glory

Honestly I am ok with that if it happens. I'd actually prefer it. One extra year of Vlad in his mid-20's would have insane value. I just don't think it will happen. He's too good and Rogers cares too much about optics and marketing. Lose JD, hype up Vlad for off season ticket sales. That's the way they operate.

He’d probably have a higher WAR as a reliever than a hitter. Give it a shot. Why not. We are stuck with his overpaid ass anyway.

By next year Vlad would have already had experience in AA and AAA (assuming they keep him down all year or until Sept this year). Right now he has a month of AA under his belt. By the start of next season he will have ravaged through the upper minors over a full season already. Totally different scenario. No one is saying not to call him up in 2019. He's too good and it won't look right (optics) to hold him back until May 2019 when we will be running out Travis, Tulo, Diaz, Solarte, etc, in the infield next year. He should be starting 3b in 2019. But calling him up after a month in AA for a better shot at a 2nd wild card in 2018? When they are having enough problems finding playing time for their existing talent when everyone is healthy? Pass. Do what the Yankees did with Judge/Sanchez. If the Jays sell at the deadline (i.e. move JD), then consider calling Vlad up then to play 3b for a month or two so he has big league reps before 2019. If the Jays are in it, then chances are they won't be moving anyone from the big league roster, so the log jam that currently exists will still be there. In that case, save whatever days you can from his service clock and buy some vets at the deadline as upgrades. Or if by Aug/Sept he looks like a clear upgrade then call him up then. But now is way too soon.

Brian Cashman, one of the smartest GM's in the game, did the EXACT opposite of what you are suggesting the Jays do when he was in a similar position (a WC at best team with ~82-85 win projection). He had a hole at 2B this season, a year which they plan on winning a WS, and still waited a month to call up Torres. ANd he's the GM of the f'n Yankees, who should have no issues paying their talent, while we are the Blue Jays, a team owned by a corporate entity who could decide to slash payroll in a heartbeat if they wanted to. I have no problem following Cashman's lead, and I hope Shapiro doesn't value a 2nd WC berth (one extra game on the road against Severino or Sale) to be worth messing up potentially millions upon millions $ of value down the road.

Judge got a cup of coffee in the bigs in 2016 after the Yankees traded Beltran and right field was open. Since Beltran wouldn't be there in 2017, RF was Judge's. Sanchez was called up around the same time and split between C and DH for the rest of '16, and then the Yanks traded McCann to open up the full time catching spot in 2017. In both cases, the Yankees were in the exact same spot as the Jays are now; a WC contender with no chance at contending for the division in 2016. So they waited until they essentially gave up and then called them up. If Vladdy is killing AA/AAA and the Jays are out of it in August/September, then I can see the logic in bringing him up there since he'd be starting 3B in 2019 in that scenario and he could use some reps in the bigs before a full time gig the following year. But now? Way too soon. Maybe waiting until May 2019 to call him up is too long (even though it would benefit the team), but calling him up now seems like a waste. There are more bodies than they know what to do with already, and a MVP candidate playing the position you want Vlad to play everyday.

No way we have a shot without Donaldson. He pretty much has to be the 2015-17 version for the rest of this season for the Jays to have a chance. How many wins does 19 year old Vlad add? If I was sure he'd add 3-4 wins, then sure, bring him up. He's a phenom, so he could come in and immediately wreck s***, but not too many 19 year olds have done that. Chances are he'll be developing in the bigs, and while a developing 19 year old Vlad is likely way better than Morales, is it worth the lost value later? That's the main question. We will be competing for the 2nd WC for many years, but hopefully with a much younger team with a lot more upside. No issues with starting Vlad at 3B in 2019 when JD is gone. But now? Seems like a PR move more than a move that makes baseball sense. When great GM's like Cashman, Epstein, etc, are manipulating the system to gain more service, what makes the Jays situation any different?

How much value is lost if Vlad became a FA after 2024 instead 2025? Or, how much value is gained if he's the DH in 2018 when they could stick a guy like Pearce or Grandy there? Is 19 year old Vlad that much better than those two, and if so, is he so much better that's it's worth losing a year of service time? If the Jays signed him to a ten year contract tomorrow, then call his ass up tomorrow. But if the freakin Yankees are holding their talent back to manipulate service time, then I'd rather not be the "good org" and call him up early. The system is broken and unfair to players, but use it to your advantage. If the Jays were a legit threat to the Yankees or Red Sox right now, then I'd agree with you. BUt the 2nd WC? Damn, release Morales and we could win that s***, without Vlady.

The Yankees actually had a need at 2B and still kept Torres down intentionally so they could get an extra year out of him. The Jays don’t have a 3B hole as long as JD is here, and they clearly intend on playing Morales’ fat declining ass everyday because of the money he is owed so it makes no sense to call Vlad up now. We can win the 2nd WC without him, and the 2nd in itself is not much of an accomplishment. I’d rather have the extra year of Vlad when the team might actually be good enough to really contend.

Morales moved the runner over. That’s why he plays everyday. Vetrin mindset.

I said before I don’t care what his numbers look like I’m always nervous when Tempura is pitching in a close game. Oh should be the set up man.

Call him up for what? To give the team a fighting chance at a 2nd WC? They'd have that same chance without him. Just dump Morales and it will be fine. But 2019? He should be the starting 3b.

Martin mentoring Jansen in 2019 would be a good way to utilize Martin's final season with the Jays (in his current contract). Actually works out pretty well with the catching depth in AAA. Jansen looks like he can be a starting catcher, and McGuire always projected as a backup, so that's 12 years of cheap production right there.

Yeah the Jays are probably exhausted. Try to steal at least one of the next two and get some rest.

Yeah, the way I viewed Jose was "douchebag but he is our douchebag". Can't deny how great he was and the excitement the playoffs runs brought to the city. He'll be remembered very fondly.

Fixed.

Let Santos throw 100 pitches. Don’t care. Game’s over already.

Can it rain now? It’s an official game. Don’t subject us to 4 more innings of this s***.

How was that a knock on Gibbons? I’m saying he won the first game so he should just get this 2nd game over with without injury. Live to fight another day. A split is what we needed. The Indians aren’t the Royals.

Damn I knew Santos would give up some runs but over 2-3 innings. He’s straight trash.

Gibby living to fight another day.

Just let Santos and Ramirez finish this game. Save the rest of the pen. That's why winning the first one was so huge.

Ramirez destroyed that pitch. The Biagini SP experiment doesn't look very good. I know we need Sp depth and all but this guy is a reliever.

DSJ, another player on the 40 man that is already better than Morales.

He’s in the lineup playing 1B for game two. Although releasing Morales would be amazing.

The 2nd WC is going to be up for grabs. No team really has a decided edge over the other between the Jays, Angels, and Mariners, while the Twins are probably ass but can beat up on shittier teams over 50 times this year so can’t rule them out either. The A’s being decent will help the Jays a bit since the West won’t be a cake walk aside from the bloody Rangers. It’s funny in a cruel way that all those teams will be fighting for the chance to play one game on the road against Sale or Severino. Oh well, it’s still the playoffs in the record books.