If RA gets rocked, reporters should ask about Syndergaard trade

[AuntieJPA]

I would love AA to be asked a direct question about the Syndergaard/ mets trade. One might forgive the Marlins deal, but this move???

[ElNik2013]

I would love AA to be asked a direct question about the Syndergaard/ mets trade. One might forgive the Marlins deal, but this move???

 

 

He should've been asked about it already, but the media was part of the hyping machine, even those that don't work for Rogers. It's interesting that they had gotten on board with the idea that the team was rebuilding its farm system and acquiring buys like Lawrie, Escobar, Morrow and Rasmus, but then the team changes course completely and they just went along with it.

 

It would be long overdue for anyone in the media to analyze why they changed direction so abruptly and desperately. I say desperately because that's the sense that I got from the Marlins and Mests' trades.

[AuntieJPA]

It will be interesting to see attendance next year. Much of this year's attendance is a result of hype, flex packs, etc.

[GNick]

Dickey hasn't been that bad away from Rogers. I think he is pitching in wrong park. But yeah, he still paid way too much for Dickey.

[ElNik2013]

It will be interesting to see attendance next year. Much of this year's attendance is a result of hype, flex packs, etc.

 

 

Attendance will go down, beginning with the 2nd half this year. I think you'll see many no-shows at the game, even if tickets are sold. I hope it's noticeable enough for ownership to put some pressure on Beeston, whom I believe was behind the trades to a good extent. Next year's attendance will be down very early on, but if the team is contending, it'll improve as the season goes along. If the team is again bad, attendance will go down again and they'll fire AA and go back to rebuilding...again.

[flafson]

Silly thread, what do you want him to say?

As good as Syndergaard seems to be, he's not a CY Yong winner yet, Dickey is. We paid CY Yong money hoping it won't be the last one, only time will tell.

Why don't you create similar thread going after the Pirates GM for letting Bautista go? Or maybe the Rangers for letting both Chris Davis and Edwin Encarnacion go? Both teams are doing just fine even without those stars.

[AuntieJPA]

Silly thread, what do you want him to say?

As good as Syndergaard seems to be, he's not a CY Yong winner yet, Dickey is. We paid CY Yong money hoping it won't be the last one, only time will tell.

Why don't you create similar thread going after the Pirates GM for letting Bautista go? Or maybe the Rangers for letting both Chris Davis and Edwin Encarnacion go? Both teams are doing just fine even without those stars.

 

Of course not but the media has been soft on this. Plus Pirates and Rangers are doing fine

[Howard Roark]

Toronto sports media is constituted of a bunch of chubby, passive, white manginas who go home every night to get beaten by their wives. They don't DO conflict, it scares them to death.

[Boxcar]

I would love AA to be asked a direct question about the Syndergaard/ mets trade. One might forgive the Marlins deal, but this move???

 

Neither deal was forgivable. Both of them were firable offenses imo.

[AuntieJPA]

Neither deal was forgivable. Both of them were firable offenses imo.

people wonder why Tampa and Oakland have so much pitching. Maybe because they don't deal a talent like Syndergaard; they trade Shields and get Myers

[saskjayfan]

Neither deal was forgivable. Both of them were firable offenses imo.

 

which Jay traded away in the Marlins deal is going to come back and haunt the Jays...seriously...which one. Reyes is a great player...Buehrle is solid.....and no one was posting about Johnson being a terrible additions when the trade was first announced...

[AuntieJPA]

which Jay traded away in the Marlins deal is going to come back and haunt the Jays...seriously...which one. Reyes is a great player...Buehrle is solid.....and no one was posting about Johnson being a terrible additions when the trade was first announced...

 

Miami not as bad as Mets deal. The jays could have waited. But who gives up Syndergaard? And adds D'arnaud??

[GD]

.....and no one was posting about Johnson being a terrible additions when the trade was first announced...

 

If I recall, BTS was very against it.

[saskjayfan]

If I recall, BTS was very against it.

 

If you take the average projection of ERA of the Bill James and all the other Sabermatrics nerds out there on Johnson the average ERA was under 4....it was over his career 3.15 ERA he had entering the season...but the average projection was well under 4.....let alone the ERA of 6 he's put up....yet all you hindsight experts claim that you knew he would be garbage....I don't buy it.

[saskjayfan]

Buehrle contract is s***, I would not consider him solid

 

Everyone know's he's overpaid...but he's a guy who puts up 200 innings and should put an ERA of 3.8 to 4.2....he's a bit over that..but I still expect him to be in that range for the time that he is here....he provides a level of certainty and you were taking that on to get Reyes and Johnson...Johnson didn't work out...Reyes did....and they did get cash...

 

I could give a rats ass....what Rogers is spending...I'm still waiting to hear who the Jays are desperately missing....Escobar? Hech? Alvarez?...give me a break..

[GD]

yet all you hindsight experts claim that you knew he would be garbage....I don't buy it.

 

I think the main concerns were his transition to the ALE and a smaller park, and his injury history. Both have been significant issues for him this year. He's also having a stupidly unlucky year, but they were legitimate concerns.

[saskjayfan]

Alvarez > Buehrle bro

 

Hech/Escobar > Boni/Izturis

 

Get your head out of your ass

 

Izzy wasn't part of the deal...get your head out of your ass. Hech and his .588 OPS are terrible. Hech can not hit. Escobar has a s***** attitude and again has posted an ops under .700. I've never seen a guy hit into more double plays than escobar......

 

Reyes/boni>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>hech/escobar

 

Albarez hasn't pitched enough innings this year and he's pitching in the NL....he gets rocked in the AL and due for an appearance on the DL again any day now...

[saskjayfan]

You discredit Alvarez for pitching in the NL but don't recognize JJ's move to the AL? Alvarez has pitched well and was a real asset when they traded him.

 

I did that on purpose....switching from the NL to the AL has an impact but is vastly over exaggerated. It doesn't bump your ERA by 3 runs...give me a break. What does 45 innings say about a guy? Rogers numbers were just as good his first 45 innings as a starter...how has that worked out....Kuroda made the transition from the NL to the AL east..his ERA didn't blow up...

[Angrioter]

You discredit Alvarez for pitching in the NL but don't recognize JJ's move to the AL? Alvarez has pitched well and was a real asset when they traded him.

 

Alvarez is a good pitcher but not great (AL East #4 at Least). Drabek, Hutchison, Stroman > Alvarez...Right?

Do you've already lost the love for Drabek?

[GD]

I did that on purpose....switching from the NL to the AL has an impact but is vastly over exaggerated.

 

False. It adds about half a run. That's significant. Also, thanks for ignoring my post. You're on fire bud.

[saskjayfan]

No f***ing s***, brah?!?!

 

 

 

He may not be a great hitter but he has elite defense. I would take him as a bench player anyday, over Boni/Izturis

 

 

 

 

Where do you get this from? Because he wrote some words on his eyeblack? Cry me a river

 

 

 

Escobar .256/.321/.371 .307wOBA >>> Boni .217/.257/.324 .256wOBA

 

 

 

Nice to add Reyes in here, he wasn't in my discussion in the first place

 

 

 

I would take Alvarez on the cheap with good potential and he's very young , over old man Buehrle with his huge backloaded contract any day of the week and twice on sunday

 

 

The discussion is about the Miami trade....how do you omit Reyes and throw in Izzy...lol.....what a maroon...

 

Alvarez has injury worries with him and being young it's more difficult to determine what he will bring. I will capitulate...I can see how someone would argue for Alvarez over Buehrle...but I can see the argument for going for the proven veteran when it allows you to pick up Reyes and Johnson.

 

I do not think Alvarez will be anything special as a pitcher...he may prove me wrong. The jays got one of the better players in the game in the Miami trade...I don't think it was a terrible trade when you get a player the quality of Reyes...

[Caper]

Neither deal was forgivable. Both of them were firable offenses imo.

 

Lucky for everyone... your opinion doesn't matter.

[saskjayfan]

False. It adds about half a run. That's significant. Also, thanks for ignoring my post. You're on fire bud.

 

you should tell that to Kuroda...he's a half run less in the AL east...I get that having a DH hitting vs a pitcher that it's going to make a difference. My point is you don't expect a guy with a 3.15 ERA to post a 6 ERA, but then again you don't expect CC to post an ERA close to 5.

 

The jist of my arguments are that all you know it alls talk in absolutes like you know everything when the game really isn't that easy to figure out. I'm sure you all had CC sebathia down for a 5 era and all avoided him in your fantasy drafts..lol

[GD]

you should tell that to Kuroda...he's a half run less in the AL east...I get that having a DH hitting vs a pitcher that it's going to make a difference. My point is you don't expect a guy with a 3.15 ERA to post a 6 ERA, but then again you don't expect CC to post an ERA close to 5.

 

JJ had a ~3.80 ERA last year, didn't he? Factor in the rough half a run adjustment, it's worrisome.

 

I still want to keep JJ, for whatever it's worth. Want that regression.

[Angrioter]

Buehrle may be better on a production basis, but not when you take into account their contracts. If the Jays didn't acquire Buehrle they had a whole offseason to acquire somebody else instead. This trade wasn't the only way for the Blue Jays to get talent, there were many avenues. Alvarez would have been a useful depth piece - it would've been nice having him make starts instead of Ramon Ortiz or Chad Redmond.

 

Buehrle surplus value = Negative ('14 18M, '15 19M)

Ace money

[Angrioter]

Right, but saskjayfan already said he doesn't care about salary.

 

He's from Saskatchewan, so there's that lol

 

A baseball organization is a company, everything is handled about cost and production. A concierge can't earn the same money that a manager.

The silver lining: Bautista, Edwin, Lawrie, Rasmus and Morrow will play for less money than their actual value.

[IronLadle]

JJ had a ~3.80 ERA last year, didn't he? Factor in the rough half a run adjustment, it's worrisome.

 

I still want to keep JJ, for whatever it's worth. Want that regression.

 

Considering he missed pretty much all of 2011 his 2012 numbers were very good a WAR of 3.5

[GD]

Considering he missed pretty much all of 2011 his 2012 numbers were very good a WAR of 3.5

 

WAR is FIP based (on fangraphs), I'm going with ERA as sask is using.

[TheHurl]

Neither deal was forgivable. Both of them were firable offenses imo.

 

those trades sold tickets so probably wouldn't lead to a firing in any market in the world.

 

which Jay traded away in the Marlins deal is going to come back and haunt the Jays...seriously...which one. Reyes is a great player...Buehrle is solid.....and no one was posting about Johnson being a terrible additions when the trade was first announced...

 

Value is a thing. A player very similar to Hech was traded for a top 25 pitching prospect who was major league ready (talking about Gregorius for Bauer, while Bauer has been bad he still has more upside than anyone the Jays got and is not expensive if he doesn't reach his potential). Escobar it's forgivable to deal cause he was done with this H.O. no matter what. We'll say his value was what the Marlins got for him which is still a 2B better than Boni. Henderson Alvarez is a ground ball machine who will thrive in that park. As I said at the time he'd outperform JJ and Buehrle together over their time with the Jays (watch out when he starts K'ing more the 6 a game which despite the lack of history I believe he will do). Marisnick I was huge on at one time but I still think he's got to improve the K rate to be successful but still has a lot of potential and put himself back into legit prospect category. Nicolino is a deceptive lefty type that I really think would "get caught up to" in a second go around in the majors but if he can give them one good season in Florida it still might be better than what JJ did. But you're right the rest of the guys are nothing

[guylaroche5]

lol my god, you guys just never seem to stop beating the dead horse