Payroll Neutral

[Cooler Heads Prevail]

Markets play a significant role. The sad part is when bigger market believe they should play by smaller market rules.

 

Like Toronto did, especially when Interbrew made the Jays a profit center milking whatever they could from what was left of a team.

[Brenner]

Baseball is not Basketball where you need 1-2 stars and the best way to get one to is to suck and draft one at the top of the lotto. There is no reason you can't be good and be building your prospect talent at the same time. The baseball draft, and internernation pools, are so deep there is no excuse. However, even well run teams like Oakland, St. Louis, Tampa occasionally supplement their team through free agency. Not all your talent is going to come together at the same time at all positions. Occasionally trading top prospects for the "final piece" might be worth it but the team needs to prove its on the cusp first.

[Dick_Pole]

The Astros had several years of contention, but the nucleus of those teams was aging and they had given it a final go in 2009 and 2010 so I think they correctly decided to rebuild. I certainly don't think this applies to every franchise. I said they correctly decided to rebuild, meaning that it was better to do that instead of spending the kind of money it would've taken to make that aging team a winning one.

 

In the 5 years prior to the years I listed, the Astros made the playoffs twice and in 2008, they had an 86-75 record so I can see why they might've given it another shot in 2009 and 2010, but after that, they just decided to commit to a full rebuild, I don't see the issue.

 

I really don't see where I suggested they're a model franchise.

 

Sorry, that was meant as more of a rant in general about the state of their crappy team than meant to attack you. You said that you weren't sure if Rogers was committed to doing such a thing - not sure if you mean that you would agree with such a course of action if they did.

 

My point is that Rogers, nor any other team owner should agree to be tanking that bad year after year, because it's embarrassing, as Chappy said it's a cop out, and a team that has to go this deep down into the pits is just a poorly run franchise. No fan of any team should be happy with this course of action under any circumstance.

 

How often does getting year after year of top draft picks actually work? It worked for the Penguins in the NHL but they had uncanny good timing with the elite talents that were available at #1. Look at Washington. Strasburg and Harper, Zimmerman a few years earlier in the top 5 along with Storen and the other recent acquisitions added. They have a good, but not dominant team. Jordan Zimmermann is their ace and he was picked 67th overall so them tanking a few years ago had nothing to do with their ability to get him.

 

Compare that to the Braves. While Washington was really tanking, the Braves were only pulling back a little bit, getting Minor at #7 as their highest pick in recent years. Now they have a better team.

 

I get irritated when people have "reverse standing" threads cheering for the Jays to tank just so they can have a draft pick at a little bit of a higher spot. It doesn't matter whether you have the 5th, 10th or 15th pick in baseball. If you're a good team that knows how to draft and develop players, you will get elite talents no matter which pick you have. And if you're garbage at it the opposite thing applies.

 

Then in the once in a blue moon where a team like the Nationals supposedly hit the jackpot with Strasburg and Harper at #1, they're still not as good as the Braves anyways.

[Dick_Pole]

Astros remind me of when the Expos were run into the ground and when Interbrew had control of the Jays. Braves have always spent when they need to and Jays used to operate very similar to them in the glory years. I still blame Interbrew for destroying our team at one point. Takes years and some luck to regain traction, attendance is only now starting to recover. And as some have said, a recent history of losing isn't great for attracting free agents.

 

Jays from 1977-1993 were one of the best run franchises in baseball. So it can be done.

 

I think the Interbrew thing is overdone. I mean they signed Clemens during those days right? Pretty much the biggest FA signing you could get. The lack of success in the Interbrew days has a lot more to do with wasting assets like John Olerud, inconsistent assets like Juan Guzman who after the World Series years was dominant one season and trash the next and really poor choices/terrible luck on acquisitions like Eric Hanson, Carlos Garcia and Danny Darwin. Mix that in with the Yankees trying to build a HOF team every year and not even a Mark Cuban level of engaged owner could have done much with that squad at the time. I mean with Green, Delgado, the Cy Young awards, Jose Cruz fleecing from Seattle...there was a lot to look forward to from those teams but they never got it together. Not sure how Interbrew could be blamed just because they didn't want to spend like the Yankees at the time.

[connorp]

If I was the business owner of a MLB baseball team.. I would never put a god awful team on the field like HOU has in name of rebuild. Not like HOU is small city in nowhereville. You'd think local tv right would be pretty lucrative.

[Sorrow]

I can understand them doing it to guarantee picks like Springer and Appel. I can see the Astros by 2015 being back around 85-86 win teams again. You have a lot of talent coming up and adding to some interesting pieces already at the MLB level.

[Abomination]

I can understand them doing it to guarantee picks like Springer and Appel. I can see the Astros by 2015 being back around 85-86 win teams again. You have a lot of talent coming up and adding to some interesting pieces already at the MLB level.

 

If you have a longer term owner proven in the past to pony up on the payroll, I think it makes it easier to do a total rebuild as the fans can have confidence that the money will be there when the team is ready. Any time an owner comes in and immediately rebuilds though it's got to make it more questionable.

[Chappy]

If I was the business owner of a MLB baseball team.. I would never put a god awful team on the field like HOU has in name of rebuild. Not like HOU is small city in nowhereville. You'd think local tv right would be pretty lucrative.

 

I would if it meant the organization would eventually be in a position of sustainable contention.