glory

It's scary to think what Roark's 2021 salary alone could get in this winter's FA market. Hindsight sucks some times.

That's my take on this. The White Sox were a fun team to follow with all their young talent, and they are not afraid to show personality on the field. If TLR just sits back and allows them to be them, then the difference between him and Renteria will probably be negligible, but if he wants them to "pLaY tHe rIgHt wAy", then it's going to be bad for everyone involved.

Apparently, Reinsdorf’s biggest regret was firing TLR.....34 years ago. This was not a baseball decision, it was an owner putting his own needs over the team.

The top end free agents might be better off going the rumored Bauer route and either accept the QO or sign the best one year deal they can get. Take your chances next winter. I think the very top guys will still get their money but the mid and low end are going to get screwed big time. Good time to be a buyer so at least the Jays are beyond the tanking days and trying to upgrade the roster. Good to very good players will be readily available.

Indians trying to save $1m. Tough times. I’d be shocked if they don’t end up trading Lindor.

Man, there's going to be a ton of free agents this year.

Yeah I can't see the Jays being able to lure DJL or Turner away from teams like the Yankees and Dodgers. I don't think the Jays would move Bichette off SS unless it was for a real difference maker, so unless they pull off a Lindor deal, I think we will probably end up seeing a short term 3B option (hopefully not Shaw).

Turner didn't test positive twice. According to Passan, he tested inconclusive on Monday, which MLB apparently found out during the 2nd inning of last night's game, and then the samples from Tuesday arrived which showed a positive (which is why he was pulled during the game). Why it took so long for Monday's result to come, much less yesterday's, is the question. I wouldn't rule out a false positive especially since they were in a bubble with family already there, so seems like a low(er) risk situation unless he and/or his family left the bubble for some reason and brought it back, or if they got too close to some of the fans in attendance. If the positive is legit, then any potential spread likely would have happened even if he left the stadium and went back to the hotel to quarantine after the 7th inning. He was with his teammates all day, for many weeks, and played more than half the game already. He definitely shouldn't have gone back out though. Should have left and quarantined immediately after MLB pulled him out of the game. Bad look for him and the Dodgers (and MLB too, for the timing of the test results).

The Moneyball A’s as far as I remember still had traditional roles. A big part of their run was the rotation (Hudson, Mulder, Zito, etc). They just used analytics to find undervalued players, specifically on offence. I wouldn’t group them in with the current Rays. I don’t think Moneyball changed the way players were used, just the way they were evaluated. The Rays are going to change baseball long term with their player usage. I guess as long as salaries account for that change then I won’t complain about it, but will have to see it to believe it. Edit: Just noticed you said “decade prior”, so 2010’s. I don’t remember what the A’s were doing then so might be off.

I hope you’re right because that’s the future of SPs in the sport.

After a brief skimming of BBRef, since Cash took over, I see Logan Forysthe as a player who came to the Rays, turned himself around, and got a moderate contract because of it. Who am I missing? I'm sure there are some RP's (didn't look), but you're overselling their ability to help players financially (at least more than the players could have done otherwise). Other than extending Kiermaier, it's not a long list. If openers, 2 times through the order SPs, platoon OF's/1B, etc, start getting paid because of the Rays, then I'll retract. Ex player (not the poster) tweets that Cash is wrong for taking an ace out after 60 pitches when throwing a shutout. Posters say ex player is stupid because nUmBeRs. Yes, "nerds" fits. We can laugh when a trashbag like Roark complains about being pulled too early, but a lot of SP's are going to feel that way. If you want to say it's not a big deal or the player is wrong, then fine. I think people do overreact when players (like Snell) get mad for being pulled, but that's how most high level athletes think. That's why Brad Zeigler tweeted that. They don't think "well I'm doing great, but the analytics say I shouldn't face this dude". If I even have to explain that, then not sure what we're arguing. Just because Morton bought in, doesn't mean other players won't feel a certain way about it. Also, if we're posting on message boards, chances are we fizzled out somewhere between middle school and college, and I'm including myself in that. We're all nerds. You guys are just much bigger nerds for not being able to see things from an athlete's perspective, whether due to not ever touching a field in your lives or being far too deep into your obsessions with analytics. And again, I never said the current Rays don't buy in, I'm saying players in general are going to have mixed feelings on it. You guys are rooting for a team that suppresses salaries, underpays talent, etc, but then will pretend to side with the MLBPA when it comes to players deserving more money. Keep that same cheap energy in all facets of baseball.

Sure platoons, openers, 2nd time through the order, etc, likely maximizes productivity, but in this case, Cash removed a top of the rotation starter who was throwing a shutout on 60 pitches. That type of s*** is not something players on the outside are going to applaud.

How many of those players go on to get big contracts/money, from the Rays (lol) or someone else? I know you nerds have never seen a baseball field in your lives but starters want to go deep into games when they are rolling. Hitters want to play everyday. The Rays don’t do anything that normal athletes would find appealing. Hence why a baseball player would feel that way about Cash in BTS’s post.

Is there anything the Rays do as an org that is beneficial to players and/or anything you think players on the outside would find redeeming?

That's fine, but we were discussing AA, a topic that wasn't talked about before, so I was confused why you thought I was repeating anything. I mean, I'm sure I'll be complaining again if at least one of LA/HOU don't advance, but AA slander is a separate topic. You'll be on my side when the Braves advance and all you see on Jays social media is Shatkins hate.

I actually think Acuna's contract was the biggest ripoff of the two. If his two options are picked up in '27-28, he'll make $68 million in what would have been his first four free agent years. So instead of being a free agent after his age 26 season and possibly looking at $200-300 million (depending on what the market looks like by then), he'll have to wait until he's 31 to get on the open market for the first time. I'm torn between giving props to AA and feeling bad for the players. But yes, smooth move by Alex either way.

Rich, cocky douchebag with a hot wife. He fits that criteria, I would think.

Considering I haven't mentioned AA in any post in probably years before this series, and it was barely a mention at all (just that I didn't want to root for his team), I think you might have started the sauce a little early tonight. But yes, the Rays and Braves is the worst possible World Series for baseball. If it annoys you, then it's worth repeating.

Yeah not saying he's been bad, but he walked into a pretty difficult situation to mess up, so the AA boot licking by a segment of Jays fans is going to be pretty annoying if (likely when) the Braves make the WS.

I can't wait to read all the comments from Jays fans attributing the Braves success to AA. That one year deal to Ozuna and then inheriting everyone else was definitely a sign of genius. Time for the Dodgers to reel off 3 straight.

The 2019 World Series went 7 games. It started on October 22 and ended on October 30. So 7 games in 9 days. That's how it has always been for a 7 game series. The 5 game series that goes 5 games would take 7 days to finish. Baseball has always been pretty good with minimizing off days. It's usually just a day for travel. You might be thinking of the NBA which takes 7 months to get past the first round (at least it feels that way).

Ugh just the thought of that World Series irritates me. The Dodgers are my only hope. Time for them to run off 4 wins in a row and save the 2020 WS.

Hopefully the Braves woke up a sleeping giant in the 9th inning last night.

The Hendriks trade was somewhat defensible at the time since the team essentially had a one year window (2016) and no SP depth at all at the time the trade was made. Plus as mentioned Gibbons didn't seem to like him or use him in big spots. Chavez looked like a solid back end starter in Oakland. Obviously in hindsight the Jays had no need for even a 6th-7th starter that year due to amazingly good health, and Chavez was trash in the pen. Not a good trade, but it wasn't without some reasonable logic at the time. Just didn't work out. In some ways, it's better it didn't work out. I'd rather have had perfect SP health in 2016 like they ultimately had rather than needing Chavez to start 10-15 games.