Around Baseball 2014

[Angrioter]

[McD]

Why not delete the irrelevant posts and let the posters know these are not acceptable? And maybe a baseball conversation would have threatened to break out.

 

As an aside, im a little reluctant to get involved in this but im fed up of a lot of topics being derailed by personal gripes and irrelevant posts.

[wilko]

It's like a f***ing high school up in here.

[GD]

high school actually isn't this dramatic

[HERPDERP]

high school actually isn't this dramatic

 

The extent of my high school drama was my friend going around telling people she got an abortion, but was known as a pathological liar. Pretty exciting days.

[jays_fever]

I was actually curious how many girls in my year alone got an abortion, considering about 10 out of 200 got pregnant and there were 2 at least that I knew got an abortion.

[z3r0s]

Only one girl got knocked up my entire time in high school and it happend in my first couple weeks of high school. My best friend knocked her up and has been a Dad since he was 13. His kid is 10.

 

Seems to be really dependent on where you live. I don't remember much of any high school pregnancies at my school (although I'm sure there was one or two). But the smaller town my wife grew up in had TONS of them, and that is just like half an hour away in a much smaller community.

[burlingtonbandit]

I was actually curious how many girls in my year alone got an abortion, considering about 10 out of 200 got pregnant and there were 2 at least that I knew got an abortion.

 

You must be from Oshawa?

[Orgfiller]

The GDT's are unreadable again.

 

They really are, my sig is basically a summary of the last GDT, just read the post, it's pretty sad.

[GD]

Depends on if you consider achieving an extremely ideal outcome for 82% of the batters and achieving the worst possible outcome for 18% of the batters shutting someone down.

 

Also, that would result in a 5.126 FIP, so that isn't really shutting anyone down, yeah.

[GD]

No, it doesn't depend on that at all. You kids are so f***ing ruined with the statistics, that you fail logic. Which is amazing. And don't pull a jaysfan2014 and now find a statistic that fits your argument.

 

Calm the f*** down, just cause I used a fancy percentage sign doesn't mean I used a statistic. All I said was that it depends on how you define shutting someone down and in this case it wasn't much of a shut down.

[BTS]

Calm the f*** down, just cause I used a fancy percentage sign doesn't mean I used a statistic. All I said was that it depends on how you define shutting someone down and in this case it wasn't much of a shut down.

 

Why would you debate semantics with Moogy?

[G-Snarls]

Guys, this argument is silly.

 

Enough

[GD]

Uh, sparky, you're a bit out of control. All you said was completely wrong, because you'd have to use an invalid definition to present your argument as meaningful. Which is why I said it wouldn't depend on that. Because it wouldn't.

 

And, yes, the percentages would be a statistic. And, no, I was not referring to that, but instead your selective highlighting of FIP, which is also a statistic.

 

Learn da English. Please.

 

So I may be misunderstanding, but are you saying that shutting a team down has nothing to do with getting ideal outcomes?

 

I used FIP to highlight what most on here would use as their barometer.

 

Learn da human decency. Please.

[GD]

Why would you debate semantics with Moogy?

 

It's like North, only if you stripped any and all humanity out of him. I say we get this guy into the BBDL.

[NorthOf49]

It's like North, only if you stripped any and all humanity out of him. I say we get this guy into the BBDL.

Eh? I only have problems with poorly written rules. Not into arguing stuff like what "shut down" means.

[GD]

Eh? I only have problems with poorly written rules. Not into arguing stuff like what "shut down" means.

 

"Well if you consider the time zones" = semantics <3

[NorthOf49]

"Well if you consider the time zones" = semantics <3

That's not even semantics... time zones are factual entities and you simply don't understand the consequences of daylight savings time.

 

The rules are written with a specific time zone specified yet a different one is actually used.

 

------

Anyway, get back to arguing with Moogy.

[BTS]

It's like North, only if you stripped any and all humanity out of him. I say we get this guy into the BBDL.

 

North has the ability to disagree without being a condescending asshat. I don't think I've ever been frustrated talking to him.

[GD]

That's not even semantics... time zones are factual entities and you simply don't understand the consequences of daylight savings time.

 

The rules are written with a specific time zone specified yet a different one is actually used.

 

The semantics of semantics. lol it isn't actually i just wanted to say that

 

North has the ability to disagree without being a condescending asshat. I don't think I've ever been frustrated talking to him.

 

+1. North has to be probably the least offensive person on the planet. I don't think I've seen him insult someone ever.

[Orgfiller]

IMO the best post on the matter was havok's, he mentioned that "shutting down" means missing bats and/or inducing weak contact, which is 100% accurate as far as I'm concerned

[Orgfiller]

I'm not getting into this argument with you because in your mind you can never be wrong. And to answer your question: in his mind a pitcher will believe he got smacked around because the casuals will jump him about his ERA, but in reality those who know he got unlucky will be happy with the performance. See: Brandon Morrow circa 2010.

[GD]

You didn't use FIP to highlight that. Most would use xFIP or SIERA.

 

And "ideal outcomes" is begging the question and incorrectly framing the discussion. Now, for something as extreme as 27 wall-climbs in order to throw a perfect game, you wouldn't say "I shut them down," it'd be said that "we shut them down," "we" including the pitcher. But for other more "normal" permutations of actual results (v. expected results and/or ideal outcomes), a pitcher throwing a no-no would be "shutting them down" regardless of FIP, xFIP or SIERA.

 

This all goes back to the faux-post-game-interview I posted months ago, which involved Cy JFAS talking about how awesome he was out there that night, after he hit the showers, even though he was smacked around and many runs crossed the plate.

 

I don't agree with most people who use xFIP to say how a pitch actually pitched. xFIP crosses the line of talent measuring and goes into a full on ERA predictor once it manipulates HR allowed imo. FIP is probably the best measure of talent for what actually happened. I would use FIP.

 

I agree for the most part. I think people confuse "what can expected to happen in the future" with "what should have happened in the past." The ideal outcomes discussion is a discussion for a different day I supposed.

 

Again, I think people confuse the two. I think saying a pitcher did well when he struck out 8 and walked 2 but gave up 5 ER isn't correct, but it should be said that that pitcher is at least taking the steps toward being successful by some of his outcomes such as SO, BB, and so on, but again, for another day I guess.

[Orgfiller]

I don't agree with most people who use xFIP to say how a pitch actually pitched. xFIP crosses the line of talent measuring and goes into a full on ERA predictor once it manipulates HR allowed imo. FIP is probably the best measure of talent for what actually happened. I would use FIP.

 

I agree for the most part. I think people confuse "what can expected to happen in the future" with "what should have happened in the past." The ideal outcomes discussion is a discussion for a different day I supposed.

 

Again, I think people confuse the two. I think saying a pitcher did well when he struck out 8 and walked 2 but gave up 5 ER isn't correct, but it should be said that that pitcher is at least taking the steps toward being successful by some of his outcomes such as SO, BB, and so on, but again, for another day I guess.

 

I agree with a lot of this post, but to put one example, in the start that Dickey struck out like 9 in 6 innings (I don't remember perfectly) but gave up like 4 homeruns on 5 flyballs you couldn't say Dickey was horrible, he likely left a few flat knuckleballs but other than that he got unlucky with HR/FB% and dominated for the most part.

[Orgfiller]

I have sigs blocked, can't see it, sorry.

 

Here you go.

If every hitter in the lineup flied out to a leaping CF over the fence that would be a no hitter and a shutout.

 

We both know it would never happen, but a no hit shutout win is the definition of shutting a team down. What the f*** is wrong with you?

[GD]

I agree with a lot of this post, but to put one example, in the start that Dickey struck out like 9 in 6 innings (I don't remember perfectly) but gave up like 4 homeruns on 5 flyballs you couldn't say Dickey was horrible, he likely left a few flat knuckleballs but other than that he got unlucky with HR/FB% and dominated for the most part.

 

I can't say I agree. The fact is that he DID give up 4 HR on 5 FB. And that's bad. But should he be expected to do so in the future? No. So what he did was bad but it shouldn't be expected to happen again (even if it does, it shouldn't be expected to). It doesn't change, however, that it actually did happen. So I stand by that I'd use FIP as a description and xFIP as a prediction. After all, the x is for expected.

[GD]

idc what you people define "shutdown" as but it's this

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100808&content_id=13191556&vkey=recap&fext=.jsp&c_id=tor

[Orgfiller]

idc what you people define "shutdown" as but it's this

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100808&content_id=13191556&vkey=recap&fext=.jsp&c_id=tor

 

And this is not: http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300625130

[GD]

And this is not: http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300625130

 

My friend pitched a no-hitter like this. Managed to give up runs too. The backstops at Bond are unforgiving.

[Orgfiller]

My friend pitched a no-hitter like this. Managed to give up runs too. The backstops at Bond are unforgiving.

 

+1000