worked. We did make the playoffs 2 years in a row. We've still got a team that could contend to make the playoffs in the next 2 to 3 years (including this one) before Vlad, Bo etc make it here, without having to completely blow up the side. Even if you think we're not going to compete this year or next, we've got the assets to retool not rebuild.

 

Again, if the trades didn't happen we've have missed the playoffs, Shapiro and Atkins would almost certainly have gone full rebuild, and we'd be in the middle of a second 90-100 loss season in a row, and likely years away from competing, without any of those great memories from 2 playoff runs.

 

It was a big gamble under unique circumstances, that shouldn't be repeated, but it worked and to complain about it now is ignoring all the benefits we're still seeing now IMO.

[Daniel Labude]

If the Jays were 20 games over .500 when AA made those deadline deals, then I'd probably be more understanding, but he made them when the Jays were a game under .500 with 60 games to go and something like 8 back of the division. They went 42-14 after the 50-51 mark (before dropping 4 of the last 5 games that meant nothing since they won the division already). That's a freakin .750 winning percentage. As great as their run differential was before the trades, who saw that coming?

 

The end result was fine short-term, but it was a pretty big hail mary. Then the team needed Sanchez to go from "is he a reliever or starter long-term??" to Cy Young contender, plus Happ and Estrada having career seasons to barely get to the playoffs the following season. Will people really remember the Bat Flip three years from now when the team is potentially in the middle of a rebuild and possibly coming off 3-4 seasons without making the playoffs?

 

When you make moves for one season, some times that's all you're going to get. Luckily some smart moves and Sanchez breaking out prolonged the success for another season, but it was about as short sighted a trade deadline....hell, short sighted over a three year period (2013-15) that I have seen.

 

Let's see how sustainable attendance is if/when the team falls back. Short-term it was a boom.

 

Yes it was worth it and yes the trades have hurt us now...the key is to make the right moves going forward. We have a luxury that some teams who go all in don't get...a chance to rebuild quickly 1-2 years to get bak into contention. All due to our young core of Stroman, Sanchez, Osuna, Travis (when healthy), and prospects like Vlad, Bo, Alford, Gurriel, and a few others. Add to that, we have a bunch of trade pieces to replinish the farm with top level talent or even major league young talent. Trading Donaldson, Estrada, Happ, Liriano, Smith, Osuna (unlikely but could), and Pillar could net us enough talent that with a couple FA signings we are World Series Contenders in a year or two. It all depends on what moves we make and when, from here on out.

[LGBJ29]

For those who want to watch this another thousand times, this edit is legendary

 

[billjc33]

Question for you guys. What's the outlook on Edward Olivares? 21 in low A. 14 doubles, 8 triples, 10 hr with 14 sb's. Seems like he has lots of tools but doesn't get talked about behind the big 2. Only played 15 games last year and 53 in the last 2 after hitting .313 in the DSL as a 17 year old.

[Laika]

Question for you guys. What's the outlook on Edward Olivares? 21 in low A. 14 doubles, 8 triples, 10 hr with 14 sb's. Seems like he has lots of tools but doesn't get talked about behind the big 2. Only played 15 games last year and 53 in the last 2 after hitting .313 in the DSL as a 17 year old.

 

I can't find anything about him, at least not any sort of legitimate scouting report. He wasn't a highly ranked international prospect.

 

You can infer from his assignment to Lansing that Toronto thinks something of him.

[Brownie19]

Question for you guys. What's the outlook on Edward Olivares? 21 in low A. 14 doubles, 8 triples, 10 hr with 14 sb's. Seems like he has lots of tools but doesn't get talked about behind the big 2. Only played 15 games last year and 53 in the last 2 after hitting .313 in the DSL as a 17 year old.

 

I've asked a few times about him. Everyone talks about Palacios, yet he's been s*** and Olivares has been very good this year at a similar age.

[Brownie19]

Just realised Brendan Rodgers was hitting .400 in A+ ball this year (he's been called up to AA now) with a 2.7% BB% (6 walks in 222 PA's). It's damn hard to hit .400 with a .417 OBP.

 

Does this raise concerns about his approach? or when you're that good in A+ ball, you just hit everything in sight and never walk? 7.1% BB% last year in a full season of A ball.

[Dr. Dinger]

Just realised Brendan Rodgers was hitting .400 in A+ ball this year (he's been called up to AA now) with a 2.7% BB% (6 walks in 222 PA's). It's damn hard to hit .400 with a .417 OBP.

 

Does this raise concerns about his approach? or when you're that good in A+ ball, you just hit everything in sight and never walk? 7.1% BB% last year in a full season of A ball.

 

I was talking about this with BTS the other day, our theory is that the pitchers in A+ don't have very good secondaries, so they mostly throw fastballs and Rodgers has just been teeing off rather than waiting around.

[Spanky__99]

For those who want to watch this another thousand times, this edit is legendary

 

 

Laser show!

[TheHurl]

Just realised Brendan Rodgers was hitting .400 in A+ ball this year (he's been called up to AA now) with a 2.7% BB% (6 walks in 222 PA's). It's damn hard to hit .400 with a .417 OBP.

 

Does this raise concerns about his approach? or when you're that good in A+ ball, you just hit everything in sight and never walk? 7.1% BB% last year in a full season of A ball.

 

As long as he's not k'ing it's fine. It's all tough to tell no matter what as the Hangar is the most extreme park anywhere. His road split is .299/.303/.514 in 107 PA's. Yonathan Daza put up two years of .740 OPS in the SALLY and is hitting .364/383/.460 line in Lancaster. Sam Hilliard is a non Spect and putting up .309/.399/.551 there. This isn't to take away from Rodgers who I think it's a great prospect, just saying the stat line doesn't tell the story.

[Brownie19]

For those who want to watch this another thousand times, this edit is legendary

 

 

Is there anyway to save this video off twitter? (have mercy on my old, non-technical ass please)

[Slade]

Is there anyway to save this video off twitter? (have mercy on my old, non-technical ass please)

 

Here is the site to download the video. Use the link below.

 

http://twittervideodownloader.com/download

 

[Stoneyen]

Bo and Vlad went 0-9 combined last night in their first game back from the ASG.

 

Get these guys to Dunedin already

[John_Havok]

Bo and Vlad went 0-9 combined last night in their first game back from the ASG.

 

Get these guys to Dunedin already

 

I dunno. ... 0 for 9, they're clearly struggling with the level they are at

[admin]

I think NJH or someone earlier posted Bichette/Vlad comparison to Trout and other guys at that level. Can you post it again?

 

Since the first month where Bichette hit .370, he's been hitting .401 in his last two months (40 games). That's insane.

In 58 games he's .392/.457/1.085ops

Trout in 80 games was .362/.454/.979

Both as 18 year olds. Trout went up to A+.

Before the season Trout was ranked #98 by BA and #53 by BP.

After the sesaon he was ranked #2.

I don't know how his glove is but you'd have to think both Vlad and Bichette should be in the top 10, Vlad top 5?

[43211234]

Bo and Vlad went 0-9 combined last night in their first game back from the ASG.

 

Get these guys to Dunedin already

 

3 for 5 tonight including double #29 on the season in game #59.

 

 

SRF had a solid start. 7IP, no runs, 4 hits, 2 BB, 5K, 10-3 GO-FO

 

 

Kevin Smith with 6 Ks in his first two pro games. Bust!

[Laika]

I think NJH or someone earlier posted Bichette/Vlad comparison to Trout and other guys at that level. Can you post it again?

 

Since the first month where Bichette hit .370, he's been hitting .401 in his last two months (40 games). That's insane.

In 58 games he's .392/.457/1.085ops

Trout in 80 games was .362/.454/.979

Both as 18 year olds. Trout went up to A+.

Before the season Trout was ranked #98 by BA and #53 by BP.

After the sesaon he was ranked #2.

I don't know how his glove is but you'd have to think both Vlad and Bichette should be in the top 10, Vlad top 5?

 

Bo won't get quite that much love.

 

My favourite player to compare him to right now is Mookie Betts. So many similarities. The swings are more similar than most realize (including the swing path). A lot of the tools are comparable; Mookie has more speed but Bo might have a bit more pop. The defensive profile and developmental path might be identical (we'll see). I think Mookie is a really fair comp for Bo's upside.

 

Mookie in 2013 had a year like Bo's, that made prospectophiles cream their pants. .314/.417/.506 with 15 HR and 38 SB, while playing the infield, split between A and A+ as a 20 year old. Not as eye-popping as Bo's slashline and he was one year older BUT Mookie was uber-elite in an important way that Bo hasn't been: Mookie had 81 walks and only 57 strikeouts in 127 games. He was clearly special, much like Bo is now clearly special.

 

BA and MLB.com ranked Mookie 75th and 62nd heading into 2014. I don't think BP even ranked him!

 

Bo might get slightly better treatment but I would still not expect him to crack any list's top 25... could be wrong.

 

In my books (which are the best books) he's already in the elite. Most evaluators and rankers will fail to grasp the statistical significance of what he is doing this year. They'll treat it much the same as they'd treat a 20 year old hitting .320/.420/.520 in the same league. Just thrown into the "really really good!" bucket.

[admin]

Bo won't get quite that much love.

 

My favourite player to compare him to right now is Mookie Betts. So many similarities. The swings are more similar than most realize (including the swing path). A lot of the tools are comparable; Mookie has more speed but Bo might have a bit more pop. The defensive profile and developmental path might be identical (we'll see). I think Mookie is a really fair comp for Bo's upside.

 

Mookie in 2013 had a year like Bo's, that made prospectophiles cream their pants. .314/.417/.506 with 15 HR and 38 SB, while playing the infield, split between A and A+ as a 20 year old. Not as eye-popping as Bo's slashline and he was one year older BUT Mookie was uber-elite in an important way that Bo hasn't been: Mookie had 81 walks and only 57 strikeouts in 127 games. He was clearly special, much like Bo is now clearly special.

 

BA and MLB.com ranked Mookie 75th and 62nd heading into 2014. I don't think BP even ranked him!

 

Bo might get slightly better treatment but I would still not expect him to crack any list's top 25... could be wrong.

 

In my books (which are the best books) he's already in the elite. Most evaluators and rankers will fail to grasp the statistical significance of what he is doing this year. They'll treat it much the same as they'd treat a 20 year old hitting .320/.420/.520 in the same league. Just thrown into the "really really good!" bucket.

 

I could see that, but I could also see him getting some recognition. I mean right now he's not just among the top in the league, he's on another level. I guess how the rest of the year goes will play a factor as well.

[Ray]

Another bad outing for Jon Harris: 4.2IP 7H 4ER 6BB 2K

 

Sean Reid-Foley had a really nice outing last night though: 7IP 4H 2BB 0ER

[Laika]

Must read Bo profile.

 

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/big-read-know-blue-jays-prospect-bo-bichette/

[jays_fever]

He needs to be legit, I don't think I can handle another Russ Adams situation all over again

[John_Havok]

He needs to be legit, I don't think I can handle another Russ Adams situation all over again

 

It should give you hope that Bichette has insanely better numbers while being 2 years younger than Adams as at low A.

[Stoneyen]

Must read Bo profile.

 

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/big-read-know-blue-jays-prospect-bo-bichette/

 

I'm sold.

[bronson44]

Must read Bo profile.

 

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/big-read-know-blue-jays-prospect-bo-bichette/

 

“My goal is to be the best player that’s ever been on Earth,”

[Daniel Labude]

Must read Bo profile.

 

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/big-read-know-blue-jays-prospect-bo-bichette/

 

Thanks for posting...it was a great read

[THANOS]

Must read Bo profile.

 

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/big-read-know-blue-jays-prospect-bo-bichette/

 

That was an unBOlievable read. Thanks for that NJH. That batflip story had me dying LOL.

[Daniel Labude]

Is Vlad hurt? Left the game yesterday and isn't playing today

[admin]

Bo seems pretty arrogant.

I remember a sports psychologist from 10-15 years ago and he said he's interviewed some of the best athletes in various sports when they were younger. And he said guys who turned out to be superstars always wanted to be the best player in the league when they were older. While the others just wanted to make the pros. Was pretty interesting.

[Sorrow]

Is Vlad hurt? Left the game yesterday and isn't playing today

 

Got spiked.

[burlingtonbandit]

Bo seems pretty arrogant.

I remember a sports psychologist from 10-15 years ago and he said he's interviewed some of the best athletes in various sports when they were younger. And he said guys who turned out to be superstars always wanted to be the best player in the league when they were older. While the others just wanted to make the pros. Was pretty interesting.

 

He definitely is. Certainly seems that way when you look around.

 

Donaldson, Bonds, MJ.. I guess Trout is the super nice guy but they all have that drive to be the best.