Trade Assets

[BigBounceyBlueBalls]

I believe MLB looks at every transaction involving cash.

 

That sounds fair but have they any set percentage where they say hell no! Or have they ever said no to such a deal because the money was to much?

[Angrioter]

I'm down with the first 2, we'd likely be the same quality team if we did but with smaller payroll. But who plays short if Reyes is gone, Goins?

 

Definitely down with the first two, but not Reyes if the plan is then two guys who can't hit in the MIF

 

If you get young good MIF back in the deal, then fine

 

Reyes doesn't guarantee 130 games per season. Every time Reyes runs the bases I close my eyes.

 

Franklin + Miller + Walker + Gabriel Guerrero + D for Reyes + Buehrle + Rasmus

[ElNik2013]

This team isn't going to give up on the season in May. I also doubt the team is so bad by July that they give up then so I think this is pointless, at least at this point.

 

 

A new GM needs to be brought in. AA failed to improve the team in the off season even though he probably knows where the holes are. It seems he's too afraid of getting killed in another trade. A new GM could come in and quickly address 2B and improve the bench. He could also make decisions on the long relievers and get on with it.

[ElNik2013]

Reyes doesn't guarantee 130 games per season. Every time Reyes runs the bases I close my eyes.

 

Franklin + Miller + Walker + Gabriel Guerrero + D for Reyes + Buehrle + Rasmus

 

 

LOL. Nice imagination. How much added salary would that be? $45M? No way the Mariners would take on that much salary.

[GeorgiaPeach]

Reyes doesn't guarantee 130 games per season. Every time Reyes runs the bases I close my eyes.

 

Franklin + Miller + Walker + Gabriel Guerrero + D for Reyes + Buehrle + Rasmus

 

Mariners have 40m+ of financial breathing room?

[John_Havok]

This team isn't going to give up on the season in May. I also doubt the team is so bad by July that they give up then so I think this is pointless, at least at this point.

 

 

A new GM needs to be brought in. AA failed to improve the team in the off season even though he probably knows where the holes are. It seems he's too afraid of getting killed in another trade. A new GM could come in and quickly address 2B and improve the bench. He could also make decisions on the long relievers and get on with it.

 

He should be worried about getting killed in a trade, since that's exactly what's happened on almost every one of his trades starting with Napoli.

 

There's been a couple of shrewd moves, like the trade for Olivo to get the comp pick under the old system, and the Lincoln deal last year, but nearly every other trade since the Napoli deal have been full derp.

[GeorgiaPeach]

This team isn't going to give up on the season in May. I also doubt the team is so bad by July that they give up then so I think this is pointless, at least at this point.

 

Sadly I think you're correct. There isn't a vision for the future, everything is about the now.

[ElNik2013]

He should be worried about getting killed in a trade, since that's exactly what's happened on almost every one of his trades starting with Napoli.

 

There's been a couple of shrewd moves, like the trade for Olivo to get the comp pick under the old system, and the Lincoln deal last year, but nearly every other trade since the Napoli deal have been full derp.

 

 

It is what it is. A new GM could come in and see things clearly. Even if the organization doesn't want to give up on the season, a new GM could make a couple of moves to improve the team without mortgaging much of the future.

[ElNik2013]

Sadly I think you're correct. There isn't a vision for the future, everything is about the now.

 

 

There was a vision for the future until there wasn't, for whatever reason. The Broken 3-Year Window Fallacy is being proven once again.

[xposbrad]

I think AA and Co. are still in denial this team needs to be rebuilt. Sure we have some good pieces, but we're at the payroll max and considering what we're getting in terms of results on the field. I think it's safe to say this is not a competitive team that is going to compete this year. Now, you can always balance trading off smaller pieces while maintaining your core, but this core is getting old and there are a lot of overpaid players on this team. I'm not sure what strategy AA will take at the deadline. EE/JB obviously have high trade value, and Melky does too considering his hot start, he's young, and some teams might want the inside track on resigning him. But, there's very little value outside of those guys, and I'm not sure if this team is going to trade the face of the franchise just yet even though it's not working.

[ElNik2013]

I think AA and Co. are still in denial this team needs to be rebuilt. Sure we have some good pieces, but we're at the payroll max and considering what we're getting in terms of results on the field. I think it's safe to say this is not a competitive team that is going to compete this year. Now, you can always balance trading off smaller pieces while maintaining your core, but this core is getting old and there are a lot of overpaid players on this team. I'm not sure what strategy AA will take at the deadline. EE/JB obviously have high trade value, and Melky does too considering his hot start, he's young, and some teams might want the inside track on resigning him. But, there's very little value outside of those guys, and I'm not sure if this team is going to trade the face of the franchise just yet even though it's not working.

 

 

If they're at the payroll max, where did AA get the $14M to offer Santana and why couldn't he trade Happ, Santos and/or Janssen to clear payroll like the O's did with Jim Johnson?

 

The team could be improved without adding a ton of salary, AA's just doesn't use the FA market.

[IBTrini]

As much as I prefer winning, a proper rebuild can be interesting to watch in it's own way. For me and .001% of fans.

A part of me would like to see what this team can do however there comes a time when you need to bite the bullet and make a decision to do what is best for the club long-term. The jays have enough interesting pieces to deal which can/will generate interest around the trade deadline and in the off-season.

 

Hope is an expensive commodity to live alone on so hopefully something will happen in the coming months. The rebuild most probably won't have an immediate impact but it can become very interesting to follow the development of a new, young team. The rebuild also needs to include, at a minimum, the coaching staff and then the manager and other FO personnel.

[IBTrini]

No, no and no. It's too tight an AL East to even considering trading anybody. Much of the division is struggling, not just the Jays.

Baseball can mean many different things to people however the bottom line is economics - It's a business. Sentiments and feel-good stories can play a part however opportunities/situational conditions must be examined closely and acted upon in a timely manner.

 

Procrastination, or not forcing another team to make a decision, can result in a lost opportunity. Case in point, Santana - whereby another team was allowed to become a player cause feet were being dragged on account of a few extra dollars. When the opportunity rears its head you have to strike before anyone else - this means you must have preconceived plans (Plan A, plan B, plan C... etc) and be ready to change directions as new information (this team is just not ready for prime time) becomes available. You must also have good scouts to know what is worth going after.

[GeorgiaPeach]

Baseball can mean many different things to people however the bottom line is economics - It's a business. Sentiments and feel-good stories can play a part however opportunities/situational conditions must be examined closely and acted upon in a timely manner.

 

Procrastination, or not forcing another team to make a decision, can result in a lost opportunity. Case in point, Santana - whereby another team was allowed to become a player cause feet were being dragged on account of a few extra dollars. When the opportunity rears its head you have to strike before anyone else - this means you must have preconceived plans (Plan A, plan B, plan C... etc) and be ready to change directions as new information (this team is just not ready for prime time) becomes available. You must also have good scouts to know what is worth going after.

 

If Kris Medlen didn't get hurt Santana would've been a Blue Jay.

[BigBounceyBlueBalls]

Reyes doesn't guarantee 130 games per season. Every time Reyes runs the bases I close my eyes.

 

Franklin + Miller + Walker + Gabriel Guerrero + D for Reyes + Buehrle + Rasmus

 

If we are talking trade with seattle I am going Bautista,Lind and Happ to get the ball rolling! Return of Walker+Franklin+Romero+Pike and one of Marte or Taylor .

 

If they ask about Reyes to be added to the deal ask for both Marte and Taylor and add Gohara to the trade as well.

 

If money becomes a issue offer to take Corey Hart saving them 6 mil and because it makes me giggle!

 

If no changes made to the deal as is I would be willing to add money up to 16.4 million which would only add about 20 mill to their payroll.

 

Because I am nice they can have any two bullpen arms, but no extra money!

Edited May 3, 2014 by BigBounceyBlueBalls

[Daniel Labude]

In about a month or two......trading bautista or edwin should be a real possibility. Trading just one may give us the chance to retool for next season.

[IBTrini]

What do the "FANS" have to do with the FO, seriously? Sure, there's a shitload of casuals, but fans really have no say in what a FO or ownership decide to do. They f***ed up, but it's highly unlikely they let this regime tear it down. I think this thread is moronic, to be honest, it makes no sense.

Drinking much today? Your statements seem to be contradictory.

 

 

Anyway, I think what he was getting at was the attitude of fans and if so, he was dead on. Sentimentality should not outweigh good business sense.

 

It's true that fans do not really have a direct say on what happens to the make-up of the team but to suggest they have zero impact is too narrow-minded - Without fans there most probably will be no team. Making an absolute statement as in "fans have no say" is not true - There was also a case where fans reactions interfered with a move - Lincecum? Also, remember a recent story about Donald Sterling's (Los Angeles Clippers owner) and the backlash caused by public outlash?

 

With that said, getting fans to unite at that level over the make-up of a team is most probably not going to happen in Canada.

[IBTrini]

If Kris Medlen didn't get hurt Santana would've been a Blue Jay.

The same could be said of Anthopoulos being a bit more assertive (not giving them so much time to decide) and a little more open with the purse-strings (a few extra dollars/incentives) maybe Santana would have been a Jay.

 

Since we are speculating let's also say that if Medlen was not injured maybe another NL team might have had a SP injury and Santana would have ended up there as well since that league seemed to be to his liking. What I was getting at was putting pressure on them as opopsed to just waiting on them to take as long as they wanted with a decision. The feet-dragging scenario opened up an outside opportunity that was not there originally. Not sure if I am getting the point across though.

[John_Havok]

The same could be said of Anthopoulos being a bit more assertive (not giving them so much time to decide) and a little more open with the purse-strings (a few extra dollars/incentives) maybe Santana would have been a Jay.

 

Since we are speculating let's also say that if Medlen was not injured maybe another NL team might have had a SP injury and Santana would have ended up there as well since that league seemed to be to his liking. What I was getting at was putting pressure on them as opopsed to just waiting on them to take as long as they wanted with a decision. The feet-dragging scenario opened up an outside opportunity that was not there originally. Not sure if I am getting the point across though.

 

It's not quite that simple. From all reports, Santana had already agreed to sign with the Jays and was practically at the airport to go take his physical when Medlen got hurt and the Braves jumped in and offered basically the same deal that he immediately jumped at and left the Jays hanging.

 

It tells me Santana had literally no other offers except for the Jays and he really didn't want to be there.

[IBTrini]

It's not quite that simple. From all reports, Santana had already agreed to sign with the Jays and was practically at the airport to go take his physical when Medlen got hurt and the Braves jumped in and offered basically the same deal that he immediately jumped at and left the Jays hanging.

 

It tells me Santana had literally no other offers except for the Jays and he really didn't want to be there.

 

Without rehashing my point which I believe you either missed or did not understand, in my opinion Anthopoulos left the offer window opened too long. Anthopoulos was playing the waiting out game. From my perspective he was trying to show he was not in a desperate situation and as such was not forceful enough with the other side as far as making a decision. Anthopoulos thought he had time on his side but Medlen's injury quickly change the landscape in a blink of an eye.

[ElNik2013]

Without rehashing my point which I believe you either missed or did not understand, in my opinion Anthopoulos left the offer window opened too long. Anthopoulos was playing the waiting out game. From my perspective he was trying to show he was not in a desperate situation and as such was not forceful enough with the other side as far as making a decision. Anthopoulos thought he had time on his side but Medlen's injury quickly change the landscape in a blink of an eye.

 

 

I get what you're saying, but remember, Santana only lowered his demands to a 1-year deal a few days before he signed with the Braves.

 

I do agree AA got too cute and ended up with only Santana as an option. He could've gone after Capuano for example.

[John_Havok]

Without rehashing my point which I believe you either missed or did not understand, in my opinion Anthopoulos left the offer window opened too long. Anthopoulos was playing the waiting out game. From my perspective he was trying to show he was not in a desperate situation and as such was not forceful enough with the other side as far as making a decision. Anthopoulos thought he had time on his side but Medlen's injury quickly change the landscape in a blink of an eye.

 

I see what you're saying, but that was AA's intent the entire time to keep waiting and waiting. When you play the waiting game with FAs, you can't tell them they only have a short time to sign after the offer when you've waited the entire offseason to even make an offer. It holds no weight.

[IBTrini]

What's contradictory about that? They (as in ownership) wouldn't allow the FO to tear it down. If those measures were taken, (a rebuild) it wouldn't be done with the current regime.

 

Where did I say that fans have zero impact??? The fans don't have a say in final decisions, to say so is ludicrous! The Lincecum trade was leaked by both parties, in which Sabean got cold feet, that was all rumours by the way, two very different animals you're speaking of, none of that was fact, all conjecture by sports beat writers and fans alike.

 

Also, WTF does Sterling and the Clippers have to do with this, drinking too much wine today Father Ibitrini?

 

Seems I misinterpreted the "they".

 

"The fans don't have a say in final decisions... Sabean got cold feet"

I guess I must have misunderstood the whole scenario surrounding Lincecum and that particular move cuz I was under the impression it was going to happen until there was an uproar by the fan base. Generally speaking fans do not have a say in final decisions but to say "never" is not correct. Situations (extreme) can come up whereby the backlash from fans can impact such a decision. If you cannot see what I am getting at then let's just give it a rest.

 

The "drinking" comment arose from my misinterpretation of your comment which I already mentioned - one one hand it came across as if you were saying fans do not have any impact and in the next sentence it seems like you were saying the opposite. With respect to "Sterling and the Clippers" it was supposed to draw attention to a fan-base backlash and repercussions for doing nonsense (believing you can do nothing wrong with impunity).

[GeorgiaPeach]

I have no qualms if they receive good value in return, I'm just saying the fans have no say on the FO's decisions, or I would hope not, lol.

 

I don't think I said fans had a say.

 

I don't see ownership allowing Beeston/AA be a part of any type of re-tooling, they're lying in their bed, so to speak now. As for next fall, that's an entirely different scenario, as I don't see them hanging around if they don't see any type of contention.

 

Lame duck President & GM for 1+ years, that's not good.

[GeorgiaPeach]

What's contradictory about that? They (as in ownership) wouldn't allow the FO to tear it down. If those measures were taken, (a rebuild) it wouldn't be done with the current regime.

 

I can't see Rogers allowing much more spending, so what you're saying is the Jays won't be able to make a trade until Beeston & Alex are gone? Highly unlikely.

[Cooler Heads Prevail]

With the bullpen/starters flushing this season down the toilet its time to think about blowing this team up. We have some pieces that might be valuable to other teams.

 

Starting Rotation:

 

Dickey - Needs a run of good starts but might have value come deadline.

Beuhrle - Value probably as high as it can get, should trade him and his big ticket asap before he comes down to earth and avoid paying most of his big contract.

Morrow - No value right now, might as well keep throwing him out there and see if he can put it together.

McGowan - Same as Morrow, lets see what we got here.

Hutchison - Keeper

 

Stroman and Nolin ready to step in this year.

 

Bullpen:

 

Santos - Has kiilled his value

Janssen - If he can get healthy by the deadline should be traded for whatever

Everyone else - Cheap and controllable for years so might as well keep

 

1b - EE - should have huge value, trade

2b -

SS - Reyes - hopefully starts hitting well and can be traded at the deadline.

3b - Lawrie - Keeper

LF - Cabrera - trade or resign

CF - Rasmus - trade at deadline

RF - Joey Bats - should have huge value, trade

C - meh

 

Bench:

Lind - Get him healthy and trade

Fransico - Let him play fulltime keep mashing the ball

Everyone else - meh

 

Target: positional hitting prospects that are MLB ready for close

 

According to this poster, as of May 2nd our season was flushed down the toilet and we needed to blow this team up.

[Cooler Heads Prevail]

Can we stop bumping old threads? That's the 2nd one in a few minutes by CHP.

 

You don't want to start up some fresh discussions on how we should blow up this team by the deadline ? Those threads were all the rage earlier this year, some of the die hard cynics wrote this team off mere weeks ago ( only the odd person now still doing so ).

[Boxcar]

You don't want to start up some fresh discussions on how we should blow up this team by the deadline ? Those threads were all the rage earlier this year, some of the die hard cynics wrote this team off mere weeks ago ( only the odd person now still doing so ).

 

You are a bitter old man. I guess enjoying the Jays winning just isn't enough for you, you have to go back in time and punish any doubters. Childish.

[Cooler Heads Prevail]

You are a bitter old man. I guess enjoying the Jays winning just isn't enough for you, you have to go back in time and punish any doubters. Childish.

 

Buddy, you define bitter, have you read your posts ? Childish ? Come on now, you post garbage about how nothing prior to year 2000 means anything at all. You basically just react to others and rarely post any actual content. This is the funny thing about this site, a lot of aggressive rude young guys who run with topics until the moment when reality interferes with their overdone theories. Delighted to have presented a contrary opinion. Thanks for your input, sir !!!

[GD]

The spaces between the punctuation...

 

kgm troll account?