General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2023)

[Jimcanuck]

Biggio >> JD

[Frenchsoup]

He's a great teammate to look up 2 and he and Votto can lead this team to a championship.

[Frenchsoup]

Biggios is our 2b / Left fielder

[Frenchsoup]

And I would extend Biggio right now, he's so advanced for his age.

[Laika]

And I would extend Biggio right now, he's so advanced for his age.

 

Frenchy I might need to call the orderlies

[G-Snarls]

He wants to come back to Toronto, and Toronto has a gaping hole at 3b and I don't want to play Biggio there even though he can do OK there defensively. But just plug ur gaping hole with a sick veteran and put away your negative feelings toward Donaldson away for a season and Enjoy the f*** out of this guy. If you don't like Josh Donaldson you're a loser.

 

I loved 2015 Donaldson

 

Not sure I'll like 2024 Donaldson

[L54]

They haven't failed until they've failed.

 

At this point the worst you can say is that the team has flopped in the playoffs and the farm system is mediocre at best.

 

It's not like the team has missed the playoffs in consecutive seasons or finished under .500 because their farm is dead. Four winning seasons in a row here... lots of time to position the 2026 roster and beyond for success.

 

Yes I would agree with the worst. It’s fairly mid in my opinion

 

Need better development in order to add vets or supplement the roster. They are prospect poor

[G-Snarls]

He's a great teammate to look up 2 and he and Votto can lead this team to a championship.

 

OK now I'm worried about you man

[L54]

Stop using 7 or 8 years. Shatkins wasn't going to win in 2017-2019 after AA left the team in shambles. AA won the world series with an 88 win team that climbed on the back of Joc Pederson, Jorge Soler, Eddie f***ing Roserio and some pearls. It was half the team that the 2023 team is. AA isn't a genius for winning the WS in 2021, nor is he a bum for only winning 1 playoff game this year and not winning a round. The playoffs are a crapshoot. Good GM's get their teams into the playoffs as often as they can (and obviously with the best team they can). AA is a good GM because he's gotten the Braves to the playoffs 4 straight seasons and there's no sign of their window closing. Atkins was 1 win away from doing the exact same thing and we're in a good position to do it for at least another 2 seasons.

 

Shatkins promised a sustained winner. Making the playoffs 3 the last 4 seasons (after rebuilding the mess AA left) is already good. If we do that another 2 season, will fans appreciate that going to the playoffs in 5 of 6 seasons is a sustained winner? Or will it always be tied to the results in playoffs? If it's the later, I sorry, but I think that's a flawed view.

 

And yes - I do believe AA is a much better GM than Atkins.

 

AA has more playoff wins in a weekend than Shatkins have in 5 years. I’m sure you can understand why one is viewed more favourably than the other

 

Better?

[L54]

And I would extend Biggio right now, he's so advanced for his age.

 

What’s your contract proposal

[Brownie19]

AA has more playoff wins in a weekend than Shatkins have in 5 years. I’m sure you can understand why one is viewed more favourably than the other

 

Better?

 

I literally said that AA is a better GM than Atkins. But 95% of my belief in that statement is due to their success in the regular season and the position he's put that team in to win over the long term. 5% is due to their playoff success. My point is that both are good GM's and that using playoff wins as a major factor in determining the success of the GM is stupid. That's something I firmly believe. I don't think AA's success is tarnished one bit because his 104 win team only won 1 playoff game this year (and even that win was a f***ing miracle). If AA wins 90-100 games and makes the playoffs every year for 4 more seasons - but never wins another playoff game, I'd still consider him to be a great GM. Would you?

[MikeM3]

Donaldson is barely a professional at this point. He'll play 15 games

[Frenchsoup]

What’s your contract proposal

 

6years 60 million

[Frenchsoup]

Donaldson is barely a professional at this point. He'll play 15 games

 

Give me the over

[Jimcanuck]

Best JD can hope for is a minor league deal. He will retire when the realization hits him.

[Frenchsoup]

lol at best he can hope for......lolllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll

[burlingtonbandit]

I think part of the reason why fans are angry with the current FO is the expectations they've had versus the results. They've had decent above average seasons but in addition to no playoff wins they haven't even sniffed a division title either. The payroll is amongst the highest in baseball which adds to those expectations and even though Atkins has done an above average job he is horrible with the media.

 

A big part of being a GM isn't just moves on paper, its communicating with players and being involved in the media. Whenever he talks it comes off as so fake/corporate BS which I think a lot of fans hate. Even just looking at this year between the Anthony Bass/Monoah situations and the end of year presser there was a lot left to be desired of how he handled them.

 

The one thing AA was really good at was speaking to the media, he always came off as sincere. He wouldn't really say much of anything when describing players but he at least had an authentic feel to him.

[L54]

I literally said that AA is a better GM than Atkins. But 95% of my belief in that statement is due to their success in the regular season and the position he's put that team in to win over the long term. 5% is due to their playoff success. My point is that both are good GM's and that using playoff wins as a major factor in determining the success of the GM is stupid. That's something I firmly believe. I don't think AA's success is tarnished one bit because his 104 win team only won 1 playoff game this year (and even that win was a f***ing miracle). If AA wins 90-100 games and makes the playoffs every year for 4 more seasons - but never wins another playoff game, I'd still consider him to be a great GM. Would you?

 

Buddy it’s not stupid when you have zero playoff wins in your entire tenure and you constantly talk about “Bringing a World Series back to Canada”

 

If the Jays had an ALCS and a couple ALDS appearances nobody would be saying s***. Instead they’ve gotten their s*** pushed in each time they limp their way to the playoffs. Then there’s guys like you throwing their hands in the air and saying welp they made the tournament and anything could happen just wasn’t our year gosh darn it keep up the good work Atkins

[L54]

Josh Donaldson sucks now. He would not be a positive influence on the clubhouse. He serves no purpose in Toronto

[G-Snarls]

I think part of the reason why fans are angry with the current FO is the expectations they've had versus the results. They've had decent above average seasons but in addition to no playoff wins they haven't even sniffed a division title either. The payroll is amongst the highest in baseball which adds to those expectations and even though Atkins has done an above average job he is horrible with the media.

 

The one thing AA was really good at was speaking to the media, he always came off as sincere. He wouldn't really say much of anything when describing players but he at least had an authentic feel to him.

 

That really sucks a little extra right now because the Yankees and Red Sox haven't even been good and it's now Baltimore and Tampa ahead of us. Just always feel that someone else is going to be better.

[max silver]

It wasn't only that comment alone... it was that comment after people knew he blasted AA for "emptying" the system for the best success the Jays have had since '93.

 

Shatkins have "emptied" the system and we haven't won a single playoff game in an expanded playoff era but hey... those renovations though lol.

 

Anthopoulos traded 11 minor league players at the 2015 trade deadline, literally purging the system of most of it's better pitching prospects on the way out the door. He nearly completely emptied the cupboard for the group taking over the front office. The Blue Jays under Shapiro have not done anything remotely similar to this type of shopping spree in their time running the ship. This latest trade deadline saw the team move 4 prospects out in trade to bolster the roster. For the most part the correct prospects have been shipped out in trade, with the bulk of these traded players being on the verge of losing their value due to lack of performance or being fringe 40 man roster candidates in a system in need of consolidation due to upcoming offseason roster additions.

[max silver]

That really sucks a little extra right now because the Yankees and Red Sox haven't even been good and it's now Baltimore and Tampa ahead of us. Just always feel that someone else is going to be better.

 

It would be great for once if there wasn't an AL East team with a historic type of start to the first half of the season. Both the Yankees and Rays got off to unbelievably good starts the last few years.

[Spanky99]

Buddy it’s not stupid when you have zero playoff wins in your entire tenure and you constantly talk about “Bringing a World Series back to Canada”

 

If the Jays had an ALCS and a couple ALDS appearances nobody would be saying s***. Instead they’ve gotten their s*** pushed in each time they limp their way to the playoffs. Then there’s guys like you throwing their hands in the air and saying welp they made the tournament and anything could happen just wasn’t our year gosh darn it keep up the good work Atkins

 

You guys are both right... a WS title solves it.

[Jimcanuck]

C'mon y'all. This is a team built around one Vladimir Guerrero Jr. All those free agent pitching signings and payroll increases have been to provide the supporting cast.

 

Overall, the FO has done a good job putting a contender on the field these past few years, but as long as Vlad sucks, the Blue Jays are unlikely to win in the PS.

[Spanky99]

C'mon y'all. This is a team built around one Vladimir Guerrero Jr. All those free agent pitching signings and payroll increases have been to provide the supporting cast.

 

Overall, the FO has done a good job putting a contender on the field these past few years, but as long as Vlad sucks, the Blue Jays are unlikely to win in the PS.

 

In a nutshell, yes. lol

[Jimcanuck]

Lot of pressure on Vlad, to be sure. And part of his issue is he tries to do too much. He had a great eye when he came up, now he's increasingly swinging at bait. Mentally he's been a little messed up. IMO.

[Spanky99]

We need 21'

[Spanky99]

See...

[L54]

See what?

[Spanky99]

See what?

 

Hype yo!