AA on PTS

[Chappy]

I'm open to giving Smoak a chance, especially consider we now have some leeway with our lineup, we can afford to take a gamble on Smoak.

[Angrioter]

I'm open to giving Smoak a chance, especially consider we now have some leeway with our lineup, we can afford to take a gamble on Smoak.

 

Power hitta + high walk rate = Bautista, Edwin, Donaldson

 

Smoak could be next

[L54]

Not quite yet since Sanchez was gonna be shut down anyway last season. I think this is the plan for Castro as well. He'll start in Dunedin or NH and if he's doing well, they'll call him up to finish the year in the MLB bullpen.

 

I do agree with everyone that Sanchez should be a starter in Buffalo to start next year and should only be used out of the BP towards the end of the year.

 

We'll see what happens.

 

Ya you're right I didn't say that properly. I was just referring to Sanchez being in the bullpen to start this year, and my concerns with how that may hinder his development.

[Chappy]

Despite the fact that his career has been a steaming pile of poo?

 

Did you say that about Bautista and EE too? Smoak has potential, don't be so obtuse.

[burlingtonbandit]

Everth Cabrera could be interesting as a plug at 2B until Travis comes up honestly. More upside than, say, Izturis, and can handle SS if Reyes dies.

 

IS he expected to be non-tendered? Didn't he get busted for PEDs recently.

[Chappy]

Please don't throw out those comparisons. Both Bautista and Edwin changed there swings dramatically.

 

And?

[Chappy]

Sure I would love Smoak to take of with us. I just would prefer more of a sure thing. He was good waiver pickup.

 

He is fine if we get a sure thing in LF and/or 2B. If AA constructs the bench properly, we can take a gamble on Smoak and still have other options available.

[ElNik2013]

I'm open to giving Smoak a chance, especially consider we now have some leeway with our lineup, we can afford to take a gamble on Smoak.

 

 

 

Bluebird Banter looking into whether there's fire where there is Smoak:

 

 

 

http://www.bluebirdbanter.com/2014/12/1/7184561/what-of-justin-smoak

[RealAccountant]

Details of smoaks stats show how miserable the guy was at safeco

[Ultimate]

Please don't throw out those comparisons. Both Bautista and Edwin changed there swings dramatically.

 

Both Bautista and Edwin finished the 2nd grade too.

[Ultimate]

Details of smoaks stats show how miserable the guy was at safeco

 

He still wasn't very good on the road last season or in his career.

 

THat being said I am okay with giving him a shot, The Skydome could have more of an impact than expected.

[Ultimate]

The Sports Room @TSRamadan

AA on PTS: "Would be ok with a Pillar/Pompey platoon at CF and/or Goins/Travis/Izturis at 2B."

"

 

That is not even close to what he said. Whoever is tweeting this shouldn't use quotation marks if he isn't actually quoting AA.

 

Never said anything about a Pompey/Pillar platoon. Said he would be okay with Pillar or Pompey in CF if the rest of the offense was strong.

 

I would have to think platooning a young promising switch hitter would not be a consideration. Either he plays every day or he goes to AAA.

[Dick_Pole]

About Castro. If he can throw 100 MPH and there is a need for him in the BP, then he absolutely gets put there in 2015. The team is trying to compete and must put the best roster together possible. No point in spending too much time on development for a guy who can throw that hard. We know the majority of these flamethrowers are living on borrowed time so the Jays might as well get some MLB use out of him before he blows out his arm rather than him blowing out his arm in the minors.

[ineedsheet]

What kind of damage would it do long term to have a guy out of the pen for the whole year instead of maturing as a SP in aaa? I understand bringing guys like that up in August or September to watch innings. Maybe it's very minimal, but it seems long term they would be better off getting the innings.

 

i don't think there is any evidence to suggest that pitching in relief short-term limits a pitcher's ability to become a successful starting pitcher in the majors.

[ineedsheet]

 

I would have to think platooning a young promising switch hitter would not be a consideration. Either he plays every day or he goes to AAA.

 

i'd normally agree, but the blue jays are not in 'development mode' right now. we are in win-now mode, which means that we should use any and all resources to win. pompey is a better hitter left handed bottom line. was in the minors, and in his short stint in the majors. he will get enough major league ABs in garbage time and short bench situations to work on his right, and when he shows he can hit better than pillar right handed, he will win the job outright. until then, pillar is putting up very respectable numbers on the right side with apparently very respectable defense as well.

 

i think this is AA's plan for CF, and LF and 2B will need to be addressed.

 

as for 1b, i think it will be a valencia/smoak platoon and will remain that way until it becomes a disater or someone gets hurt.

[burlingtonbandit]

About Castro. If he can throw 100 MPH and there is a need for him in the BP, then he absolutely gets put there in 2015. The team is trying to compete and must put the best roster together possible. No point in spending too much time on development for a guy who can throw that hard. We know the majority of these flamethrowers are living on borrowed time so the Jays might as well get some MLB use out of him before he blows out his arm rather than him blowing out his arm in the minors.

 

I agree with this. Pitching is so volatile that if you can get value out of a pitcher you should do it. You never know when injuries happen and pitchers don't really improve much when moving up levels in the minor leagues. At least compared to position players.

[burlingtonbandit]

i'd normally agree, but the blue jays are not in 'development mode' right now. we are in win-now mode, which means that we should use any and all resources to win. pompey is a better hitter left handed bottom line. was in the minors, and in his short stint in the majors. he will get enough major league ABs in garbage time and short bench situations to work on his right, and when he shows he can hit better than pillar right handed, he will win the job outright. until then, pillar is putting up very respectable numbers on the right side with apparently very respectable defense as well.

 

i think this is AA's plan for CF, and LF and 2B will need to be addressed.

 

as for 1b, i think it will be a valencia/smoak platoon and will remain that way until it becomes a disater or someone gets hurt.

 

Having multiple platoon really limits your roster though. You can stretch it to having 2 platoons but if you are relying on 3 it kills the bench. My guess is Pompey is the everyday CF and Pillar is the 4th OF. I think one of Mayberry/Valencia gets non tendered because if you plan to rotate your regulars at DH for some games then a platoon at DH/1B is a waste.

[ineedsheet]

Having multiple platoon really limits your roster though. You can stretch it to having 2 platoons but if you are relying on 3 it kills the bench. My guess is Pompey is the everyday CF and Pillar is the 4th OF. I think one of Mayberry/Valencia gets non tendered because if you plan to rotate your regulars at DH for some games then a platoon at DH/1B is a waste.

 

how does it kill the bench at all? a platoon does no such thing, as their platoonmate becomes the bench player.

 

why would valencia get non-tendered when he is probably the 5th best hitter on the team against lefties and an above average 1b defender?

[burlingtonbandit]

how does it kill the bench at all? a platoon does no such thing, as their platoonmate becomes the bench player.

 

why would valencia get non-tendered when he is probably the 5th best hitter on the team against lefties and an above average 1b defender?

 

Well say you have the lineup like this:

 

Reyes

Martin

Bautista

EE

Donaldson

Smoak/Valencia

Dirks/Mayberry

Pompey

Goins/Izturis

 

And come the 6th inning the other team brings a LHP out of the pen with 0 outs to face Smoak, Dirks, Pompey and Izturis. If you bring in the opposite platoonmate for each of those hitters then the opposing team will have a huge advantage later in the game when they can easily bring in a RHP to face Valencia/Mayberry/Izturis and also Donaldson because he is much worse against RHP. This will also be in the 9th inning which will severely limit your chance of scoring runs.

 

This scenario happened more than a few times last year and Gibby really had no options but to sit and watch guys like Tolleson fail miserably vs RHP.

 

My suggestion would be to keep MAyberry because he has a much better track record of hitting LHP while not relying on a huge BABIP and he can also play 1B as well as LF.

[ineedsheet]

Well say you have the lineup like this:

 

Reyes

Martin

Bautista

EE

Donaldson

Smoak/Valencia

Dirks/Mayberry

Pompey

Goins/Izturis

 

And come the 6th inning the other team brings a LHP out of the pen with 0 outs to face Smoak, Dirks, Pompey and Izturis. If you bring in the opposite platoonmate for each of those hitters then the opposing team will have a huge advantage later in the game when they can easily bring in a RHP to face Valencia/Mayberry/Izturis and also Donaldson because he is much worse against RHP. This will also be in the 9th inning which will severely limit your chance of scoring runs.

 

This scenario happened more than a few times last year and Gibby really had no options but to sit and watch guys like Tolleson fail miserably vs RHP.

 

My suggestion would be to keep MAyberry because he has a much better track record of hitting LHP while not relying on a huge BABIP and he can also play 1B as well as LF.

 

you are overstating this completely. this can happen to any team, platoon or not. and you can still have bench players beyond the platoon mates.

[burlingtonbandit]

you are overstating this completely. this can happen to any team, platoon or not. and you can still have bench players beyond the platoon mates.

 

How am I overstating this? This is a very real scenario and would happen frequently. And you do know there are only 4 Bench spots right? 1 being the backup catcher and 3 for platoons leaves nothing else.

[L54]

i don't think there is any evidence to suggest that pitching in relief short-term limits a pitcher's ability to become a successful starting pitcher in the majors.

 

You're probably right. But if he spends the whole year in the pen (which I wouldn't put past AA), what happens to him next year? You essentially would have to use him as a long man/6th starter next year to limit his innings to ~120.

 

I'd rather find out that Sanchez can't cut it as a starter, than having him bounce back and forth between the pen and rotation/AAA for the next few seasons. Give the kid some rope in AAA to start the year, give the team some SP depth. As JFaS pointed out earlier, a BP only really needs 2 above average BP arms. AA should be able to get a couple more guys through FA/waiver wire/trades. No need to have Sanchez start this year in the pen.

[ineedsheet]

How am I overstating this? This is a very real scenario and would happen frequently. And you do know there are only 4 Bench spots right? 1 being the backup catcher and 3 for platoons leaves nothing else.

 

you're overstating this because this scenario does not happen enough for it to influence many games, if at all. and in the times it does, there will still be times that we get hits off difficult pitching matchups... generally when players are pinch hit for late in games, they often do not come up again to bat, and if they do that means we have scored some runs

 

oakland ran platoons all over the field and they scored 730 runs..in a pitchers park.

 

the benefit of a platoon earlier in the game vs the starting pitcher outweighs the leverage lost later in the game..

 

i am not the only one who thinks this, baseball in general is platooning more than ever.

[burlingtonbandit]

you're overstating this because this scenario does not happen enough for it to influence many games, if at all. and in the times it does, there will still be times that we get hits off difficult pitching matchups... generally when players are pinch hit for late in games, they often do not come up again to bat, and if they do that means we have scored some runs

 

oakland ran platoons all over the field and they scored 730 runs..in a pitchers park.

 

the benefit of a platoon earlier in the game vs the starting pitcher outweighs the leverage lost later in the game..

 

i am not the only one who thinks this, baseball in general is platooning more than ever.

 

I love platoons as much as anyone and think 2 full time would work just fine. Im saying having 3 full time platoons really limits your bench and why having Valencia stick around as a platoon DH is a waste of a roster spot when you have Mayberry and Pillar on the 25 man roster.

[ineedsheet]

I love platoons as much as anyone and think 2 full time would work just fine. Im saying having 3 full time platoons really limits your bench and why having Valencia stick around as a platoon DH is a waste of a roster spot when you have Mayberry and Pillar on the 25 man roster.

 

are you implying that mayberry and pillar are better platoon candidates than valencia?

 

valencia plays above average D at 1b and can also play 3b. he would not be a "platoon DH". EE has stated his preference to DH this season, and valencia/smoak are better defenders so why would you even think he would be platooning at DH?

 

he also holds a career .327/.368/.502 (138 wRC+) vs lefties.

 

mayberry: .269/.324/.533 (130 wRC+)

pillar: .275/.314/.425 (102 wRC+)

 

why on earth would you keep either of these players vs valencia?

[ineedsheet]

You're probably right. But if he spends the whole year in the pen (which I wouldn't put past AA), what happens to him next year? You essentially would have to use him as a long man/6th starter next year to limit his innings to ~120.

 

I'd rather find out that Sanchez can't cut it as a starter, than having him bounce back and forth between the pen and rotation/AAA for the next few seasons. Give the kid some rope in AAA to start the year, give the team some SP depth. As JFaS pointed out earlier, a BP only really needs 2 above average BP arms. AA should be able to get a couple more guys through FA/waiver wire/trades. No need to have Sanchez start this year in the pen.

 

i dont think making sanchez a reliever this year would affect his ability to start next season at all.

 

wainwright threw 202 ip the season after he was a closer in st louis

[burlingtonbandit]

i dont think making sanchez a reliever this year would affect his ability to start next season at all.

 

wainwright threw 202 ip the season after he was a closer in st louis

 

For every Wainwright there is a Daniel Bard or Feliz that it did not work out.

[ineedsheet]

For every Wainwright there is a Daniel Bard or Feliz that it did not work out.

 

this is an irrelevant argument--daniel bard din't work out as a PITCHER period, reliever or not. absolutely nothing to suggest his early stint as a reliever hindered anything.

 

feliz got hurt. he was better suited as a reliever to begin with.

[burlingtonbandit]

this is an irrelevant argument--daniel bard din't work out as a PITCHER period, reliever or not. absolutely nothing to suggest his early stint as a reliever hindered anything.

 

feliz got hurt. he was better suited as a reliever to begin with.

 

Could say the same thing about Sanchez...

[ineedsheet]

Could say the same thing about Sanchez...

 

i love this carousel (circular logic) you love to take people on in your arguments--i never argued once that sanchez would be better as a starter or reliever..

 

i simply argued that making him a reliever this year would not mitigate his chances of being an effective SP in the future.. there is no real evidence pointing that out

 

real evidence would be a reliever, who struggled the very next season in becoming a starter than became an effective one later on