Reyes on Lawrie " "I don't know what jays were thinking, trying to move him to 2B"

[Angrioter]

Reyes on getting a full season to play with Lawrie to his right. "I don't know what the #bluejays were thinking, trying to move him to 2B."

[Anemic0ffense]

Does anyone know what they're thinking?

[awsomest]

They Don't

[jays4life19]

Reyes on getting a full season to play with Lawrie to his right. "I don't know what the #bluejays were thinking, trying to move him to 2B."

 

Doesn't hurt to try. We were in last place and it's much easier to find a 3rd basemen then a 2nd basemen. Ryan Goins projected to be our 2014 2nd basemen is proof of that.

[Jimcanuck]

Doesn't hurt to try. We were in last place and it's much easier to find a 3rd basemen then a 2nd basemen. Ryan Goins projected to be our 2014 2nd basemen is proof of that.

 

Bats to 3rd, Lawrie to 2B, Gose to RF is the best team on paper

[Convo]

Reyes on getting a full season to play with Lawrie to his right. "I don't know what the #bluejays were thinking, trying to move him to 2B."

 

This is exactly what I was thinking... WHAT WERE THEY THINKING. Lawrie is a brilliant 3B.

[Olerud363]

Reyes on getting a full season to play with Lawrie to his right. "I don't know what the #bluejays were thinking, trying to move him to 2B."

 

I think they were looking at Tampa's success with guys like Ben Zobrist. Zobrist played 40 games at ss the last 2 years. Is he an idea short stop?? No. But positional flexibility can be very helpful.

 

Lawrie is not a perfect second basemen... but it gives the team more options. Just like playing Bautista or EE at 3rd does.

 

My opinion is that it shouldn't be unreasonable for guys to be able to handle 2 or 3 positions. Have Bautista take reps at 3rd once and a while, Lawrie at second. Just have them ready in case you need them somewhere else.

 

Troy Glauss played a few games at short when the Jays had a fly ball pitcher going in 2006. I like creative stuff like that.

 

But what always happens is the players, and the media complain. If something goes wrong, even just one screw up it gets magnified. The starting pitcher is pissed (Lawrie shouldn't of been at second), the media second guesses management. So it is simple to keep it simple.

 

But Tampa is willing to take these risks... play guys at different spots.

[Angrioter]

I think they were looking at Tampa's success with guys like Ben Zobrist. Zobrist played 40 games at ss the last 2 years. Is he an idea short stop?? No. But positional flexibility can be very helpful.

 

Lawrie is not a perfect second basemen... but it gives the team more options. Just like playing Bautista or EE at 3rd does.

 

My opinion is that it shouldn't be unreasonable for guys to be able to handle 2 or 3 positions. Have Bautista take reps at 3rd once and a while, Lawrie at second. Just have them ready in case you need them somewhere else.

 

Troy Glauss played a few games at short when the Jays had a fly ball pitcher going in 2006. I like creative stuff like that.

 

But what always happens is the players, and the media complain. If something goes wrong, even just one screw up it gets magnified. The starting pitcher is pissed (Lawrie shouldn't of been at second), the media second guesses management. So it is simple to keep it simple.

 

But Tampa is willing to take these risks... play guys at different spots.

 

 

Ben Zobrist is a established stud; Lawrie is a young guy who need to established as a player (ALA Edwin 1B)

[Olerud363]

Bats to 3rd, Lawrie to 2B, Gose to RF is the best team on paper

 

I think it sort of depends on how one weights Goins 2013 mlb defensive numbers, vs. Goses apparent 2013 decline.

 

If it becomes apparent that 2013 was just a down year for Gose (not a trend) and that the 2013 mlb numbers for Goins were very optimistic (ie his D will not carry his bat) then you might be right.

 

Regardless it would be nice to have this option.

[Olerud363]

Ben Zobrist is a established stud; Lawrie is a young guy who need to established as a player (ALA Edwin 1B)

 

Yeah but when Zobrist was getting established they had him all over the place. In 2008/2009 he played short, second, right, center and a couple games at third. He hit really well those years.

[KingKat]

Bats to 3rd, Lawrie to 2B, Gose to RF is the best team on paper

 

Gose to RF when his only value is as a defensive CF? Not sure about that.

[HERPDERP]

Gose to RF when his only value is as a defensive CF? Not sure about that.

 

Well Gose has had reps in all outfield spots. I don't think Rasmus has touched either corner spots.

 

Then you have the intangibles - why remove a 'veteran' player for a rookie, especially when the former player is a pretty good defender himself?

 

Not worth the risk of shaking things up for minimal benefit.

[KingKat]

Well Gose has had reps in all outfield spots. I don't think Rasmus has touched either corner spots.

 

Then you have the intangibles - why remove a 'veteran' player for a rookie, especially when the former player is a pretty good defender himself?

 

Not worth the risk of shaking things up for minimal benefit.

 

No amount of shuffling will hide the fact that the Jays are playing one position player short, one and a half if you count Lind's bad platoon split, two and a half if Melky doesn't bounce back. That's terrible for your overall depth. Positional depth was at least as much of a need for this team as pitching depth but I guess that's kind of a moot point since neither was addressed.

[AdamGreenwood]

He only started six games at second. It's not as if any determination can be made as the success or failure of that experiment.

He's an awesome third baseman, and his quickness, his jump and his off-balance throws should translate well to second. Plus it's harder to find a stairwell at second base.

 

And his bat at 2nd is worth a lot more than his bat at 3rd with the current market.

[Olerud363]

No amount of shuffling will hide the fact that the Jays are playing one position player short, one and a half if you count Lind's bad platoon split, two and a half if Melky doesn't bounce back. That's terrible for your overall depth. Positional depth was at least as much of a need for this team as pitching depth but I guess that's kind of a moot point since neither was addressed.

 

They actually needed another good outfielder. They had a perfect excuse to move Melky to 4th outfielder (steroid rehap and tumour recovery). He still would get 120 games just platooning with Lind and filling in for the others.

[Olerud363]

He only started six games at second. It's not as if any determination can be made as the success or failure of that experiment.

He's an awesome third baseman, and his quickness, his jump and his off-balance throws should translate well to second. Plus it's harder to find a stairwell at second base.

 

And his bat at 2nd is worth a lot more than his bat at 3rd with the current market.

 

What did Yoda say?? Do or do not there is no try?

 

Move Lawrie to second or do not. Don't move him there for a weekend. Go All-in or do not. But don't go all-in one offseason than nothing the next.

 

Once they make a decision about a players position that decision will need months to be implemented. Not 10 plays.

 

Once they make a decision about franchise direction that decision will need years to be implemented. Not 4 weeks in one offseason.

[KingKat]

Gibbons said in an interview the other day that the organization is looking to expand players on positional flexibility

 

It would make sense to use positional flexibility in order to use depth in some areas to cover for lack of depth in others but there's hardly any depth anywhere. The deepest position is probably catcher with Navarro/Thole/Kratz/Jimenez on the 40 man and Nickeas available as an emergency caddie for Dickey and even Lawrie can catch in an extreme pinch. There's not a whole lot you can do to convert that depth other than give DH starts to Kratz or Navarro.

[KingKat]

Aside from Lawrie picking up 2B I can't see any other players on the projected 12-man picking up a new position. Maybe get Bautista ready to play 3rd in the event of a Lawrie injury?

 

Would you rather?

 

- Move two players out of position to open up an OF spot for one of Gose/Pillar/Sierra

- Call up Kawasaki

[Angrioter]

Would you rather?

 

- Move two players out of position to open up an OF spot for one of Gose/Pillar/Sierra

- Call up Kawasaki

 

Option C for me

[KingKat]

Call up Kawasaki.

 

That's how I feel as well. There's really no one in the minors or on the bench who would justify juggling the whole lineup.

[KingKat]

Gose has speed but can he hit? He hit .223 with 1 HR his first call up and .240 with 2 HR last year with a total of 75 hits and 3 HR's for 2012-2013. His 162 game projection is 5 HR's and .240 ave. For a 2nd round pick, is he the best we have?

 

A Gose/Pillar platoon MIGHT provide acceptable production.

[Dick_Pole]

Bats to 3rd, Lawrie to 2B, Gose to RF is the best team on paper

 

This is not a fantasy team where you can shuffle your guys around all you want to fit in the best offensive lineup. The marginal pick up on offense is lost with poorer defense

 

Defensively:

Lawrie > Bautista at 3B

Goins probably > Lawrie at second, at least until he gets some games under his belt

Bautista vs Gose???? Not sure. If this was CF there would be some pick up there. But you need a different skill set for RF.

 

Maybe move Gose to CF and have Rasmus and Cabrera throw to bullseyes at the plate from RF and whoever does less terrible takes the job. But my preference would be to leave as is. Bautista only moves to 3B in a desperation attempt to avoid having two of Kawasaki/Goins/Izturis in the lineup once Reyes or Lawrie goes down.

[Olerud363]

This is not a fantasy team where you can shuffle your guys around all you want to fit in the best offensive lineup. The marginal pick up on offense is lost with poorer defense

 

Defensively:

Lawrie > Bautista at 3B

Goins probably > Lawrie at second, at least until he gets some games under his belt

Bautista vs Gose???? Not sure. If this was CF there would be some pick up there. But you need a different skill set for RF.

 

Maybe move Gose to CF and have Rasmus and Cabrera throw to bullseyes at the plate from RF and whoever does less terrible takes the job. But my preference would be to leave as is. Bautista only moves to 3B in a desperation attempt to avoid having two of Kawasaki/Goins/Izturis in the lineup once Reyes or Lawrie goes down.

 

I agree here. But what if there was a chance to sign Choo?? Or trade for Stanton??

 

What I would of liked to see is AA do everything possible to get one more real good position player. Target 2b. But also 3b and outfielders and being willing to shift Lawrie/Bautista if needed.

 

That would of been better then Goins. Given we are talking Goins or Gose... not worth it to shift guys.

[Dick_Pole]

I agree here. But what if there was a chance to sign Choo?? Or trade for Stanton??

 

What I would of liked to see is AA do everything possible to get one more real good position player. Target 2b. But also 3b and outfielders and being willing to shift Lawrie/Bautista if needed.

 

That would of been better then Goins. Given we are talking Goins or Gose... not worth it to shift guys.

 

If we're talking Stanton in a realistic trade, that would only open up more holes elsewhere. This team needs depth. The Jays are pretty well off when it comes to "star" players. The top 5 or 6 guys on this team can compete with the best of them. The problem is there's at least 5 and probably 6 to 8 players who will make the 25 man roster which a truly competitive team should have no business having on its roster. If Stanton comes in a trade, at least 2 quality MLB talents off the 25-man goes the other way (in addition MiLB talent) and the team is even worse off with depth. You can't make Stanton the RF AND the 2B AND a SP all at once.

[mitchf]

Of all the weird things this team has done recently, this move was actually one I was fine with.

 

Lawrie wasn't hitting, he looked horrible at the plate and the Blue Jays weren't going to get complacent? Why not make him work on a new position (which won't hurt him in the long run) as he struggles?

[Dick_Pole]

Which is precisely why the team shouldn't have been all in last offseason.

 

The thought and hopes and dreams of a contender well exceeded the actual ability of the team. I loved the idea of it, hated the execution of it especially in retrospect. I probably should have hated it right from the start, but like I said I fell in love with the idea of a contender. Not so much AA and Beeston's idea of what a contender looks like. I suspect the vast majority of fans are in the same situation.

 

I partially blame Ricciardi for this. Years and years of him bitching about lack of payroll brainwashed me into believing it was true. Same thing with the prior regime with Interbrew although I don't recall Ash being the crybaby I think it was Beeston or someone else. Lack of payroll has never been the problem. The New York Yankees and Boston Red Sox have never been the problem. The problem is in the mirror for Ricciardi, AA, Beeston, Rogers and all us sucker fans who for one glorious month in December 2012 believed it could be true.

 

Just be thankful that the Raptors are surprisingly good in a shithole division and the Leafs are at least no longer terrible. hopefully that means Toronto is no longer the worst sports city overall.

[Dick_Pole]

I can't remember a time when we've had commitment from ownership and a capable front office. I think JPR was average or a bit above, but wasn't allowed to spend on the draft or take payroll to the top third of the league. Now they have financial commitment from ownership, but the guys in charge of spending the money have no f***ing idea how to run a baseball team.

 

Just a sound front office, with a top-10 financial commitment and a President that won't meddle would be fantastic and would probably result in playoff appearances. We've had only one of those things during each of the last two regimes.

 

That would be a nice dream. Right now we have one guy living in a fantasy land where he is going to ride into the sun as a champion but when that fails he will cling onto his 1993 with a big goody smile on his face. The guy underneath him is pretty much coasting and getting an easy paycheck until he gets canned because he knows it's all over. This is what I read from the situation after this off-season.

[Frenchsoup]

Aside from Lawrie picking up 2B I can't see any other players on the projected 12-man picking up a new position. Maybe get Bautista ready to play 3rd in the event of a Lawrie injury?

 

I could see kratz being able to play 1b

[Stangstag]

Aside from Lawrie picking up 2B I can't see any other players on the projected 12-man picking up a new position. Maybe get Bautista ready to play 3rd in the event of a Lawrie injury?

 

I could see them trying:

Melky in LF/CF/RF

Rasmus in CF/LF

Bautista in RF/3B/1B

Encarnacion at 1B/3B/LF

Lind at 1B/LF

Lawrie at 3B/2B/LF/RF

Reyes at SS/2B/3B

Goins at 2B/SS/3B

 

Don't underestimate the stupidity of our FO

[Stangstag]

Lawrie - C

 

Hehe I dont think they would go THAT far.